AMR to Divest American Eagle

i dont see how you can spin this to say "this is a good thing for eagle." I am good friends with two eagle pilots, both of which are extremely worried. The only good that they think can come of this is a lower upgrade as the senior people leave for a more secure future. Mainline will put any new or even old flying out to bid and sad to say the lowest bidder will get it. I think that a lot of posters are right that AMR will let regionals do their domestic flying while reducing the # of mainline pilots. That does not mean eagle will get that flying but A regional will. Eagle has a decent contract and good pay rates which will make it very uncompetitive when your dealing with a Mesa or Colgan type of operation.

my prediction: eagle gets spun off (CAL and Expressjet), AMR sells off its position in eagle, and replaces eagle with a cheaper regional on routes that will allow it. even in the best (for eagle) scenario you will see a slow reduction in aircraft and employees at eagle.
 
sleepy3528 said:
i dont see how you can spin this to say "this is a good thing for eagle." I am good friends with two eagle pilots, both of which are extremely worried. The only good that they think can come of this is a lower upgrade as the senior people leave for a more secure future. Mainline will put any new or even old flying out to bid and sad to say the lowest bidder will get it. I think that a lot of posters are right that AMR will let regionals do their domestic flying while reducing the # of mainline pilots. That does not mean eagle will get that flying but A regional will. Eagle has a decent contract and good pay rates which will make it very uncompetitive when your dealing with a Mesa or Colgan type of operation.

my prediction: eagle gets spun off (CAL and Expressjet), AMR sells off its position in eagle, and replaces eagle with a cheaper regional on routes that will allow it. even in the best (for eagle) scenario you will see a slow reduction in aircraft and employees at eagle.
Click to expand...
I disagree. As an Eagle pilot, I don't foresee AMR "shopping" too much of its regional flying to the cheapest bidder.

We are not being divested because we are too expensive. On the contrary, we are a very big reason AMR even made a profit this year. AMR was advised by an off-shore bank to divest itself of Eagle to make some immediate cash.

As it's been explained so far is that Eagle will keep all or most of its routes and be able to shop for outside flying on its own.

To me, that doesn't sound like the sky is falling.

But, that's my opinion. Ya'lls mileage may vary.

R2F
 
ready2fly said:
We are not being divested because we are too expensive. On the contrary, we are a very big reason AMR even made a profit this year.
Click to expand...

Rubbish - there may have been an attempt to show Eagle as profitable, but that's just because they assigned you an excessive amount of the revenue. No regional is "profitable" on a "real airline" basis - they are only profitable on a fee for departure basis because the "fee" is not related to the revenue carried - especially for an airline like Eagle flying less than 50 seater jets.

Claiming that Eagle is carrying AMR because it's profitable is the same line of ######## Comair was peddling. A wholly owned can have the figures manipulated anyway they want to show profitabilty, and if you're trying to put lipstick on a pig and get it sold or spun off then of course you mess with the figures to make it look like a cash cow. But NO regional is profitable on a revenue carried basis - none of them. Regionals are a necessary evil to get passengers to hub airports so that the legacy can carry them on mainline aircraft where there is the possibility of making a profit - and it seems these days that only works on international flights.
 
sleepy3528 said:
i dont see how you can spin this to say "this is a good thing for eagle." I am good friends with two eagle pilots, both of which are extremely worried. The only good that they think can come of this is a lower upgrade as the senior people leave for a more secure future. Mainline will put any new or even old flying out to bid and sad to say the lowest bidder will get it. I think that a lot of posters are right that AMR will let regionals do their domestic flying while reducing the # of mainline pilots. That does not mean eagle will get that flying but A regional will. Eagle has a decent contract and good pay rates which will make it very uncompetitive when your dealing with a Mesa or Colgan type of operation.

my prediction: eagle gets spun off (CAL and Expressjet), AMR sells off its position in eagle, and replaces eagle with a cheaper regional on routes that will allow it. even in the best (for eagle) scenario you will see a slow reduction in aircraft and employees at eagle.
Click to expand...

I can see where you're going with this, but there's a big thing you have to look at as well:

Most of the other regionals are operating aircraft with more than 50 seat capacity.

Because of the scope clause APA's contract has with AMR, AMR would face fairly substantial penalties and fines if they were to contract out flying to a company that flies aircraft with more than 50 seats.

As Eagle's present fleet is already 'paid off' or waivered, penalty-wise.. it someone mitigates that scenario you described above.

As for draw downs in personnel, they were doing sim evals until 10 pm last night at the sim building. In fact, I heard a check airman say they had a morning and evening shift going just for simulator evals.

Eagle's got a thin margin in terms of pilot staffing, just like everybody else.. but it's not slowing down, by any means. It's enough to make one wonder.
 
CFIse said:
Rubbish - there may have been an attempt to show Eagle as profitable, but that's just because they assigned you an excessive amount of the revenue. No regional is "profitable" on a "real airline" basis - they are only profitable on a fee for departure basis because the "fee" is not related to the revenue carried - especially for an airline like Eagle flying less than 50 seater jets.

Claiming that Eagle is carrying AMR because it's profitable is the same line of ######## Comair was peddling. A wholly owned can have the figures manipulated anyway they want to show profitabilty, and if you're trying to put lipstick on a pig and get it sold or spun off then of course you mess with the figures to make it look like a cash cow. But NO regional is profitable on a revenue carried basis - none of them. Regionals are a necessary evil to get passengers to hub airports so that the legacy can carry them on mainline aircraft where there is the possibility of making a profit - and it seems these days that only works on international flights.
Click to expand...
Sorry, but point out where I said that Eagle was "carrying" AMR and I'll concede your point.

That said - I didn't.

What I said was that Eagle generated revenue. Period.

It's quite clear, however, that you harbor bitter feelings towards regionals, so debating this subject with you will be pointless. You hold on to that chip on your shoulder and we'll see what pans out.

Best of luck to you.
 
I'm hanging up the Eagle interview for a later date. I don't like the situation. Besides, I've got something else coming up. ;)
 
charlie1017 said:
That could make sense, given that if they lose Executive to other airlines, they'll lose a lot of the business in the San Juan hub and the Caribbean.
Click to expand...
Hehe! Can you imagine if Executive was sold to Caribbean Airlines, LIAT, Air Caribes or even JetBlue?

Alright, enough of my a.net speculation...

This news surprised me, but AMR must have been looking at how CO fared with ExpressJet as one of the factors to determine their decision.
 
Here's my take on it. Eagle will do just fine. Times change and it will be an adjustment for everyone in the company, but think; these guys get to be apart of Eagles coming of age so to speak. It's a new begining and a lot of good can come from this venture.

Granted my initial thought on this subject was good luck!!! But with Eagle's size and the the dependence on them from AMR initially allows them to start looking for new avenues even if AMR starts to bid off Eagles business.

Here's the only way I see anything going bad for them:

Hire Jonathan Ornstein.
 
av8trxx said:
I believe AMR will either force APA into further concessions or it will drive them to a strike.
Click to expand...

No doubt that AMR would like concessions, management would love all employees to work for free, but I can't foresee them being successful with it. They will be screwing themselves, IMHO, if they force concessions. Mainline pilots have already lost enough, post 9/11, for there to be more concessions, on top of that. Pilots will be walking out the door, if that happens, which will screw the airlines when there is nobody to fly the planes. - Sure there are junior FOs at the regionals, that would probably take those jobs, but, I would hope, by then, regional guys would have been educated on the goings on, and not take those jobs.

I am rooting for the APA, as I think American would be leading the industry back to claiming what was lost, if they can get a new contract, with raises, and improved work rules. As I understand it, most legacies, post 9/11, and bankcruptcy contracts become ammendable, in 2010 (correct me if I am wrong). If the APA can get a new contract for AMR pilots, this will be a step in the right direction, as far an improving the pay at the majors.

Personally, I am holding out hope, in that these unions will be able to help restore the profession, and we won't see the downward spiral of the airline industry.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top