Boeing gets Tanker Contract

Sorry, the way I read your post in the context of the others made it appear that it was saying that FBW does not have significant advantages.

The 777 FMS is similar to the 757, which has limitations on capabilities, particularly in long haul type flying, things such as putting in flight plan constraints, planning, etc. Also, the fact that the airplane will turn the the heading selected rather than maintain the heading if the FMC's drop out is a bit odd.
 
seagull said:
Both are hydraulic, by the way. The difference is the way the flight controls connect to the hydraulics. FBW allows you to do things that conventional controls cannot. Chief among them is to move the CG aft to the point that you eliminate trim drag. You also can design aerodynamic surfaces that are a lot more efficient but normally would create too many adverse handling qualities.
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Yes. To add, thats partly why the F-16 is so maneuverable. It's statically and dynamically unstable, as is the F-117. Both depend on FBW to "manage" the instability to something workable. Without the FBW, the aircraft would be a tumbling brick. And with hydraulic only, it wouldn't be something a human pilot would be able to control to fly.
 
MikeD said:
Yes. To add, thats partly why the F-16 is so maneuverable. It's statically and dynamically unstable, as is the F-117. Both depend on FBW to "manage" the instability to something workable. Without the FBW, the aircraft would be a tumbling brick. And with hydraulic only, it wouldn't be something a human pilot would be able to control to fly.
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Oh, I totally did a manual reversion landing in the F-117...... in FlightSim!
 
U.S. Air Force, Boeing Sign KC-X Contract

EADS has until March 7 to protest the decision if the company finds a misstep by the Air Force in its source selection.

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Re: U.S. Air Force, Boeing Sign KC-X Contract

NewsBot said:
EADS has until March 7 to protest the decision if the company finds a misstep by the Air Force in its source selection.

More...
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Well the Air Force, its group at the weapon procurement office, and Boeing have been completely above the board for the last decade, so I see no reason to look into this further.
 
Pépé le Pilot said:
Not saying that at all ! There are some guys chiming in with barely a PPL explaining evereything about evereything. I know that you are flying the 75, wich is one of my top 5 airplane. It seems that we are not that many here having line experience hence the value of guys like you, Seagull, MikeD, Doug etc.
MD-11 seems a fabulous airplane. There are a few here, it is glorious looking and seems a fabulous machine to fly.
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No biggie, just had to rib ya a bit. ;) I agree though: Sometimes the best thing you can do is keep your mouth shut and listen. Some people on this board like to do the opposite it seems. By the way, before anyone calls me out for trying to say the 757 is a widebody, I'm also on the 76. ;)

seagull said:
Sorry, the way I read your post in the context of the others made it appear that it was saying that FBW does not have significant advantages.

The 777 FMS is similar to the 757, which has limitations on capabilities, particularly in long haul type flying, things such as putting in flight plan constraints, planning, etc. Also, the fact that the airplane will turn the the heading selected rather than maintain the heading if the FMC's drop out is a bit odd.
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I'm pretty new to this Boeing FMC, so I guess I'll figure out those limitations as I go. There are a few curiosities I've seen so far, though. One being the tendency of the airplane to drop out of VNAV PTH when you load a different approach into the arrivals page. Actually, it almost busted a restriction on me yesterday because of that. Thank god for FLCH and boards!

For long haul stuff...I dunno, but it seemed to do fine on a 10 hour leg yesterday. We loaded in everything along with forecast winds before departure, and it was accurate to within 5 minutes. We have the latest Pegasus FMCs, so I can't comment on the old Legacy boxes.
 
Re: U.S. Air Force, Boeing Sign KC-X Contract

jynxyjoe said:
Well the Air Force, its group at the weapon procurement office, and Boeing have been completely above the board for the last decade, so I see no reason to look into this further.
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Well played.....:clap:
 
dasleben said:
No biggie, just had to rib ya a bit. ;) I agree though: Sometimes the best thing you can do is keep your mouth shut and listen. Some people on this board like to do the opposite it seems. By the way, before anyone calls me out for trying to say the 757 is a widebody, I'm also on the 76. ;)



I'm pretty new to this Boeing FMC, so I guess I'll figure out those limitations as I go. There are a few curiosities I've seen so far, though. One being the tendency of the airplane to drop out of VNAV PTH when you load a different approach into the arrivals page. Actually, it almost busted a restriction on me yesterday because of that. Thank god for FLCH and boards!

For long haul stuff...I dunno, but it seemed to do fine on a 10 hour leg yesterday. We loaded in everything along with forecast winds before departure, and it was accurate to within 5 minutes. We have the latest Pegasus FMCs, so I can't comment on the old Legacy boxes.
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Some other differences. On the MD-11, if you are flying using the FCP (MCP in "Boeing-ese"), the airspeed knob and the altitude knob work like this: Turn it to a heading/altitude to preselect, push the knob in and you are holding what you have, pull it and you select the preselect. There are NO other buttons to engage other modes. One button engages the FMC nav mode, and one button engages the profile (VNAV) mode.

Absent a failure, it does not drop out of the FMC modes unless you select it out.
 
Seagull, watched a bunch of MD-11 vids today, and I was wondering what were the 2 buttons that are pressed simultaneously on the AP CP ? They are right in the middle. I see them pressed a few times on the approach...
 
Pépé le Pilot said:
Seagull, watched a bunch of MD-11 vids today, and I was wondering what were the 2 buttons that are pressed simultaneously on the AP CP ? They are right in the middle. I see them pressed a few times on the approach...
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There is a nav, approach/land and autopilot button there, depends on the approach. FMS speed and PROF are on the left and right sides.
 
To get back on the tanker, I know it's a 767...but which variant is it going to be? The -200/-300/-400ER? The pics it looks like a -200 with the Blended Winglets...but I wasn't sure.
 
Pépé le Pilot said:
Great ! Now the tankers are going to be 1970's designed airplanes. Quite a interesting way of doing business. In the meantime, the 787 is still not ready.
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At least a 767's tail stays on.... ;-)

And the final authority regarding aircraft control is a human being with powers of reasoning.

Don't make me post the video of the "modern" A-320 flying into the trees!

<VBG>
 
fo4ever said:
At least a 767's tail stays on.... ;-)

And the final authority regarding aircraft control is a human being with powers of reasoning.

Don't make me post the video of the "modern" A-320 flying into the trees!

<VBG>
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The 767 tail will NOT stay on if you kick the rudder full deflection one way and the follow it by another, like the Airbus crew did. Sorry to burst your bubble.

Also, any Boeing will also hit the trees if you get slow and do not push the power up until it's too late. There was no issue with the airplane design on that accident. Again, sorry to burst your bubble.

Boeing FBW controls also have limits, and, by the way, the #1 cause of fatal transport accidents is loss of control. Pilots not making the correct inputs. That actually supports the Airbus design philosophy.
 
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