As I'm ready to retire, I need to ask/vent

[RetiredATLATC]

I, after 33 Years as an ATC at only the highest facilities with the US FAA, would like to ask both GA and professional pilots;

within 40 miles, or even contacting the tower, within the busiest airspace the world

a) why do you check on saying "Center" this also happens on the downwind to ATL. Is your lack of area awareness that bad? This also happens on the final to ATL. CENTER could NOT do what we do....and it's akin to us calling you a different airline.

B) not check on with the ATIS
and then get pissy/suprised when the runway is different than the settings you put in long prior to actually talking to me. Key fact: the users wanted to build 10/28, not us. So when you're assigned it don't sound as if I just murdered your dog.

C) when you're 2.5 mile from the localizer ( again within 10 miles of the busiest airport in the world) do you either ignore the clearance or say "say again" and blow through the final. how freaking dangerous is that? Listen up!

D) tell me, Within 10 miles of ATL, that my clearance was blocked by Guard. FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, you don't always have to be listening to Guard; especially when you listening to it will have you fly through a localizer and have a separation error or pilot deviation. Save it for taxiing around Hartsfield. It's commonly known as Delta clearance and interferes ALL DAY LONG on the TRACON/CENTER/TOWER side of it. Pay atrention!

E) read back 180kts to AJAYY, then when your 6 miles outside AJAYY you tell me your speed is 155 and slowing. WTF! Pilot deviation, go around.

F) When I tell you cancel STYLS speed, you tell me cancel the speed at STYLS (wrong because that's expected) or cancel STYLS (well wouldn't that be dangerous if you started cancelling fixes) just read the damn thing back EXACTLY as it was said to you. Pilot readbacks are at the best lackluster and nonchalant. You're NOT the only ones flying around ATL and I can't read your mind.

G) when I switch you, talk to you etc use your damn call sign. I'm not a mind reader and haven't memorized voices. It happens more so with GA but within the past few years the majors have, again become lackluster.

I'm old, I'm tired, and I just once, for one day would love to have everyone act professionally.

Love

CJ

Fireball time on my one day off this week, stick that in your TA ( 4 days off a month)

 

[deadstick]

You have some good points, but riddle me this...when I check in with ground for taxi or initially with approach, and I specify I have information Alpha (for example), why am I almost always asked "Confirm you have information Alpha" or "Information Alpha is current"? I could see it getting missed if it was the first part of the transmission, but that's at the end.

 

[Ozelot]

why do you check on saying "Center"

This happens at my lowly M98 too sir!

do you either ignore the clearance or say "say again" and blow through the fina

I've seen this as well... 90% of the time its CPZ!

when I switch you, talk to you etc use your damn call sign. I'm not a mind reader and haven't memorized voices.

YEP!

Thank you for your service Sir!

 

[DE727UPS]

Have a nice retirement. Sounds like you need it.

I caught a probable runway incursion the other day at Bfi. I held short though he crossed me and then he caught his mistake. No big deal. I didn't say anything or feel the need to. We have to look out for each other.

I do agree that professionalism on the frequency has deteriorated over the years. That sucks. I think the profession has become less professional. Some of the blame is squarely on management doing all it can to cheapen the career to boost stock prices. You get what you pay for. Then, I must admit I don't wear my hat either. So maybe I'm part of the problem.

 

[ahw01]

I was very impressed as always with MIA when I flew there the other week. Bahamas on the other hand, not too bothered.

Although, I had Center opening flight plans when I couldn't raise Miami Radio - not sure why you need two seperate steps. Lockheed Martin we're mostly fine but there's always one who doesn't get it.

 

[RetiredATLATC]

I must admit I don't wear my hat either

Bingo, problem solved.

 

[RetiredATLATC]

You have some good points, but riddle me this...when I check in with ground for taxi or initially with approach, and I specify I have information Alpha (for example), why am I almost always asked "Confirm you have information Alpha" or "Information Alpha is current"? I could see it getting missed if it was the first part of the transmission, but that's at the end.

You'd be suprised what goes on behind the scenes while you're checking in.

I could be coordinating with Atlanta Center, RYY Tower, MGE Tower for GCA approaches, FTY Tower, the adjacent sector et . Not to say we too are not complacent, but a lot goes on no one sees.

I really wish more pilots would come to facilities and see what goes on, just as we do on the FAM's.

 

[SlumTodd_Millionaire]

I, after 33 Years as an ATC at only the highest facilities with the US FAA, would like to ask both GA and professional pilots;

within 40 miles, or even contacting the tower, within the busiest airspace the world

a) why do you check on saying "Center" this also happens on the downwind to ATL. Is your lack of area awareness that bad? This also happens on the final to ATL. CENTER could NOT do what we do....and it's akin to us calling you a different airline.

Force of habit. I might check in with a dozen center frequencies during a flight, but only one approach. Will it really ruin your day if I call you center instead of approach? I promise I won't lose my crap if you call me Cessna instead of Mooney.

B) not check on with the ATIS
and then get pissy/suprised when the runway is different than the settings you put in long prior to actually talking to me. Key fact: the users wanted to build 10/28, not us. So when you're assigned it don't sound as if I just murdered your dog.

Getting 10/28 sucks. A lot. Don't take it personally.

C) when you're 2.5 mile from the localizer ( again within 10 miles of the busiest airport in the world) do you either ignore the clearance or say "say again" and blow through the final. how freaking dangerous is that? Listen up!

Well, if you don't hear a clearance, you've got to confirm it. Sorry. But yes, I agree that it would be better to turn onto the localizer while getting clarification. I've never witnessed anyone fly on through while getting clarification. Probably a SWAhole.

D) tell me, Within 10 miles of ATL, that my clearance was blocked by Guard. FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, you don't always have to be listening to Guard; especially when you listening to it will have you fly through a localizer and have a separation error or pilot deviation. Save it for taxiing around Hartsfield. It's commonly known as Delta clearance and interferes ALL DAY LONG on the TRACON/CENTER/TOWER side of it. Pay atrention!

Some airlines require guard on the second radio. Other times people just forget to turn it off when entering the terminal area.

E) read back 180kts to AJAYY, then when your 6 miles outside AJAYY you tell me your speed is 155 and slowing. WTF! Pilot deviation, go around.

Again, gotta be a SWAhole. No one else is flying around that slow on purpose.

F) When I tell you cancel STYLS speed, you tell me cancel the speed at STYLS (wrong because that's expected) or cancel STYLS (well wouldn't that be dangerous if you started cancelling fixes) just read the damn thing back EXACTLY as it was said to you. Pilot readbacks are at the best lackluster and nonchalant. You're NOT the only ones flying around ATL and I can't read your mind.

You're going to have clarify this one for me. What's the difference between "cancel STYLS speed" and "cancel the speed at STYLS?"

G) when I switch you, talk to you etc use your damn call sign. I'm not a mind reader and haven't memorized voices. It happens more so with GA but within the past few years the majors have, again become lackluster.

Agreed.

You'd be suprised what goes on behind the scenes while you're checking in.

Gee, you think the same may be true of an airliner cockpit when you're getting bent out of shape about someone calling you Center instead of Approach?

Chill, my friend. Have a drink and enjoy retirement.

 

[Hacker15e]

Gee, you think the same may be true of an airliner cockpit when you're getting bent out of shape about someone calling you Center instead of Approach?

Chill, my friend. Have a drink and enjoy retirement.

This. On both points.

 

[PropDriver]

I've seen this as well... 90% of the time its CPZ!

You have the same name every day you're on the radio. We have a different flight number every flight. Sometimes we forget it. You'd also be amazed at how similar Compass, Skywest, and Southwest sound on the radio.

I encourage you to come ride in the cockpit and see everything we have to multi-task while flying an approach while also talking to you. You're welcome to ride along with me any time. I'm more than happy to show you our side.

 

[bkey79]

Gee, you think the same may be true of an airliner cockpit when you're getting bent out of shape about someone calling you Center instead of Approach?

Chill, my friend. Have a drink and enjoy retirement.

I was a controller for 11 years (USAF, FAA, and overseas contract) at some of the busiest airports and I thought I knew everything too! If I and only knew 10% of what I know now as a pilot, I would've been a 100x better controller.

 

[Cessnaflyer]

Aviate, navigate, communicate. It's the least of the priorities when stuff hits the fan.

 

[jtrain609]

When we get a turn while getting slowed on the final turn, it means we're reconfiguring, which requires us to verbalized everything we're doing.

Sorry if we miss your call, but if you tell us to turn and slow and then 15 seconds later clear is for the approach, we'll miss it because we're "coordinating," in ATC speak.

 

[RetiredATLATC]

You're going to have clarify this one for me. What's the difference between "cancel STYLS speed" and "cancel the speed at STYLS?"

Cancel STYLS speed means hit 10000 ft, go fast. Cancel speed at STYLS means @ STYLS you cancel the speed regardless if you've been at 10000 ft for 15 miles.

 

[RetiredATLATC]

I encourage you to come ride in the cockpit and see everything we have to multi-task while flying an approach while also talking to you.

Well as I've said, I'm retiring which means I'm old and was around during the old, good, FAM program. Conservatively I've been on at least 50 FAM's including a few international ones.

I preach to my trainees the amount of work crews have when the "new guard" is slam dunking you all the while giving you a heading that joins up well inside the marker.

 

[RetiredATLATC]

gotta be a SWAhole. No one else is flying around that slow on purpose.

Recently, yes. But you'd be suprised.

 

[SlumTodd_Millionaire]

Cancel STYLS speed means hit 10000 ft, go fast. Cancel speed at STYLS means @ STYLS you cancel the speed regardless if you've been at 10000 ft for 15 miles.

I still don't see what you mean.

If I got either clearance from you, I'd be going into the box and deleting the speed restriction at STYLS, which means the plane will speed up at 10k unless there's a speed restriction at a later fix.

 

[poser765]

I still don't see what you mean.

If I got either clearance from you, I'd be going into the box and deleting the speed restriction at STYLS, which means the plane will speed up at 10k unless there's a speed restriction at a later fix.

Yeah I'm not really following, either. If you want us to go fast at 10000 wouldn't you just say descend 10000 then maintain 300 knots or whatever?

I get a lot in the reverse. Going into ord and ewr, especially I get a lot of slow to x THEN descend to Y.

 

[Ozelot]

You have the same name every day you're on the radio. We have a different flight number every flight. Sometimes we forget it. You'd also be amazed at how similar Compass, Skywest, and Southwest sound on the radio.

I encourage you to come ride in the cockpit and see everything we have to multi-task while flying an approach while also talking to you. You're welcome to ride along with me any time. I'm more than happy to show you our side.

I know you're busy too. I've been in the jumpseat. And I know i'm not perfect either. I get bugged when I am trying to turn someone on base to hit my gap and I get no response twice and the third time the response is a twelve year old CPZ FO giggling. Sorry If I came off crabby, please accept my apologies.

 

[poser765]

I know you're busy too. I've been in the jumpseat. And I know i'm not perfect either. I get bugged when I am trying to turn someone on base to hit my gap and I get no response twice and the third time the response is a twelve year old CPZ FO giggling. Sorry If I came off crabby, please accept my apologies.

I think both sides need to keep in mind that both sides of the radio can get incredibly busy and none of us are perfect. Sometimes it's because we aren't listening...though generally when in the approach environment I've turned off the movie on my ipad and have put away the paper. Chances are if I miss a call it's because we are running a checklist, discussing operational concerns, someone stepped on you, or the damn jumpseater won't shut up about his new 40 foot sail boat and how much his secret wife in south America is costing him.