Ameriflight

Finhunter89 said:
What do/did you guys do on your layovers other than sleep? I am finding myself a bit stir crazy sitting here in a hotel all day long.
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Visit my dry cleaner, doctor, dentist and grocery store all of which were 200 miles from my home. I had two root canals done while on layover because I did not know any dentist near my home.
 
FlyingScot said:
I got that letter myself and am interested to see where this lawsuit goes. My time with AMF saw some general abuses of pilot's good nature. You are paid 40 hours a week no matter how many hours you worked or sat around in the crash pad. The object of the game was to not get shifts that worked you for more than 6 hours a day. Because of the nature of some runs or bases there were pilots working 10+ hours or 6 days a week for 40 hour/week pay. I was mostly able to avoid these long duty days or runs, but pilots that were forced to that schedule should have gotten paid then or hopefully get paid once the law suit settles.


We're all going to be rich when this is over.
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The legal angle has been used with success up here against a 135 operator. It hinged on the fact that the state did not consider a pilot a professional position so the job fell under the rules of hourly pay and was not allowed the exemptions from overtime that is granted to a salaried professional position.
 
Here is the thing, I am the last person to sue AMF over pay. However the unit system they use is basically hourly pay. Runs being 8 units is implying hourly pay for services rendered. Clearly some pilots work short hours and get paid peanuts, and they're fine with that which is crazy to me. But there are some guys that work long hours, and get paid 8 units. Even though pilots put up with it, nobody should be ok, or happy about the pay, or the pay structure. 16 hour days Monday through Friday, and getting paid 40 units does not add up, no matter what calculator you use.
 
I guess I'll be the one to say it.

We allllllll knew what the deal was when we signed up. What is the sense of complaining about something you AGREED to?
Life isn't fair. Get your hours, move on. If you don't like your situation, do something about it (whining doesn't count as doing something).
 
You agreed to have base managers push you to break regs? You agreed to spend 9 hours in a 2 bedroom apartment with 6 pilots and tell you that is where you can get your rest? You agreed to have the company make you take public transportation for an hour to get back to your base (after a full duty day) because you left the plane at the outstation, and nobody will come pick you up? You agreed to pay 6 dollars a day in bridge tolls making 28k to do a run that isn't outstationed? You agreed to be gone 16 hours a day from home, and paid 8 units?

When I signed up, I agreed to be a professional pilot, to be paid to fly freight. I agreed to the crappy pay, however I did not agree with watching 10 unit runs disappear because the base manager was a scumbag. I didn't agree to fly a run from OAK to BUR at 3am that is supposed to be an out and back, that somehow turned into me covering runs for BUR pilots who were told to call in sick because the OAK pilot will just do it since he is already flying. Where was the extra pay for that?

I can't stand the notion of "you agreed to it so stop complaining." Conditions would never get better anywhere if people didn't stand up to substandard conditions. Sure we all knew the pay going in, but did any of us agree, nor know the actual conditions when coming on? I didn't... I expected a certain level of treatment because I posses common sense, and I have respect for myself, and I have also had prior careers. I expected that a company as large as AMF would have had a certain level of treatment too, and by in large they did, however it was non existent at the base I was at.
 
I didn't agree to any of that, and none of that happened to me. What you allow is what will continue, so if you didn't like it you should have moved on elsewhere. If you didn't, send all complaints to the mirror in front of you. If you did indeed move on WHY are you still so bitter about something in your rearview mirror that presumably doesn't affect you any longer?

A problem without a solution is just a complaint, and I have very little tolerance for grown men that complain instead of taking action. Deal with it or move on, those are your options.
But please, with all due respect, STOP spewing negativity. Or don't. It's your choice.
 
ItsAFunZone said:
I didn't agree to any of that, and none of that happened to me. What you allow is what will continue, so if you didn't like it you should have moved on elsewhere. If you didn't, send all complaints to the mirror in front of you. If you did indeed move on WHY are you still so bitter about something in your rearview mirror that presumably doesn't affect you any longer?

A problem without a solution is just a complaint, and I have very little tolerance for grown men that complain instead of taking action. Deal with it or move on, those are your options.
But please, with all due respect, STOP spewing negativity. Or don't. It's your choice.
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You know what I have a problem with? Grown men who take the abuse and see nothing wrong with it. You think you're any better because you didn't complain? Or did you just put up with things that I mentioned above because you don't see anything wrong with being treated that way? I am not spewing negativity. I made a comment to the 8 unit pay scale and how that can be construed as hourly pay, and you are the one who decided to jump on the soapbox. I just explained my position and how I was treated to show that not everyone worked 3 hour days and were paid 40 units. Some of us had to put up with things that no employer on the planet should get away with.
 
Inverted said:
You know what I have a problem with? Grown men who take the abuse and see nothing wrong with it. You think you're any better because you didn't complain? Or did you just put up with things that I mentioned above because you don't see anything wrong with being treated that way? I am not spewing negativity. I made a comment to the 8 unit pay scale and how that can be construed as hourly pay, and you are the one who decided to jump on the soapbox. I just explained my position and how I was treated to show that not everyone worked 3 hour days and were paid 40 units. Some of us had to put up with things that no employer on the planet should get away with.
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I apologize for jumping down your throat but it just seems to me you have an endless array of things to hate AMF for.

Like I said, NONE of those things happened to me in my time here. Maybe I got lucky, but I have also refused to do things that didn't sit square with me. I have also had to (politely) demand rental cars and hotels and things of that nature when I felt it was owed to me.

Base assignment (choice) also plays a HUGE role in QOL at AMF. Just about everyone in the California bases was living in a pit of misery from what I remember. Maybe I got lucky there too, or maybe I bid wisely. Either way I share none of your negativity about the company. My time here has been great so far and as I prepare to move on I have nothing but gratitude to amf for the last few years I have traded them.
Anyway, sorry for jumping down your throat and have a happier new year!
 
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Inverted said:
You agreed to have base managers push you to break regs? You agreed to spend 9 hours in a 2 bedroom apartment with 6 pilots and tell you that is where you can get your rest? You agreed to have the company make you take public transportation for an hour to get back to your base (after a full duty day) because you left the plane at the outstation, and nobody will come pick you up? You agreed to pay 6 dollars a day in bridge tolls making 28k to do a run that isn't outstationed? You agreed to be gone 16 hours a day from home, and paid 8 units?
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I have experienced none of this. When did you work for AMF? The worst that I can say that has happened is that I have to walk to my layover hotel in Gallup. It's less than .25 miles. The UPS "loaders"... now if I had a sock full of nickels to slap every single one of those people with, I would. Gladly. Twice even.

When I signed up, I agreed to be a professional pilot, to be paid to fly freight. I agreed to the crappy pay, however I did not agree with watching 10 unit runs disappear because the base manager was a scumbag. I didn't agree to fly a run from OAK to BUR at 3am that is supposed to be an out and back, that somehow turned into me covering runs for BUR pilots who were told to call in sick because the OAK pilot will just do it since he is already flying. Where was the extra pay for that?
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That bird wouldn't fly now. One phone call up the line and that would be squashed. Again, when did you work at AMF?

I can't stand the notion of "you agreed to it so stop complaining." Conditions would never get better anywhere if people didn't stand up to substandard conditions. Sure we all knew the pay going in, but did any of us agree, nor know the actual conditions when coming on? I didn't... I expected a certain level of treatment because I posses common sense, and I have respect for myself, and I have also had prior careers. I expected that a company as large as AMF would have had a certain level of treatment too, and by in large they did, however it was non existent at the base I was at.
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It's not so much that you agreed to it that I don't really understand. Nobody willingly signs up for that. Why did you choose to stay at AMF if that was the corporate climate at the time? If you knew it was part of the price of admission into something bigger and better, maybe you paid that price, and didn't get out of it what thought you would. I'm just speculating, really, but it's hard to read stuff that you write because it's old and outdated. Kinda like listening to "INXS" all day.

I'm surprised you haven't talked about the Training Dept yet, honestly.
 
GX said:
I have experienced none of this. When did you work for AMF? The worst that I can say that has happened is that I have to walk to my layover hotel in Gallup. It's less than .25 miles. The UPS "loaders"... now if I had a sock full of nickels to slap every single one of those people with, I would. Gladly. Twice even.



That bird wouldn't fly now. One phone call up the line and that would be squashed. Again, when did you work at AMF?



It's not so much that you agreed to it that I don't really understand. Nobody willingly signs up for that. Why did you choose to stay at AMF if that was the corporate climate at the time? If you knew it was part of the price of admission into something bigger and better, maybe you paid that price, and didn't get out of it what thought you would. I'm just speculating, really, but it's hard to read stuff that you write because it's old and outdated. Kinda like listening to "INXS" all day.

I'm surprised you haven't talked about the Training Dept yet, honestly.
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I worked there from 2011-2012. My new years resolution is to stop talking about my experience at AMF, or add to any negative talk in this thread. I wish you the best of luck at AMF, get great experience, then use that to get a better job to further your career. If you want to know more you can PM me but it sounds like things have changed for the better, and that is awesome!
 
GX said:
I have experienced none of this. When did you work for AMF? The worst that I can say that has happened is that I have to walk to my layover hotel in Gallup. It's less than .25 miles. The UPS "loaders"... now if I had a sock full of nickels to slap every single one of those people with, I would. Gladly. Twice even.



That bird wouldn't fly now. One phone call up the line and that would be squashed. Again, when did you work at AMF?



It's not so much that you agreed to it that I don't really understand. Nobody willingly signs up for that. Why did you choose to stay at AMF if that was the corporate climate at the time? If you knew it was part of the price of admission into something bigger and better, maybe you paid that price, and didn't get out of it what thought you would. I'm just speculating, really, but it's hard to read stuff that you write because it's old and outdated. Kinda like listening to "INXS" all day.

I'm surprised you haven't talked about the Training Dept yet, honestly.
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Again, it comes down to which side of the country you are on. West of DFW is one airline, east is another. The west coast airline is a great place to be. The east coast side blows hard.

But who knows, things may have changed in the 1 months since I ejected out of there.
 
The east coast of AMF was better than west coast. If you could get a lmi/non ups run life was great. (Sort of). I had a glow run in which I flew 3 days a week. Sometimes I'd get called to fly more...after seven months in BUF I elected to go to PDX (hated the cold, the out station sucked, and needed a change). The UPS side is terrible. Terrible schedule, and overall terrible treatment by UPS management. I had a verbal altercation with a ups ramper right before I was due to leave, and my job was semi threatened. (That's another story)

As for the hotels. I never had a terrible one. Hilton to Best Western. The crew apartments are now getting wifi and tv in them. They aren't the cleanest, but it was livable.

I enjoyed my time at AMF, but I'm glad I'm moving on. 121 will offer me a better QOL. I don't see why anyone who wants to go to a major would go to AMF when you have airlines with 1-2 year upgrades and flow through. My experience with that was some pilots thought they were too good for the regionals....and now most are at a regional after ameriflight.

My 02.
 
Beech90 said:
. If you could get a lmi/non ups run life was great. (Sort of). I had a glow run in which I flew 3 days a week.
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I ended up stuck on the worst LMI run in the system. Work 5 days a week, with varying duty days (meaning time of day working) 3 days in a row. It was a real gem... And at least UPS cargo you know the long term health effects up front.

That said, it's a great place to do your time and move on. Don't get stuck
 
KSCessnaDriver said:
Again, it comes down to which side of the country you are on. West of DFW is one airline, east is another. The west coast airline is a great place to be. The east coast side blows hard.

But who knows, things may have changed in the 1 months since I ejected out of there.
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If you are not happy at the Puerto Rico bases I'm convinced you probably wouldn't be happy anywhere at AMF
 
KSCessnaDriver said:
I ended up stuck on the worst LMI run in the system. Work 5 days a week, with varying duty days (meaning time of day working) 3 days in a row. It was a real gem... And at least UPS cargo you know the long term health effects up front.

That said, it's a great place to do your time and move on. Don't get stuck
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How would have liked doing the LMI run in a Lear getting paid close to 6 figures then 6 months later do it in a Metro making less than half that? Ask me how I know...
 
mikecweb said:
How would have liked doing the LMI run in a Lear getting paid close to 6 figures then 6 months later do it in a Metro making less than half that? Ask me how I know...
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That does suck, unfortunately Airnet didn't want to change their business model when Check 21 became a thing. From what I am told a lot of the DHL/UPS stuff that AMF has out of CVG was originally offered to Airnet. Had they taken it AMF likely wouldn't have had the eastern US presence they do today and Airnet would still be carrying all those angry boxes around.
 
Maurus said:
That does suck, unfortunately Airnet didn't want to change their business model when Check 21 became a thing. From what I am told a lot of the DHL/UPS stuff that AMF has out of CVG was originally offered to Airnet. Had they taken it AMF likely wouldn't have had the eastern US presence they do today and Airnet would still be carrying all those angry boxes around.
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By change their business model you mean cut wages in half to compete with the AMF bid?
 
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