CaptainChris87
New Member
I'm starting ATP on September 18 I was wondering will I go through a lot of weathering's during my xc phase or for the whole training for that matter and is that considered in the 90 day. (wx issues)-thanks
ATP in the fall WX problems?
- Thread starter CaptainChris87
- Start date
Captain_Bob
Well-Known Member
:yeahthat:
Here's the biggest thing that I remember about XC's and weather. ATP uses real honest to goodness Dispatchers... These guys had the same training that the dispatchers for my current company have. They have quite an awesome set-up, and have access to all weather.
So... let's say Dispatch has you at the GKY airport at 7:00am, and they want you to fly to KNQP (Old Navy Memphis). Let's say they brief you that there's a big storm over Texarkana moving east... so they recomend you take a north route then proceed east. You say OK... hang up and go file a good flight plan... your flight plan. How do you want to get there? You know the fuel burn... you know the performance of the aircraft. As long as the route makes sense... then you file it that way. Now... let's say the weather briefer says that storms are starting to build to the north... so he suggests that you proceed east first... then north... then back east on course... as long as your numbers add up... then file it that way.
No one is going to make you fly you into a storm or bad weather... except for you as PIC. You get all the available info... if it makes sense... and the numbers add up... then file it, and fly it. If... it looks like everything east is going to hell in a handbasket... call up Dispatch and ask to fly to a western location that day.
It's really that easy. You are the PIC.
The only time I've really seen weather back up the program at all... is for checkrides. For example... My program was over 90 days because I let my flight partner do his CFI Single ride before me on what was supposed to be our last day. Well... he finished... barely. The weather rode in on their tail... and stayed a week. He was done and got to go home... while I had to hang around for a week waiting for a VFR day. I lived just down the road from the airport so it didn't matter that much to me... but I think we've all been in situation where we've waited on weather for an "event" like your first solo, your PPL Checkride, and any other VFR checkride. But that's different than the XC's... simply because you are on an IFR flight plan and can fly away from the weather.
Remember... at ATP... you fly across the country on your cross countries... If it's Hurrican season and you are based in Stuart FL... then you may spend your two weeks of XC's flying up and down the west coast, midwest, or the southwest.
Hope that helps...
Bob
Here's the biggest thing that I remember about XC's and weather. ATP uses real honest to goodness Dispatchers... These guys had the same training that the dispatchers for my current company have. They have quite an awesome set-up, and have access to all weather.
So... let's say Dispatch has you at the GKY airport at 7:00am, and they want you to fly to KNQP (Old Navy Memphis). Let's say they brief you that there's a big storm over Texarkana moving east... so they recomend you take a north route then proceed east. You say OK... hang up and go file a good flight plan... your flight plan. How do you want to get there? You know the fuel burn... you know the performance of the aircraft. As long as the route makes sense... then you file it that way. Now... let's say the weather briefer says that storms are starting to build to the north... so he suggests that you proceed east first... then north... then back east on course... as long as your numbers add up... then file it that way.
No one is going to make you fly you into a storm or bad weather... except for you as PIC. You get all the available info... if it makes sense... and the numbers add up... then file it, and fly it. If... it looks like everything east is going to hell in a handbasket... call up Dispatch and ask to fly to a western location that day.
It's really that easy. You are the PIC.
The only time I've really seen weather back up the program at all... is for checkrides. For example... My program was over 90 days because I let my flight partner do his CFI Single ride before me on what was supposed to be our last day. Well... he finished... barely. The weather rode in on their tail... and stayed a week. He was done and got to go home... while I had to hang around for a week waiting for a VFR day. I lived just down the road from the airport so it didn't matter that much to me... but I think we've all been in situation where we've waited on weather for an "event" like your first solo, your PPL Checkride, and any other VFR checkride. But that's different than the XC's... simply because you are on an IFR flight plan and can fly away from the weather.
Remember... at ATP... you fly across the country on your cross countries... If it's Hurrican season and you are based in Stuart FL... then you may spend your two weeks of XC's flying up and down the west coast, midwest, or the southwest.
Hope that helps...
Bob
BobDDuck
Island Bus Driver
Just to clarify something Bob said...
Yes, dispatch will tell you about the weather but remember (and he *did* bold this) it is YOUR flight plan. I don't want to say they will pressure you into flying into bad weather, but there were certainly times when they didn't excactly highlight the fact that there were convective sigmets out for our area of flight and multiple pireps of bad weather. If you do a good job planning your flight you won't have a problem but there were a few times we ended up in "da ****" due to a little bit a lack of planning and dispatch being overly optimistic about what they were seeing on their screen. You will fly through weather. There is no two ways about it. Just stay within your personal limitations and you will be fine.
Yes, dispatch will tell you about the weather but remember (and he *did* bold this) it is YOUR flight plan. I don't want to say they will pressure you into flying into bad weather, but there were certainly times when they didn't excactly highlight the fact that there were convective sigmets out for our area of flight and multiple pireps of bad weather. If you do a good job planning your flight you won't have a problem but there were a few times we ended up in "da ****" due to a little bit a lack of planning and dispatch being overly optimistic about what they were seeing on their screen. You will fly through weather. There is no two ways about it. Just stay within your personal limitations and you will be fine.
SIUav8er
Narcosis
exactly, you are going to be the PIC. You need to make your own WX minimums. Just cause dispatch releases you does not mean that you are no longer responsible for the flight (hey, theyre on the ground, YOU are the one flying!). I had to turn down one flight during my XC for severe thunderstorms...even though dispatch gave the "release"....
In other words, dont depend on dispathc for weather.
In other words, dont depend on dispathc for weather.
BobDDuck
Island Bus Driver
I flew the morning (mere hours) after Katrina pummeled New Orleans...
Wasn't the greatest idea with winds around 60kts at about 3K.. but we tried it..
One of two times I almost got sick in a plane..
But that's because you are big pimpin in the jball.
killbilly
Vocals, Lyrics, Triangle, Washboard, Kittens
Question about this. As the PIC, you made your decision...that's cool. Could you have gone up if you'd wanted to, and used ATC to vector you around storms and stuff the way freight dawgs often have to do? Would that have been allowed?
Captain_Bob
Well-Known Member
Freight dogs take vectors around storms?? 
The answer to your question more specifically is... yes. Unless of course the weather is directly over top of your airport... or forcast to be overtop of your destination at the time of arrival. If the latter is the case... then you can ask for a different direction/destination.
Bob
The answer to your question more specifically is... yes. Unless of course the weather is directly over top of your airport... or forcast to be overtop of your destination at the time of arrival. If the latter is the case... then you can ask for a different direction/destination.
Bob
killbilly
Vocals, Lyrics, Triangle, Washboard, Kittens
Freight dogs take vectors around storms??
The answer to your question more specifically is... yes. Unless of course the weather is directly over top of your airport... or forcast to be overtop of your destination at the time of arrival. If the latter is the case... then you can ask for a different direction/destination.
Bob
Following along this train of thought...can a student, while on XC phase, intentionally request altitudes and vectors to keep them in the clouds, so that they can log actual IMC IFR time?
Chris_Ford
Well-Known Member
I've "deviated right for weather" to get some actual since I had a road of clear along my route of flight. I got my .1
jamiestrat
New Member
In general, ATP dispatch were professional and honest about the weather. Once on the XC phase however, I had to pull the PIC card and refuse to do a flight when they wanted me to fly from Monroe LA to Dallas through a squall line across most of eastern TX. I say "most of eastern TX" because there was maybe a 5-10 mile gap in the squall showing no echoes that dispatch suggested we fly through. No thanks.
Another questionable decision making process on their part was waiting for the last minute to evacuate us from SUA for Tropical Storm Katrina. First and only time I have hit an updraft putting me 700ft. higher in a matter of a few seconds. Oh well, they have a job to do also.
Another questionable decision making process on their part was waiting for the last minute to evacuate us from SUA for Tropical Storm Katrina. First and only time I have hit an updraft putting me 700ft. higher in a matter of a few seconds. Oh well, they have a job to do also.
Longnok1305
New Member
I remember the days when FlightTracker "Mike" & "Brian" were around. Don't know if they're still there at Ponta Vedre. Anyhow. I did my XC phase in late fall and definitely flew through some wx on several occassions. On one flight plan from Craig to Meridian, we took off about 15 minutes before an amended TAF was issued which had MAJOR changes for the enroute and destination airport. Ended up flying through a line of rain that was so heavy that we could barely hear ATC with the radios turned all the way up. The rain was coming down that hard and thick. In fact, at one point one of our engines temporarily lost rpms due to, what, I don't know. It was near impossible to hold our altitude +/- 500ft during several instances due to updrafts/downdrafts. After we made it through the other side of the heavy rain, we kept hearing chatter on the frequency. Things like, "did xxx get in to airport xyz?". We contacted Flight Watch and found out that our destination aiport, our alternate, and every other within our fuel range was closed due to heavy fog. The front we flew through had stalled along the coast. We got the impression that the FW guy wanted to tell us we were screwed, but we already got a good read from his voice tone. Not good... We kept flying along the airway for awhile, asked for a higher altitude to get out of the soup into clear skies with nothing above but stars so we could better manage the situation without having to worry too much about flying the plane in IMC. We were at a dead end. No open airports within range. We had kept the FW frequency open on COM2 to monitor. Out of the blue, the FW guy made a blind call to us. Without even asking for a freq change from ATC we responded and found out Mobile was now open with 300 OVC. We immediately asked for a diversion to Mobile and flew to near minumums on ILS32. Taxing never was so welcomed. I had flown 1.5 actual (4.1 ttl at night) and hadn't even had my instrument for a week. We called Dispatch and the guy in JAX was completely freaked out. I guess we had flown through some pretty rough stuff from what his radar composite was showing and he was really stressed about it because he was aware all the airports were closed. It must not have been that bad for him because he wanted us to continue that night to Alexandria. We said, "no way, where's the nearest hotel". We looked up the wx at AEX and it was almost down to mins, as well.
I learned quite a bit that night. Sorry for the long winded story. I'm sure there are many others out there.
I learned quite a bit that night. Sorry for the long winded story. I'm sure there are many others out there.