Another new program post

adreamer

adreamer

Well-Known Member
Good morning, everyone:

Just finish a phone from Jim. Here is what I have so far with new program(shold start by 1st of 2005).

The new program includes:
1. ACPP(airline career pilot program), not include CFI ratings.
2. 50 CRJ sim
3. ATP wriiten
4. 320 hours in DA-40, C172, or Seminoles in 6 months*
5. Housing
6. 3 Hour citation jet time
7. Total cost: 67990.
34,995 for ACPP, *32995 for driect track program
8. 3 months after you graduate, ATP will help you get a job
9. If no job after 3 months, you will be given back 10,000 $

What are you guys thinking about this program?


adreamer
 
Sounds interesting, but would that be enough total time to get hired? And would those interviewing you be cool with just flying around to build time, as opposed to instructing or doing something more constructive?

Would the time be on a combination of the three planes? Obviously the Seminole would be more valuable than the 172.

Is part of the reason for this too many students wanting to become instructors?

I guess those are some of my initial questions/concerns. I start ATP in January - so something for me to think about, but I kind of liked the idea of being an instructor.
 
How much TT would that be? If it's the ACPP + the new program would that be 140hrs +320hrs? And would you still get 140hrs in the ACPP program if you didn't do the CFI ratings?
 
The total time should be somewhere around 600 hours in your log book. Remember, you come into the program with your private, 25 X-C PIC, and total 85 hours or more.

As far as airline job, it is "whoever is hiring at the moment"

I assume that you will get about 125 ~ 130 hours in seminoles


adreamer
 
So when you don't get the job (ATP can't just magically get you a job if/when the airlines stop hiring)....your $57,990 + interest in debt with NO CFI ratings and around 550tt.

Doesn't sound like a very good idea to me! Sounds like ATP is trying to turn into DCA part II.
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Their regular cheaper program is much better.
 
Think about this...

Career Pilot Program was $31,995 in 2003. You needed about 1,500 total to interview at regionals. Now, less than half of what is req'd and an industry in hiring frenzy mode, ATP wants $60,000 and a phoney "guarantee".

I'm s'prise they don't put Sally Struthers on T.V. and sell you a 4-year degree to go with it.

In case you weren't around for Archie Bunker, here's Sally's website...

http://members.tripod.com/sallystruthers/
 
Being an ATP grad, I'm very dissapointed in this sham that they've concocted. One of the reasons I chose ATP was because they seemed more genuine than the rest, and didn't make false promises like so many others. This program to me was developed for one reason only - MORE MONEY!

Like RPM said, who wants 600TT with no CFI ratings when the airlines don't hire you? Big deal, they refund you $10K when you don't get hired. You know where that money is going, right into their 2 week CFI program so you can get the ratings that you need. And on top of it, I garauntee that you're sharing that time in the DA-40 with a stranger. Half hood, half safety pilot. You know what, I can rent a DA-40 for the same price that they are offering and fly when I want, where I want, and with who I want.

To me this program completely sucks and it's a shame that ATP is going down the same road so many other crappy flight schools have gone.
yeahthat.gif
 
People, this is a program which has not been officially announced in any way, is still in the developmental stage, and which probably should not have been "announced" in this forum for exactly those reasons. I'm sure no matter what the end result is, there will be diametrically opposed opinions no matter what, but shouldn't we wait and see just what it is they're offering first?
 
True.

I hope someone at ATP is reading this and taking notes however. It seems to me if they were to put this program in place, they'd be shooting themselve in the food.
 
Well, I think I should keep it under wrap. Doug, can you this post go away?

adreamer

ps: For those who has questions, PM me
 
[ QUOTE ]
People, this is a program which has not been officially announced in any way, is still in the developmental stage, and which probably should not have been "announced" in this forum for exactly those reasons. I'm sure no matter what the end result is, there will be diametrically opposed opinions no matter what, but shouldn't we wait and see just what it is they're offering first?

[/ QUOTE ]

Pfly is right. Let's all just wait 'til the specifics regarding this "new" program comes out before we jump to too many conclusions. Like I mentioned in another thread, if in fact ATP is developing a new program like the one described above, I'm sure they'll ensure it's of real value and not simply a rip-off. Time will tell.
 
Well, I have to wait and see what is the final figure is. However, this is what I have been told today.


adreamer
 
You all make good points, but you fail to realize what's happening behind closed doors. Relationships are being established with regional airlines across the country at a growing rate and ATP is trying to tailor their own training to meet their needs.

The reason ATP has chosen to go with the Da40 is because the regional airlines are asking for candidates to have more glass-cockpit experience. All of ATP's Da40s will be configured with the Garmin 1000 all glass flightdeck. This experience along with ATP's RJ certification program will give pilots the tools necessary to be competitive in this industry. More importantly, when they do actually get that job, they won't be intimidated by all the bells and whistles.

This program is going to happen people. You will see advertisements coming very soon in a magazine near you. This program is also targeting ATP career pilots who do not want to instruct. The exact details will be shared soon enough.
 
[ QUOTE ]
People, this is a program which has not been officially announced in any way, is still in the developmental stage, and which probably should not have been "announced" in this forum for exactly those reasons. I'm sure no matter what the end result is, there will be diametrically opposed opinions no matter what, but shouldn't we wait and see just what it is they're offering first?

[/ QUOTE ]

Seems official. Jim Koziarski offered it up to somebody over the phone according to the posting individual. The "grape-vine" says they've tried "versions" of their "you pay us, we put you in the sim with ExpressJet, you get hired, you pay us a finders fee" program on their current flight instructors

ATP used to be trusted. Today, however, I'm skeptical.
 
Well the last thing I want to do is give ATP a bad name. I did all of my ratings with them, Private through Instructor. The last thing I want is to have the flight school I attended to have a bad reputation. But, recent events and decisions made seem to be leading them down the same road that so many hokey flight schools have gone down. First the CRJ sim and now the DA-40. I don't see a need for either by the customer. That's all I'm saying. It's my opinion. It's not ATP bashing, god forbid we wouldn't want that.
 
[ QUOTE ]
Well the last thing I want to do is give ATP a bad name. I did all of my ratings with them, Private through Instructor. The last thing I want is to have the flight school I attended to have a bad reputation. But, recent events and decisions made seem to be leading them down the same road that so many hokey flight schools have gone down. First the CRJ sim and now the DA-40. I don't see a need for either by the customer. That's all I'm saying. It's my opinion. It's not ATP bashing, god forbid we wouldn't want that.

[/ QUOTE ]

To everyone, not just robair, this is a business. It may seem worthless to you to add something like this to their program, but have to know that first and foremost, ATP is a business.

ATP has found ways to offer more, and charge a lot more for it. There are plenty of suckers to take ATP up on theseoffers, so why wouldn't they have it in their business, especially if it makes them $$$?
 
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