CAE Oxford vs. Transpac

[brocklee9000]

That and teaching Pathway blows, if you want to build time you do it teaching instrument to Chinese guys in the old 6 pack Archers. The more you "move up" in the company to the nicer planes and higher positions (like training manager) the less you will fly. If you get your MEI to try to go Pathway they'll put you in commercial and you'll be in the sim half the time instead of flying. The only way you get 100 hours a month here is to stay on the front lines in the stack every night until 3 am teaching IR. Everything else will get you an average of 50 a month or less.

Yep. A friend of mine only has PPL students and is averaging 50 a month. Another friend of mine moved up to one of those management positions you mentioned, and is getting a lot more money but maybe...20 hours a month. IR flies a ton and I was anticipating working at AG to rack up those hours, but I ended up taking a job across the parking lot due to various circumstances. IR at Westwind is like the complete opposite. lots of ground and sims. I'm getting a lot of hours on my paystub (billable hours) and the pay is pretty good, and in the last month I've gotten approx. 45-50 hours with only IR students. So I'm getting hours on par with my friend with PPL students and coming out much farther ahead in terms of pay. And we do IR all in G1000, so that's pretty nice. But I do get a bit envious when I see those Archers flying all night long haha.

 

[tcco94]

Sounds like it's much of the same as 2 years ago. I had a good routine.

Fly out to the stack, 3 approaches. Land, swap, 2 approaches, one into DVT. Everything completed. Eat dinner. Do it again. Go home, play xbox for an hour. Go to bed at 3am. Cycle and repeat 5x a week for about 5 months. Was logging 110-120/month. Flew a Cessna with my buddy to time build on my day off 6-7 hours. It was a grind for sure. Got out of TPac fast though and got a seniority number. Now I enjoy my days off and travel here at a much higher pay.

Not everyone wants to do the boring grind. I get it. I just had the philosophy get out ASAP and get seniority. Then kick your feet up a bit. Those who enjoyed their CFI lives spent 6-12 months longer at TPac did it at the cost of seniority later on. Same goes for those who ventured into the corporate life. Only to come to the regionals later on. Whatever suits you. I suggest doing the stack at 1-2am. Easy flow, nice calm nights. Sometimes I miss it. That freedom was nice, and the nights with a full moon at 85 degrees were perfect.

 

[Counselor]

Sounds like it's much of the same as 2 years ago. I had a good routine.

Fly out to the stack, 3 approaches. Land, swap, 2 approaches, one into DVT. Everything completed. Eat dinner. Do it again. Go home, play xbox for an hour. Go to bed at 3am. Cycle and repeat 5x a week for about 5 months. Was logging 110-120/month. Flew a Cessna with my buddy to time build on my day off 6-7 hours. It was a grind for sure. Got out of TPac fast though and got a seniority number. Now I enjoy my days off and travel here at a much higher pay.

Not everyone wants to do the boring grind. I get it. I just had the philosophy get out ASAP and get seniority. Then kick your feet up a bit. Those who enjoyed their CFI lives spent 6-12 months longer at TPac did it at the cost of seniority later on. Same goes for those who ventured into the corporate life. Only to come to the regionals later on. Whatever suits you. I suggest doing the stack at 1-2am. Easy flow, nice calm nights. Sometimes I miss it. That freedom was nice, and the nights with a full moon at 85 degrees were perfect.

What time did you start? How about in the fall, winter, and spring when Phoenix weather is wonderful?

 

[tcco94]

What time did you start? How about in the fall, winter, and spring when Phoenix weather is wonderful?

I started in October 15, did PPL and started instrument in April-May until November. Summer wasn't so bad for me because I started at like 3-4 pm. Although I'd get a lot of no AC aircraft. But that's better than pattern work at noon in the summer.

 

[coks]

What time did you start? How about in the fall, winter, and spring when Phoenix weather is wonderful?

I also started in the fall, it all depends what they have you teach. Instrument flying is done late afternoon into the night, I was getting done 10pm-2am. Private pilot starts early morning and wraps up noonish. During the nicer months, November-April, they aren't concerned about the heat and you will fly at all times, its during the summer they have you avoid the peak heat times and you fly the early/late hours.

 

[Counselor]

I started in October 15, did PPL and started instrument in April-May until November. Summer wasn't so bad for me because I started at like 3-4 pm. Although I'd get a lot of no AC aircraft. But that's better than pattern work at noon in the summer.

Thanks. Do the Aeroguard instructors without MEI just do their CMEL add-on there at the school when they have the hours to go 121?

 

[tcco94]

Thanks. Do the Aeroguard instructors without MEI just do their CMEL add-on there at the school when they have the hours to go 121?

Most instructors already have a CMEL. I needed 10 more hours multi. I found another instructor and we rented a multi in Glendale and time built 10 hours on that.

 

[coks]

Thanks. Do the Aeroguard instructors without MEI just do their CMEL add-on there at the school when they have the hours to go 121?

Aeroguard doesn't offer to do a CMEL add on, just an MEI. There is guy out at DVT who owns a twin commanche and pretty much everyone I know of, including myself, went through him for the CMEL. Highly recommend:
https://www.multienginetimebuilding.com

 

[Counselor]

Aeroguard doesn't offer to do a CMEL add on, just an MEI. There is guy out at DVT who owns a twin commanche and pretty much everyone I know of, including myself, went through him for the CMEL. Highly recommend:
https://www.multienginetimebuilding.com

Thanks guys.

 

[HumbleSiPilot77]

Just got a call to schedule an interview with AeroGuard, but I started a different thread since my flight experience is a bit different than the usual rest so I would appreciate you guys’ input from legacy TP/new AeroGuard.

 

[Counselor]

Most instructors already have a CMEL. I needed 10 more hours multi. I found another instructor and we rented a multi in Glendale and time built 10 hours on that.

A couple more questions if you don’t mind. What were/are the age ranges of the Aeroguard instructors -any older instructors? Also, do CFI’s who finish their 1500 at a larger flight academy fare better during 121 training than CFI’s from Mom and Pop shops, or is there no association? Thx again

 

[HumbleSiPilot77]

A couple more questions if you don’t mind. What were/are the age ranges of the Aeroguard instructors -any older instructors?

Would you prefer older instructors? LOL if I end up in AeroGuard I’ll be 41 this summer. However, I know 20 year olds with mad flying skills and knowledge. Professionalism is an individual effort as you know and age in our industry doesn’t matter much.

Also, do CFI’s who finish their 1500 at a larger flight academy fare better during 121 training than CFI’s from Mom and Pop shops, or is there no association? Thx again

I don’t think there’s a direct association. It’s all about what you get exposed to and get yourself exposed to. If you were flying for a mom and pop shop, you are still a flight instructor and you still have to train your students to standard, and you’ll prepare for the 121 job like the rest of us. Maybe the difference could be the workshops like AeroGuard offers. Westwind and CAE have paired with American and AeroGuard with SkyWest.




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[kryan11]

A couple more questions if you don’t mind. What were/are the age ranges of the Aeroguard instructors -any older instructors? Also, do CFI’s who finish their 1500 at a larger flight academy fare better during 121 training than CFI’s from Mom and Pop shops, or is there no association? Thx again

There are older instructors at AeroGuard. Age isn't an issue as long as you can handle 8 hours in an airplane during a hot summer day. Based on my experience at AeroGuard, a larger academy will prepare you much better for 121. Everything is extremely procedural based, much more efficient, and is set up to operate like an airline.

 

[tcco94]

A couple more questions if you don’t mind. What were/are the age ranges of the Aeroguard instructors -any older instructors? Also, do CFI’s who finish their 1500 at a larger flight academy fare better during 121 training than CFI’s from Mom and Pop shops, or is there no association? Thx again

I'd have to agree with @kryan11. If you aren't use to SOP/callouts/flows/procedure flying, it will help you learn how to study better when you do get to 121 world. If you don't have that training it's not like you can't get through 121 training. A lot of people do, but in my class I noticed some of the weaker people lacked having any of that training prior. So they didn't know how to study essentially is what it came down to.

Also, wouldn't worry about age. I had colleagues who were in their 50+ range and some my age that were young. It was a good mix.

 

[HumbleSiPilot77]

If you aren't used to SOP/callouts/flows/procedure flying, it will help you learn how to study better when you do get to 121 world.

I never knew general aviation flight schools did this. I’m ATP trained so I know they don’t do callouts and flows. Luckily my degree capstone was about 20 hours in the CRJ200 level 5 sim




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[SuperOneFiddy]

I never knew general aviation flight schools did this. I’m ATP trained so I know they don’t do callouts and flows. Luckily my degree capstone was about 20 hours in the CRJ200 level 5 sim




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Yeah AG is very strict about callouts and SOPs. Flows not so much - they do exist and you’re expected to learn them but the flow and checklist are identical here so if you just run the checklist they don’t really care.

 

[HumbleSiPilot77]

I like that!


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[salhnl]

Here's the basic rundown for each company:

TransPac:
- $5,000 signing bonus on first paycheck
- $3,000 relocation assistance on first paycheck
- 3 weeks housing during indoc for $200 ($100 of this is refundable)
- Indoc lasts 3 weeks and you are paid during that time
- $28,000 initial salary which goes up after 9 months (goes up more if you get your CFII which they pay for)
- $7,500 bonus after 1 year of employment
- $11,000 bonus after being hired by SkyWest
- 50 hour work weeks
- Not so great safety record
- Old planes

CAE:
- The job advertisement states there is a $5,000 - $10,000 signing bonus but there are rumors that this is not actually being offered to new hires.
- $2,000 relocation assistance with 3-6 weeks free housing
- $27,000 starting salary, $30k with CFII, $32k with MEI. Goes up to $39-40k once you go to the EASA program
- Free CFII AND free MEI with no contract
- $2,000 bonus after 500 dual given and 25 students signed off
- Free ATP with one year contract
- Average 50 hour work weeks
- No accidents within the last 12 years
- Brand spanking new Piper Archers with G1000s (but also DA20s with no A/C)

I am not employed by either company so I don't have any firsthand experience but this is what I have heard.

I know it's been over two years since this, but is there anyone with current information? I'm looking at CAE, their new advertisement says:

Why Fly with CAE Aviation Academy?
· Average of 80 – 100 hours of flight time per month
· We pay for upgrades!
· Retention Bonuses! $5,000 (50% after 90 days the remaining 50% after 1 year)
· $2,000 of Relocation Assistance
· Competitive Annual Salary + incentives
· Benefits Eligible – Medical, Dental, Vision, Life Insurance, 401k Employer Match!
· 2 weeks of Vacation per year and 6 days of additional paid time off
· Aircraft Fleet consists of: Piper (Archer and Seminole), Diamond (DA20, DA40, & DA42), all G1000 equipped.
· Our ONSITE REPAIR FACILITY means you never have to worry about having a plane available. Our team operates 21 hours per day, making
sure our fleet is in top working order.
· Our planes have Air Conditioning! Those hot summer days aren't a problem when you're in one of our Pipers. We keep our A/C equipped
planes blowing cold to keep you comfortable!
-----------------
No mention on pay?? Is it still as low as $27,000 starting salary??? If anyone has new information wound appreciate it!

 

[kryan11]

Our planes have Air Conditioning! Those hot summer days aren't a problem when you're in one of our Pipers. We keep our A/C equipped
planes blowing cold to keep you comfortable!

I don't know anything new about them, but laughed at the way they worded this. I heard you want to stay far away from the Diamond in the summer time. No AC and that bubble canopy.