Any military Pilots/CSOs out there with Amblyopia or have a Waiver for their Vision?

Do you think my condition is waiverable?


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Skydvl2015

Well-Known Member
I am currently working on my CFI and plan on trying to join the Arizona ANG with the goal of flying C130s or the KC135s. So far I have my Private, Instrument, Commercial Single/Multi and hold a FAA first class medical with a Statement of Demonstrated Ability for amblyopia in my right eye. My visual acuity is 20/50 uncorrectable in my right eye and 20/20 in my left. This is obviously going to affect my depth perception, but having this problem since I was born has allowed my left eye to compensate for the deficiency. I have read that Amblyopia and a vision deficiency are potentially waiverable and require you to be in a multi-crew aircraft...So I am crossing my fingers. Do you think I would be able to get a waiver for my eyesight and what do you think my first steps should be in contacting the recruiter?
 
Had to google your condition, wasn't familiar with it. First off don't stop trying until you have multiple answers of No... A lot of military members, pilots, flight docs, etc may not be familiar with the exact regs for the FC1 for your condition. Your job is to now become 100% aquatinted with the Flight Class 1 reg, and AFI, so you can defend yourself/ show your hiring board it might not be an issue.

A couple things without researching your condition in the AFI:

There is a difference between a waiver for someone that has wings, and one that doesn't, you can guess which is easier to get a waiver for.

Most hiring boards are looking for someone that doesn't require waivers, why you ask? Well no waivers means easy accession. I had 3 waivers total when hired, so it is doable...

Go make friends/ connections at the units you are interested in... Go rush the unit like a frat/sorority, make them want to stick their neck out to get you to UPT because you will be an asset.

I had two of my waivers already written by my guard Flt Doc before I showed up to Brooks(now Wright Patt), also my civilian AME was the ex Flt Surgeon for the whole state, talk about lucky... he was able to write a background summary for the waiver that was presented to the Flt doc at Brooks...

You mentioned CSO, research FC1, FC2, FC3, CSO I believe needs a FC2, Loads get a FC3. If you are serious about serving your country consider any of those options, you will be aircrew and love it even if you aren't sitting at the rounded end, and you can't log it in your logbook.

For contacting the recruiter, bypass the traditional Enlisted recruiter, you need to first speak, and become "friends" with the Pilot/CSO/Load recruiter. Don't sell yourself short on first contact show them why you are worth it to them vesting time in you to get a slot.

If you go to a traditional recruiter they most likely won't know anything about the waiver process for FC1, so they may say it's not doable, again why it's important to school yourself and contact the right people.

Hope that helps...
 
A few questions

1. Are you able to focus on one object with both eyes? There are 2 different tests that you will have to do requiring this to get an FC1.

2. Is your vision able to be corrected to 20/20 with the aid of corrective lenses? I'm assuming yes as you need this even for an FAA class 1.

3. What is your uncorrected vision in both eyes? When I was coming through it needed to be a minimum of 20/70 before they would look at you. This is the single area that the AF is more "lax" on than other branches (Navy/Marines/Coast Guard require 20/40, Army requires 20/50). Only because the AF does a lot more research on flyers than the other 4 branches.

4. Your depth perception really needs to be pretty good to pass the test every year. Protip on that test, of the 5 circles in a row the one sticking out can only be 2, 3 or 4. The Air Force depth perception test has been a boon to tens thousands of people over the years, I failed it the first time at MEPs and thought I was done. However you simply have to know how to take it. I would HIGHLY suggest you google "Air Force depth perception test" so you can see how much of a stumbling block it has been to many many people. It's easy now that I know how to take it, but I almost lost my UPT slot over it.

My experience is dated by about 4 years and the regs are constantly changing. I am someone that has a pretty acute a-stigmatism, -4.25 in one eye and about -4.75 in the other. That said my uncorrected vision was 20/40 and I was easily correctable to 20/20. I was in the extreme 98% of cases that Brooks saw and I was told no many different times. I had to get the opinion of 2 different civilian ophthalmologists and have their results sent to a flight doc at the unit before the unit that hired me would even pay to send me down to Brooks (I was off the street, and in hindsight I'm not even sure if that was legal, but I was willing to do anything for a UPT slot at that point). The first recruiter that brought me in said there was no way I'd make (still hate that dude). So is it possible? Well in 2008/9 it was, but I'm not sure how possible it would even 5 years later in today's Air Force, seeing as how I was already lucky (through a lot of hard work and research) to begin with. Oh and I had to waive away my legs, since my femurs were essentially too long to allow for a safe ejection in the T-6/T-38. All 3 of those waivers added a year of waiting, while they just sat on peoples desks waiting for signatures, before I could even get OTS and UPT orders.

Everything @kaudbron said is dead nuts on.
 
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Had to google your condition, wasn't familiar with it. First off don't stop trying until you have multiple answers of No... A lot of military members, pilots, flight docs, etc may not be familiar with the exact regs for the FC1 for your condition. Your job is to now become 100% aquatinted with the Flight Class 1 reg, and AFI, so you can defend yourself/ show your hiring board it might not be an issue.

A couple things without researching your condition in the AFI:

There is a difference between a waiver for someone that has wings, and one that doesn't, you can guess which is easier to get a waiver for.

Most hiring boards are looking for someone that doesn't require waivers, why you ask? Well no waivers means easy accession. I had 3 waivers total when hired, so it is doable...

Go make friends/ connections at the units you are interested in... Go rush the unit like a frat/sorority, make them want to stick their neck out to get you to UPT because you will be an asset.

I had two of my waivers already written by my guard Flt Doc before I showed up to Brooks(now Wright Patt), also my civilian AME was the ex Flt Surgeon for the whole state, talk about lucky... he was able to write a background summary for the waiver that was presented to the Flt doc at Brooks...

You mentioned CSO, research FC1, FC2, FC3, CSO I believe needs a FC2, Loads get a FC3. If you are serious about serving your country consider any of those options, you will be aircrew and love it even if you aren't sitting at the rounded end, and you can't log it in your logbook.

For contacting the recruiter, bypass the traditional Enlisted recruiter, you need to first speak, and become "friends" with the Pilot/CSO/Load recruiter. Don't sell yourself short on first contact show them why you are worth it to them vesting time in you to get a slot.

If you go to a traditional recruiter they most likely won't know anything about the waiver process for FC1, so they may say it's not doable, again why it's important to school yourself and contact the right people.

Hope that helps...

Kaudbron,

Thank you for the response, it's nice to see optimism for a change. When I first started looking into flying I got discouraged right away because I was listening to unknowledgeable people that were telling me that I'd never fly because of my eyesight. Looking at where I am now I wish I had gotten other opinions before I decided to pursue another career. Only to then decide that I wasn't going to listen to those people and figure out a way myself. I would have most likely been a little farther ahead in my flight training than I am now...

I'm still trying to get familiar with the AFI and the Flight Class 1 reg and hopefully I'm on the right track.

I found a waiver guide my condition is listed on page 235 which states,

http://www.wpafb.af.mil/shared/media/document/AFD-130118-045.pdf

"Although some defects in stereoscopic vision may be ameliorated with correction of the visual
abnormality, individuals with corrected childhood amblyopia (by eye patching and/or strabismus
surgery) still exhibit a high prevalence of reduced depth perception capability. History of
strabismus surgery generally results in fluctuating exam results and variable levels of stereopsis
which are prone to decompensate in the aerospace environment. These individuals will not be
favorably considered for a waiver to enter aviation training."

Favorably is not a NO and it also highlights the fact that I wont be at the top of the list, which means I still have a chance.

Depth Perception Waiver Test and Approved Limits

"The USAF utilizes the VTA-DP, or its newer replacement, the Optec 2300 (OVT-DP), for
assessment of depth perception in aviators.

Passing this test requires the ability to discern depth
based on a disparity of at least 25 seconds of arc (line D), although the test is capable of scoring as
low as 15 seconds of arc (line F). The limit of human stereopsis capability is around 5 seconds of
arc. The Verhoeff test, measured intermediate stereopsis test, is no longer authorized as a screening
test for USAF aircrew. The AO Vectograph and Howard-Dolman tests are other distant stereopsis
that are available, and are utilized by the Aeromedical Consultation Service (ACS) to determine the
waiver potential for substandard stereopsis cases. The AO Vectograph is an approved low cost
alternate test to monitor stability of stereopsis performance in defective depth perception waiver
cases.

Test Passing Scores
OVT-DP and VTA-DP Line D, E or F
AO Vectograph 4/4 (60 arc secs); in some cases after ACS evaluation
3/4 (120 arc secs)"
 
A few questions

1. Are you able to focus on one object with both eyes? There are 2 different tests that you will have to do requiring this to get an FC1.

2. Is your vision able to be corrected to 20/20 with the aid of corrective lenses? I'm assuming yes as you need this even for an FAA class

3. What is your uncorrected vision in both eyes? When I was coming through it needed to be a minimum of 20/70 before they would look at you. This is the single area that the AF is more "lax" on than other branches (Navy/Marines/Coast Guard require 20/40, Army requires 20/50). Only because the AF does a lot more research on flyers than the other 4 branches.

4. Your depth perception really needs to be pretty good to pass the test every year. Protip on that test, of the 5 circles in a row the one sticking out can only be 2, 3 or 4. The Air Force depth perception test has been a boon to tens thousands of people over the years, I failed it the first time at MEPs and thought I was done. However you simply have to know how to take it. I would HIGHLY suggest you google "Air Force depth perception test" so you can see how much of a stumbling block it has been to many many people. It's easy now that I know how to take it, but I almost lost my UPT slot over it.

My experience is dated by about 4 years and the regs are constantly changing. I am someone that has a pretty acute a-stigmatism, -4.25 in one eye and about -4.75 in the other. That said my uncorrected vision was 20/40 and I was easily correctable to 20/20. I was in the extreme 98% of cases that Brooks saw and I was told no many different times. I had to get the opinion of 2 different civilian ophthalmologists and have their results sent to a flight doc at the unit before the unit that hired me would even pay to send me down to Brooks (I was off the street, and in hindsight I'm not even sure if that was legal, but I was willing to do anything for a UPT slot at that point). The first recruiter that brought me in said there was no way I'd make (still hate that dude). So is it possible? Well in 2008/9 it was, but I'm not sure how possible it would even 5 years later in today's Air Force, seeing as how I was already lucky (through a lot of hard work and research) to begin with. Oh and I had to waive away my legs, since my femurs were essentially too long to allow for a safe ejection in the T-6/T-38. All 3 of those waivers added a year of waiting, while they just sat on peoples desks waiting for signatures, before I could even get OTS and UPT orders.

Everything @kaudbron said is dead nuts on.

Soku39,

1. As far as I am aware I do not have any Strabismus and I am able to focus on one object with both eyes.
2. No. My left eye is 20/20 and my right eye is uncorrectable at 20/50. I have a SODA which removes any limitations from my first class medical. When I go to renew my first class medical the soda will act as a waiver and will allow me to get another first class medical issued with no limitations assuming my eyesight doesn't decrease below the 20/50. If it did, I would have to take another flight test and apply for another SODA through CAMI. There are commercial pilots with first class medicals that have a SODA for monocular vision. So not having correctable vision to 20/20 in both eyes is not a disqualifying factor, even though most people believe this is the case.
3. Uncorrected vision 20/20 Left and 20/50 Right
4.Thanks for the tips!!!

Fortunately, my mom works with multiple ophthalmologists who will all vouch for my condition so I am going to see if I can get a bunch of tests done with regards to my depth perception. Should I just keep the results or are there special forms they will need to fill out?

Thanks again!
 
I'm going to be real honest, I don't know how you are going to overcome 20/50 uncorrectable. I really don't, there might be a way though. Good luck.
 
Look into doing therapy for it. There has been some success in adults doing that. I don't think you'll have much success with the condition as is.

I have the same thing, with a SODA and first class, but have got no interest in the military. Good luck!
 
I have a vision waiver, based on lasik, so this appears to be different.
This is the internet, the same place that told me Pres Lincoln slayed dragons.
A lot of people don't uderstand that talking to a recruiter isn't an immediate obligation.
Until you stand and swear an oath at MEPS, you are free from obligation.
Talk to a recruiter, have them make a contact with a flight surgeon, and get actual advice. All else is pontification.
 
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