Big U.S. Airlines Fault Persian Gulf Carriers

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Put down the koolaide and relax. You aren't gonna be changing any minds around this place, and nothing said or done here is going to effect any change. Best to just grab some popcorn and find a good spot to watch the pissing match. The fun won't begin until the jingoists get fully spun up!
 
Typhoon is this true? :

Emirates Airline’s President, Sheikh Ahmed bin Saeed Al Maktoum, is also President of Dubai Civil Aviation Authority, Chairman of Dubai Airports, and President of dnata. That would be like Doug Parker being CEO of American Airlines, head of the FAA, and President of DFW, ORD, LAX, JFK, and MIA Airports.
 
typhoonpilot said:
Emirates Airline president Tim Clark believes Delta Air Lines chief executive Richard Anderson overstepped the mark when he linked the 9/11 terrorist attacks with the Gulf carriers, as the row over subsidies and open skies escalates.
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I'm sure Anderson is really losing sleep over your offense. :rolleyes:

However, Clark is reluctant to comment on the statement by the US majors that they have "irrefutable evidence" that Gulf carriers benefit from multibillion-dollar subsidies
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Gee, I wonder why?

He also questioned whether Anderson had thought about the consequences of his comments for his airline's fellow alliance members, saying: "I wonder if Mr Anderson considered the feelings of his SkyTeam partner Saudia when he made these allegations or these carefully crafted words."
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Saudia needs Delta far more than Delta needs Saudia. The alliance will be just fine.

Nick said:
Anderson's 9/11 comment was a successful booby trap.

The ME3 leadership have now been tricked into moving this entire story further into the spotlight and getting it press time, which they have now done, having been unable to resist not grabbing the bait.

As all of these CEOs are lawyers coached by teams of other lawyers, let's not kid ourselves: they knew exactly what they were doing with the responses in the CNN interview. Smart.
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Maybe, maybe not. I've seen brilliant, well-coached guys flub up interviews or testimony. It happens. But Anderson has nothing to apologize for here. His point was well made. The U.S. carriers suffered immeasurably after the 9/11 attacks, and the government didn't lift a finger to help them, yet the Gulf carriers get government subsidies as a normal course of business every day of the year. That's what this is all about: lack of a level playing field.
 
Trip7 said:
Typhoon is this true? :

Emirates Airline’s President, Sheikh Ahmed bin Saeed Al Maktoum, is also President of Dubai Civil Aviation Authority, Chairman of Dubai Airports, and President of dnata. That would be like Doug Parker being CEO of American Airlines, head of the FAA, and President of DFW, ORD, LAX, JFK, and MIA Airports.
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The first sentence is true. Your example is not, however.

Dubai Civil Aviation Authority is not the equivalent of the FAA. That is a widely misunderstood point. The UAE GCAA is the equivalent of the FAA and they are based in Abu Dhabi. Dubai Civil Aviation basically runs the airport infrastructure, it is not the regulatory body for pilot licensing, rules and regulations, oversight of airlines, etc. That is the UAE GCAA.

http://www.dcaa.gov.ae/sitepages/en/internet.aspx



Typhoonpilot
 
ATN_Pilot said:
The U.S. carriers suffered immeasurably after the 9/11 attacks, and the government didn't lift a finger to help them, yet the Gulf carriers get government subsidies as a normal course of business every day of the year. That's what this is all about: lack of a level playing field.
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You're forgetting the $5 billion in grants given to the U.S. airlines post 9-11 again.

Once again, what subsidies is Emirates getting "every day of the year"? Still waiting for some facts.


TP
 
typhoonpilot said:
The first sentence is true. Your example is not, however.

Dubai Civil Aviation Authority is not the equivalent of the FAA. That is a widely misunderstood point. The UAE GCAA is the equivalent of the FAA and they are based in Abu Dhabi. Dubai Civil Aviation basically runs the airport infrastructure, it is not the regulatory body for pilot licensing, rules and regulations, oversight of airlines, etc. That is the UAE GCAA.

http://www.dcaa.gov.ae/sitepages/en/internet.aspx



Typhoonpilot
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Thanks for the clarification. Aside from the FAA example inaccuracy, the rest is true? Delta would have quite an accounting and financial advantage if Richard Anderson was the Atlanta Hartsfield Jackson International Airport manager.
 
Trip7 said:
Thanks for the clarification. Aside from the FAA example inaccuracy, the rest is true? Delta would have quite an accounting and financial advantage if Richard Anderson was the Atlanta Hartsfield Jackson International Airport manager.
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I don't buy that your FAA example is inaccurate.
 
The Dubai CAA is not the same as the country (the UAE) GCAA. Dubai is one Emirate in the United Arab Emirates. Abu Dhabi is another, along with Sharjah, Al Ain, Ras al Khaimah, al Fujierah (sp). The regularity authority is the GCAA which is country wide. It seems @Seggy likes to deal in facts only when it suits his case.
 
On paper there may be a separation, but it would be like Richard Anderson's, close cousin/business partner/very good friend, be in charge of the FAA.

Did you see my other post @Cherokee_Cruiser about the report about to be released? Want to make sure of that.
 
typhoonpilot said:
You're forgetting the $5 billion in grants given to the U.S. airlines post 9-11 again.
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No, I haven't forgotten them, they are simply irrelevant. As was already explained to you, those grants were only to make up for the immediate effects of shutting down the entire NAS, and the airlines had to provide proof of their direct losses to get that money. The airlines never received any assistance for the years of hell that followed 9/11.

Once again, what subsidies is Emirates getting "every day of the year"? Still waiting for some facts. TP
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Don't worry, Anderson has provided it to the people who matter. You aren't one of those people.
 
ATN_Pilot said:
No, I haven't forgotten them, they are simply irrelevant. As was already explained to you, those grants were only to make up for the immediate effects of shutting down the entire NAS, and the airlines had to provide proof of their direct losses to get that money. The airlines never received any assistance for the years of hell that followed 9/11.
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You only show your ass when you try to debate with a statement like that. On the one hand your side is claiming the playing field is not level because of alleged subsidies, yet when factual payments by the U.S. government to U.S. airlines are brought up you try to quibble and use evasive statements to say that they don't count. That's just laughable.


ATN_Pilot said:
Don't worry, Anderson has provided it to the people who matter. You aren't one of those people.
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You also continually try to childishly bash me with statements like the above. Real mature Todd.



Typhoonpilot
 
Regardless of politics, why would a pilot be against american airlines (no pun intended ) competing on a level playing field?

I don't get what some are arguing on here ^^
 
typhoonpilot said:
You only show your ass when you try to debate with a statement like that. On the one hand your side is claiming the playing field is not level because of alleged subsidies, yet when factual payments by the U.S. government to U.S. airlines are brought up you try to quibble and use evasive statements to say that they don't count. That's just laughable.
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Nothing is evasive about facts. But I'm not surprised that you'd like to paint it that way, since those facts obliterate your argument.

You also continually try to childishly bash me with statements like the above. Real mature Todd.
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What is lacking in maturity is your belief that you are entitled to proprietary information. The legacy carriers have gone to great expense to collect this data and lobby the appropriate people. You aren't entitled to the data. Get over it.

What is also lacking in maturity is your stubborn insistence that the Gulf carriers are not receiving subsidies when you know damned well that they are. You would rather persist in your crazy argument than admit the reality.
 
ATN_Pilot said:
What is also lacking in maturity is your stubborn insistence that the Gulf carriers are not receiving subsidies when you know damned well that they are. You would rather persist in your crazy argument than admit the reality.
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Your reading comprehension is in question. I have stated that I do not disagree that Etihad and Qatar are strongly supported by their governments. Likely they get direct cash infusions, etc. Yet RA, Seggy, and you, among others, are trying to tar Emirates with that same brush and have yet to come up with one single verifiable fact to support your case.


TP
 
Dubai, Jebel Ali, Abu Dhabi...they all equally suck...But, you want CHEAP perfume oil, Shwarma and gold at the market price it's ok...I've seen Emirates training center from the road...kinda cool looking, but I would NEVER want to live in a country where your ( in their eyes ), "the help". So, all you little kiddies that like to come here and whine about the vagaries of the airline industry ought to go see the world first...Then report back...
 
BE19Pilot said:
Dubai, Jebel Ali, Abu Dhabi...they all equally suck...But, you want CHEAP perfume oil, Shwarma and gold at the market price it's ok...I've seen Emirates training center from the road...kinda cool looking, but I would NEVER want to live in a country where your ( in their eyes ), "the help". So, all you little kiddies that like to come here and whine about the vagaries of the airline industry ought to go see the world first...Then report back...
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I think most people here have seen the world, my cousin owns an advertising firm in Dubai, every time I've been to Dubai I was treated with respect. Ask a Mexican in Texas or one picking our fruit in California about " the help"...
 
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