C310R tips??
- Thread starter jskibo
- Start date
SurferLucas
Southern Gentleman
I've not flown the R model, but I have an N model...310's can be a handful single engine, so be on top of the rudder control...split flaps take some getting used to, you'll put the first 15 or so deg of flaps in and she'll balloon up. Keep a little power on in the landing or she'll fall out of the sky.
310's are fun airplane's, enjoy it.
310's are fun airplane's, enjoy it.
Don't think of them as power levers. Think of them as VMC levers. If you ever get so slow in a twin that you lose it, the first thing to do is lower VMC speed. Is rather crash it in that ride it in. I've always thought about it, and the first thing I'd do it I ever lost it in a twin is chop the power and lower the nose, accept the altitude loss, and try and get some power back in it and airspeed back.
ChristheCFII
Well-Known Member
It's a nice little sports car of an airplane. Definitely not as forgiving as a Seminole or Seneca, but nothing to be afraid of. My time is in earlier models (not R), but the panel seems rather jumbled, making it hard to find gauges, switches, etc. I'd sit in the cockpit before your checkout and get a feel for where everything is.
ahw01
Well-Known Member
Flew the 310 at american flyers, it's a great aircraft. Compared to the Seminole, plenty of power and more complicated systems. The engines need careful management, so that the fuel pumps are on immediately after start, there's a two handed method of cranking the starter and priming/flipping the pump on.
The constant metering of fuel, and the return valve which can piss fuel out of the tip tank overflow valve if you're not careful, along with the circulating pumps which push the fuel from one part of the tip tank towards the fuel line, is a band aid on a poor design.
The emergency gear extension handle is directly connected to the gear so the handle can fly up once the gear is unlocked and it free falls. You re meant to keep your hand on it firmly and count the rotations, but if you lose your grip, rise your hand. Trying to grab it again could break it (hand)
And the pitot heat can give you 3rd degree burns, if you test it like a 172.
The constant metering of fuel, and the return valve which can piss fuel out of the tip tank overflow valve if you're not careful, along with the circulating pumps which push the fuel from one part of the tip tank towards the fuel line, is a band aid on a poor design.
The emergency gear extension handle is directly connected to the gear so the handle can fly up once the gear is unlocked and it free falls. You re meant to keep your hand on it firmly and count the rotations, but if you lose your grip, rise your hand. Trying to grab it again could break it (hand)
And the pitot heat can give you 3rd degree burns, if you test it like a 172.
TK421
Well-Known Member
Lots of 340 time here and only a bit of 310R time, but same wing/fuel system as the R. No big deal, pretty straightforward airplane. Multiengine stuff aside (which is all important for review) everyone makes a big deal of the fuel system, but once you go through it a couple times it should make good sense. I've found they like to get slow all dirty especially with full flaps (as most airplanes do) so watch that. Also, they don't like ice and be careful about tail stalls if you have any decent accumulation. Be safe and enjoy it! Good airplane.
chrisreedrules
Master Blaster
I don't remember the exact model, but I've got some time in a 310 with dual turbo-charged IO520s... That thing was a beast on a cold day and no weight. I remember the first time I took off in it, turning downwind we were already through 3,000ft and on top of the airspace. i remember it has a squirrelly fuel system and it didn't seem as inherently stable as some of the piston multis I've flown.
deadstick
Well-Known Member
The fuel system is what has gotten a lot of folks. I burned about one hour off the mains (tips) before switching. This usually makes enough room for the return when you switch to the aux tanks. Also, make sure tampers fuel the tips when you tell them you want fuel in the mains.
As @ahw01 mentioned, there's a circulating pump in the mains to ensure there's always fuel over the port. IIRC it's for descents at a high rate that can make fuel collect in the aft part of the tank. Dig in the POH, but I believe that pump is on the same CB as the on-side landing light motor. IF one were to try to extend the landing light above the published speed, the breaker will pop and you lose the pump, too. It's been awhile, but I believe it's under the pilot's left elbow--right there I plain site. I got into the habit of just checking the CB after every extension. It'll also happen if the motor is old and worn out or if the CB is weak.
Roger Roger
Bottom of the list
I'm so glad all those engineers had died/retired/been fired by the time Cessna built the Caravan. Those older 200 Cessnas and Cessna twins were contraptions.
It's really a pussycat, you'll dig the airplane. Don't go below blue line and life is good.
Burn off the mains for 90 minutes before switching to the aux tanks, like everyone else has said. Dealing with the nacelle tanks takes some planning, but it's not rocket science. I think a lot of guys make the fuel system harder than it has to be, at least on the R models.
But, remembering to tell line folks not familiar with the airplane that the tips are the mains and the auxes are inboard is a big deal. The inboards fill slow too, so they'll need to let them burp a time or two or you'll be down 5-7 gallons a side.
The VG kitted ones are nice because it'll stall about the same time it'll VMC roll on you, so they're almost idiot proof. Almost. If you get that slow, well, you probably had it coming. The non-VG airplanes need a little more care.
The downside is the VG airplanes just sort of stop flying abruptly, I'd describe it as "sharper" in the stall, and the feel just isn't there. I never really could feel when a VG airplane was going to stall, the wing was just sort of on or off.
Everyone flies them too fast on short final, myself included. I don't think I ever crossed the threshold at less than about 105 and the thing would easily do 95 or less happily.
Light, the thing is almost over-powered (especially the IO-550 modded ones, which are great airplanes) so single-engine performance is rarely an issue as long as you've identified, verified, feathered. Heavy, the thing still climbs just fine single-engine.
It rides like crap in anything more turbulent than a butterfly fart, so hand flying is a real pain. With an autopilot and YD they're ok, but not great in the bumps.
You can't see the strobes on the tip tanks in normal flight. If you start seeing a jagged line by the strobes you have a good amount of ice on board and need to get out of it.
The thing will haul a good amount of ice, but I wouldn't get below 150, maybe 145, knots and yeah, the tail will stall on you so if you have a lot of ice, leave it at flaps 15 and land fast. I've landed with over an inch of ice on the unprotected surfaces and it was, um, okay, but it wasn't great.
Depending on the airplane, the avionics master is right next to, I think, the ice light so you will shut off everything in the middle of the night by mistake, probably when you're covered in ice. Don't stress out, it happens to everybody.
The gear system is fragile. It needs to be rigged regularly by somebody who knows what they're doing and it'll take some abuse, but not a lot. Cranking it down by hand is a pain and you could break your wrist, but if you keep a firm grip it's no problem.
I spent, I dunno, 3,000 hours in 310Rs flying freight in the Dakotas and did my fair share of stupid things in them, but they always got me home.
I never could land the things smoothly though.
Burn off the mains for 90 minutes before switching to the aux tanks, like everyone else has said. Dealing with the nacelle tanks takes some planning, but it's not rocket science. I think a lot of guys make the fuel system harder than it has to be, at least on the R models.
But, remembering to tell line folks not familiar with the airplane that the tips are the mains and the auxes are inboard is a big deal. The inboards fill slow too, so they'll need to let them burp a time or two or you'll be down 5-7 gallons a side.
The VG kitted ones are nice because it'll stall about the same time it'll VMC roll on you, so they're almost idiot proof. Almost. If you get that slow, well, you probably had it coming. The non-VG airplanes need a little more care.
The downside is the VG airplanes just sort of stop flying abruptly, I'd describe it as "sharper" in the stall, and the feel just isn't there. I never really could feel when a VG airplane was going to stall, the wing was just sort of on or off.
Everyone flies them too fast on short final, myself included. I don't think I ever crossed the threshold at less than about 105 and the thing would easily do 95 or less happily.
Light, the thing is almost over-powered (especially the IO-550 modded ones, which are great airplanes) so single-engine performance is rarely an issue as long as you've identified, verified, feathered. Heavy, the thing still climbs just fine single-engine.
It rides like crap in anything more turbulent than a butterfly fart, so hand flying is a real pain. With an autopilot and YD they're ok, but not great in the bumps.
You can't see the strobes on the tip tanks in normal flight. If you start seeing a jagged line by the strobes you have a good amount of ice on board and need to get out of it.
The thing will haul a good amount of ice, but I wouldn't get below 150, maybe 145, knots and yeah, the tail will stall on you so if you have a lot of ice, leave it at flaps 15 and land fast. I've landed with over an inch of ice on the unprotected surfaces and it was, um, okay, but it wasn't great.
Depending on the airplane, the avionics master is right next to, I think, the ice light so you will shut off everything in the middle of the night by mistake, probably when you're covered in ice. Don't stress out, it happens to everybody.
The gear system is fragile. It needs to be rigged regularly by somebody who knows what they're doing and it'll take some abuse, but not a lot. Cranking it down by hand is a pain and you could break your wrist, but if you keep a firm grip it's no problem.
I spent, I dunno, 3,000 hours in 310Rs flying freight in the Dakotas and did my fair share of stupid things in them, but they always got me home.
I never could land the things smoothly though.
Dan208B
Well-Known Member
I agree. Long runways I usually keep blue line as long as I'm comfortable with and then slow to touchdown. But I've flown 310s off of a 2500ft grass strip and they're happy still at 95. The VG airplanes even 85. The risk there is having some power in that slow if you lose an engine you don't have the altitude to nose-over and you're slow enough that you'd risk a VMC roll adding in the power. But on 2 engines the airplane does great.
So now that I have a whopping 5 hours in it, here's what I learned:
Landing is not bad, I do come in a bit faster (105...Blue) and fly it into the runway, reducing just above the TD markers and she settles firm. I still tend to land right side, maybe because I have maybe 10 hours total from right seat in anything.
Getting configured early really helps, first few landings I was not getting last bit of flaps in until short final, then ballooned up. Once configured I was nailing them
Approaches come real fast, much shorter amount of time to get things done
Great sight lines, but having that much view really messes up my steep turns, I always feel like I'm descending since I can see so much, so tend to pull up.
Also in Emergency descents. holding 140, it looks like I'm nose down 40 degrees when I'm not. have to get used to it.
Single engine takes a ton of rudder, without the trim my leg is killing me, with the trim coming back to two engines seems to whip the nose around.
VMC at 5000 and just below 80 the nose starts wallowing around as I begin to lose directional control. Not comfortable the first two times I did it.
Turns about a point takes a really wide arc (and I think the villagers hate me screaming above their farms at 140-160 1000 AGL
Doing MEI in it will be interesting, still a bit nervous on the VMC, Drag Demo and Single Engine.....need more work.
Fuel is interesting but not bothersome. Have only flown on Mains (tips) and some Engine locker aux transfers. Main Aux in wings have been kept empty.
Landing is not bad, I do come in a bit faster (105...Blue) and fly it into the runway, reducing just above the TD markers and she settles firm. I still tend to land right side, maybe because I have maybe 10 hours total from right seat in anything.
Getting configured early really helps, first few landings I was not getting last bit of flaps in until short final, then ballooned up. Once configured I was nailing them
Approaches come real fast, much shorter amount of time to get things done
Great sight lines, but having that much view really messes up my steep turns, I always feel like I'm descending since I can see so much, so tend to pull up.
Also in Emergency descents. holding 140, it looks like I'm nose down 40 degrees when I'm not. have to get used to it.
Single engine takes a ton of rudder, without the trim my leg is killing me, with the trim coming back to two engines seems to whip the nose around.
VMC at 5000 and just below 80 the nose starts wallowing around as I begin to lose directional control. Not comfortable the first two times I did it.
Turns about a point takes a really wide arc (and I think the villagers hate me screaming above their farms at 140-160 1000 AGL
Doing MEI in it will be interesting, still a bit nervous on the VMC, Drag Demo and Single Engine.....need more work.
Fuel is interesting but not bothersome. Have only flown on Mains (tips) and some Engine locker aux transfers. Main Aux in wings have been kept empty.