Patrick
Well-Known Member
Absolutely true, and I agree.
American Airlines pilots eye strike authorization
- Thread starter derg
- Start date
Absolutely true, and I agree.
Patrick
Well-Known Member
Sadly, this is the case. But, it's not JUST the cogs in the wheel that need to take the hit. None of us want to work more for less, and I don't know about the rest of us here, but I'd be a WHOLE lot more open to the situation if EVERYONE shared in the cuts to keep the company alive, and not just the army of minions, so that the top dogs can reap even bigger bonuses.
It's not aviation, but a friend of mine is an engineer at a supplier to the auto industry (and nowhere near the size of AA or GM or any fortune 100). The company fell on hard times as the economy collapsed, and everyone agreed to pretty substantial pay cuts to keep the company alive (not sure I entirely believe it, but supposedly the President/ founder of the company worked for free for about 3 years). However, last year, he was pleasantly shocked to see a 6-figure bonus on his last paycheck before Christmas. He went in to ask the boss man what the hell it was for, and was told "hey, it's been a rough couple of years, and we really appreciate how the company came together to work hard and keep us alive, and this has been a good year, so we wanted to say thanks." For 2012, his salary is back to what it was pre-08, with COLA's to adjust it up to current market. Needless to say, he has no plans to ever go look for another job.
FlyingScot
Spanish Proficient
When was the last time a court threw out a contract for airline executives?
HVYMETALDRVR
Well-Known Member
How about if everyone says pay us more or we all quit? Like the union and the company are sitting down and the union guy is like "nah it's cool we all quit anyways don't worry about the whole contract thing." Then slams down 3 stacks of 5000+ letters of resignation. The CEO would need a new pair of $1000 pants...
Yeah I know it would never happen but it would be funny!
Yeah I know it would never happen but it would be funny!
Rudabega
Well-Known Member
That would be a strike and we aren't allowed to do it without approval.
The judicial repression is out of hand.
pullup
Homewrecker
z987k
Well-Known Member
It is not, no matter what anyone says. You are always free to quit. You are not a slave.
That being said, the company would cease to exist overnight and you should have no expectation of a job flying for a while.
BobDDuck
Island Bus Driver
There is a lot of case law backing this up. If everybody quits at once it is considered a job action.
crazyjaydawg
Well-Known Member
It is job action, but in quitting you have no right to your job again. Those ae pilots would flow up really fast and you would have some rj drivers brand new 777 captains.
z987k
Well-Known Member
I'd call the bluff and tell them to come arrest 5000 employees for deciding they're not slaves in an election year.
pullup
Homewrecker
I can see that, I just find it hard to believe you can be tied to a job you no longer want to be a part of. Obviously you would give up all claim to your job etc.
ClearedToThe
Well-Known Member
Employment at will. Keep in mind that the majority of pilots at AA make more than majority of people working in management. So a small percentage of movement up or down in the pilot payroll results in large changes in payroll costs for the company.
bronco21016
I know H.T.M.L. (How To Meet Ladies)
So the vote for the strike simply means that the pilot group approves the idea?
What happens after that? Who brings it to the national level to get it approved? Or, rather, how does it get to the national level for approval?
If these guys walk out I'll go stand with them without a doubt.
What happens after that? Who brings it to the national level to get it approved? Or, rather, how does it get to the national level for approval?
If these guys walk out I'll go stand with them without a doubt.
HVYMETALDRVR
Well-Known Member
I said what I did in jest... You are right BobDDuck it is a job action, but they would have a tough time going after ex employees, the union and whoever didnt quit would be left to deal with the lawsuit...
z987k
Well-Known Member
Would there really be one? The company would be gone. If you didn't quit, you might as well. Can you imagine how much it'd cost AA to park airplanes for a single day? That $1.X B loss would be laughable.
falconvalley
Absentee Dad of the OOTSK, Runner, Cat Frustrator
I'm surprised that a lot of people think a job action would result in an arrest if it was not "legal".
Think of it this way- a modern strike is meant to be a legally sanctioned job action. The workers aren't "quitting" per se, but the immediate results are exactly the same. The employee does not show up for work (in a complete strike). If the entire employee group decides to quit without NMB approval for a job action, it's irrelevant why they quit or whether they even wish to come back. The company will sue their union representation entity and case law supports the company's case. Two main scenarios can play out here:
1. The employees are not planning on returning. The local and/or national gets sued and the courts find a judgement and the company may get what it wants or, if the union dissolves or becomes dormant, it may not. No worker returns, no contract is applied any longer. Company may or may not survive, depending on circumstances. A typical airline with fold
2. The workers intend to come back to work. Things can get really complicated but in short, case law still supports the company. The company will surely get restitution and this could severely damage the local and/or national. It certainly wouldn't speed up negotiations. It's kinda like getting a flag for delay of game. The "referees" will see it as something that the union caused that was not necessary. I can see this scenario also divided into 2 different outcomes:
A. The company panics and rushes to get the contract done. Then (or while getting the contract done) asks for an injunction and then sues and the contract could get thrown out. I think it eventually would.
B. The company does not panic and immediately goes to the judge and plays it out in court with little or completely without negotiations.
FlyingScot
Spanish Proficient
I am not talking about management but executives. Way before the recent banking scandal airline executives have a history of declaring bankruptcy to bust a union or void a contract or manipulate the wages of employees lower then give themselves a bonus for their hard work.
Executive compensation at American Airlines raises eyebrows
By D.R. STEWART World Staff Writer Published: 4/19/2010 6:51 PM Last Modified: 4/19/2010 6:51 PM
Several years ago while in Tulsa speaking with company mechanics, American Airlines CEO Gerard Arpey was asked whether executive bonuses could endanger the hard-won cooperation — the “shared sacrifices, shared rewards” — between management and labor.
The bonuses, then as now, are given to executives at a time when American’s unionized mechanics, ground workers, pilots and flight attendants are working under 30 percent wage and benefit cuts agreed to in 2003 to keep the airline out of bankruptcy.
“They’re not bonuses,” Arpey told his questioner. “It’s stock-based compensation.” If it’s mid-April, it’s bonus/stock-based compensation time again at AMR Corp., American’s parent.
AMR is expected to announce the awards Wednesday or Thursday, officials said.
Awarded to the company’s top executives by AMR’s board of directors, the bonuses reward executives for the company’s stock and financial performance.
During the past five years, AMR has awarded top executives more than $300 million in stock-based compensation, officials said.
In 2008, the latest year for which figures are available, Arpey’s total compensation was $3.42 million, of which $2.52 million or 73.7 percent was stock or stock option awards, company records show.
The same year, Chief Financial Officer Thomas Horton received $2.23 million in total compensation, of which $1.05 million or 47 percent was stock or stock option awards, AMR documents say.
In 2008, AMR reported losses of $2.1 billion.
