BajtheJino
I'm looking at you.
I see what you're saying but by the same logic she's only doing what her namesake did-something others had already done before. So in essence she's re-enacting history.
Amelia Earhart
- Thread starter BravoHotel
- Start date
A Life Aloft
Well-Known Member
The problem is that she is not really re-enacting history. She is flying in a modern aircraft with modern tools, GPS and other modern navigational equipment, modern radios, glass cockpit etc., and a CFI. That is a far far cry from what real Amelia did. It's like saying that every F-18 that takes off from a carrier is re-enacting the B-25's taking off from the deck of the Enterprise for the Doolittle raid or that every modern jet that breaks the sound barrier is re-enacting Chuck Yeager's flight in 1947.
Amelia was a true pioneer and the first woman to have many firsts in aviation history. While Wiley Post was the first man to solo the globe in 1933, Amelia would have been the first woman to do so and she came damn close. She was the first person to fly from Hawaii to the mainland. She was one of the first women to compete in Air Derby's in the 20's. She was the first woman to fly an autogiro. She was the first woman to fly non stop and solo from the US across the Atlantic to Europe. She was the first woman to set an altitude record of 14k feet. She set several speed records in her time. She was the first woman to fly solo and non stop across the US. She was the first person to fly Solo from Mexico City to Newark.
So I have to look at equipment, the era that these achievements were made, how they were made and who made them and then I still ask myself........without the name, what is so special about what this other Amelia has done or even plans to do?
When I read about what Lindy went through for years leading up to his historic flight and the plane he flew (the Spirit of St. Louis) and it's design and build and how much he was directly involved in all of this, and what he went through just to get the funding and find an aircraft manufacturer who would build the aircraft (they all had turned him down) and him flying across the Atlantic peering through a periscope in the cold and the dark alone, cramped and surrounded by extra fuel tanks, does this have any comparison at all to flying a 777 across the Atlantic today, even if it flies the same route and the Captain is named Lindbergh? Hardly.
Amelia was a true pioneer and the first woman to have many firsts in aviation history. While Wiley Post was the first man to solo the globe in 1933, Amelia would have been the first woman to do so and she came damn close. She was the first person to fly from Hawaii to the mainland. She was one of the first women to compete in Air Derby's in the 20's. She was the first woman to fly an autogiro. She was the first woman to fly non stop and solo from the US across the Atlantic to Europe. She was the first woman to set an altitude record of 14k feet. She set several speed records in her time. She was the first woman to fly solo and non stop across the US. She was the first person to fly Solo from Mexico City to Newark.
So I have to look at equipment, the era that these achievements were made, how they were made and who made them and then I still ask myself........without the name, what is so special about what this other Amelia has done or even plans to do?
When I read about what Lindy went through for years leading up to his historic flight and the plane he flew (the Spirit of St. Louis) and it's design and build and how much he was directly involved in all of this, and what he went through just to get the funding and find an aircraft manufacturer who would build the aircraft (they all had turned him down) and him flying across the Atlantic peering through a periscope in the cold and the dark alone, cramped and surrounded by extra fuel tanks, does this have any comparison at all to flying a 777 across the Atlantic today, even if it flies the same route and the Captain is named Lindbergh? Hardly.
Oh, I don't see what the big deal is. She's getting some great experience, real-world instruction, and is putting general aviation in a positive light. She seems genuinely enthused about aviation. The Amelia aspect of it is what gets it on the news... big deal. And if she gets a good career out of it all, more power to her.
dustoff17
Still trying to reach the Top Shelf
Amelia was a pioneer but only due to the media attention and the supply of airplanes that her rich husband provided! Anyone, and I mean ANYONE with a few pilot skills, almost unlimited funding, and unlimited media coverage would be able to reach the same iconic level that she did.
Well into her "career" as a pilot, she took off from the (then) Ft Leavenworth airport (KFLV) for a short 20nm trip to her home town of Atchison, KS (K59). It was a simple take off to the north, slight left turn, begin descent. She got lost, flew for more than an hour looking for the K59, and ended up landing well off course! After this flight, she NEVER flew without a navigator (no matter what she flew)!
She understood that pulling the yoke made the trees get small and pushing the yoke made the trees get big. Beyond that, she had little business in the cockpit. She would have NEVER made it past a PPL checkride by today's standards.
Well into her "career" as a pilot, she took off from the (then) Ft Leavenworth airport (KFLV) for a short 20nm trip to her home town of Atchison, KS (K59). It was a simple take off to the north, slight left turn, begin descent. She got lost, flew for more than an hour looking for the K59, and ended up landing well off course! After this flight, she NEVER flew without a navigator (no matter what she flew)!
She understood that pulling the yoke made the trees get small and pushing the yoke made the trees get big. Beyond that, she had little business in the cockpit. She would have NEVER made it past a PPL checkride by today's standards.
A Life Aloft
Well-Known Member
I guess my issue is again the riding the milk wagon of her name. I feel genuinely badly for all the other student pilots doing the exact same thing who will never be on the news, get notoriety for their efforts, write a book, be paid money for their training etc. What she is doing is very ordinary. And I feel she is just exploiting the real Amelia and that bugs me........but hey, that's just my opinion.
A Life Aloft
Well-Known Member
Wow, I hardly know what to say to this. How did she manage to fly before George ever came along? And don't think for a moment that George was not using Amelia in the PR machine and enjoying the notoriety himself and playing the big shot. So all of Amelia solo flights where she flew the entire route as the pilot, and her firsts in those flights mean nothing? And even her finishing the first Women's Air Derby in 1929 when many of the women crashed or had mechanical difficulties and more and some of them never even finished the race and Amelia coming in 3rd was a fluke?
George sought her out. She had gotten her pilot's license in 1921, worked a variety of jobs and saved her money and with a little money from her Mother, bought her first plane. George sought her out in 1928 for a publicity stunt to be part of a crew of men who were going to cross the Atlantic. She accomplished her own dream and flew solo across the Atlantic in 1932. During her entire life she worked to promote aviation and women's roles in aviation.
I am sorry that you feel the need to belittle her the way that you have.
A Life Aloft
Well-Known Member
Ain't that the truth. lmaoExploit away, I say. There ain't no such thing as selling out - just ask Metallica.
The Ian Js and Life Alofts of this world just have to work a little harder to cover our nut.
dustoff17
Still trying to reach the Top Shelf
Even a broken analog clock is right twice a day.
As for the Derby, you might have missed a key factor in just how far behind the second place plane she was. She FOLLOWED the plane in front of her!
gne in prog
Well-Known Member
You guys are arguing beyond my historical knowledge. Who has sources?
The first women aviators are true pioneers and heroes for me. The Likes of Amelia, Pancho Barnes, Achsa Donnels, Bobbi Trout, Beryl Markham, Rosella Bjornson, Frances Wilson Grayson, Evelyn Johnson, Katherine Stinson, Betty Skelton, Patty Wagstaff and so many more are a real inspiration to all aviators. I encourage everyone to read the bios and the books written about some of these women. A great book is Spitfire Women of WWII by Giles Whittell and my well worn copy of West With The Night by Beryl Markham and and also The Happy Bottom Riding Club, the Life and Times of Pancho Barnes. Ladies Love Taildraggers is a great site and they also have some wonderful videos on UTube. http://www.ladieslovetaildraggers.com/
Amelia has always had a special place in my heart. She had the vision, determination and courage to make her dreams a reality.
"After midnight the moon set and I was alone with the stars. I have often said that the lure of flying is the lure of beauty, and I need no other flight to convince me that the reason flyers fly, whether they know it or not, is the esthetic appeal of flying.The stars seemed near enough to touch and never before have I seen so many. I always believed the lure of flying is the lure of beauty, but I was sure of it that night. " AE
"The most difficult thing is the decision to act, the rest is merely tenacity. The fears are paper tigers. You can do anything you decide to do. You can act to change and control your life; and the procedure, the process is its own reward." AE
"My ambition is to have this wonderful gift produce practical results for the future of commercial flying and for the women who may want to fly tomorrow's planes." AE
"Courage is the price that Life exacts for granting peace, The soul that knows it not, knows no release from little things." AE
No Bessie Coleman? Boooooooooo.
A Life Aloft
Well-Known Member
Monday, August 26, 1926 was an easy day with one leg into Cleveland. The Columbus take-off was done in one-minute intervals in terms of standings so that the ladies would arrive in Cleveland in order of standing in the race. This meant that Thaden and O'Donnell were lined up side-by-side for take-off on the same runway, a first. Earhart was behind them with Noyes following. Thaden made it first into Cleveland from Santa Monica, California, a course of over 2700 miles, nine days, and logging over twenty hours of flying time. One short leg on the final day. Columbus to Cleveland. They took off together. They were all close to one another and following one another. Seriously, your response is rather pathetic. If Amelia was just "following", she should have been following Thaden as she and Thaden were tied for first place at the start of the third leg.
Do you have the arrival times of Louise Thaden, Gladys O'Donnell, Amelia Earhart, Blanche Noyes, Ruth Elder, Neva Paris, Mary Haizlip, Opal Kunz, Mary von Mach, and Vera Dawn Walker for the last leg? Please post them. All of them, along with the source.
Do you have the arrival times of Louise Thaden, Gladys O'Donnell, Amelia Earhart, Blanche Noyes, Ruth Elder, Neva Paris, Mary Haizlip, Opal Kunz, Mary von Mach, and Vera Dawn Walker for the last leg? Please post them. All of them, along with the source.
ctab5060X
Well-Known Member
Houston
Well-Known Member
I'm shocked that you didn't mention Bessie Coleman.
She was America's first black female pilot. She struggled for everything she ever received. She had to learn French and travel to France because no American flight school would teach her. She was a truly inspirational American.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bessie_Coleman
It's been a while since I last read about Amelia E., but most things were not praising her skills as a pilot. She didn't lack courage, and the media coverage, along with being the first woman to do what she did, made her a legend. Personally, when it comes to stick and rudder skills I prefer Amelia Reid. Might have something to do with local pride, as I did my CFI training at the club she founded, which is now owned by one of her former students 
.
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BEEF SUPREME
Well-Known Member
I did ask about that. It didn't seem important at the time. I'm not too hung up on the details. I'm usually really not hung up on details when I'm hanging out with a good looking member of the opposite sex. I certainly didn't hassle her about it. If I remember she had a PPL and had done quite a bit of the IR as well. We spoke about her instructors and a few other things.
When I meet someone I don't start out with I fly jets. I just said I was in town for fun and avoided talking about aviation at first.
That's how I roll.
From what I remember there was an actual family connection, it was distant and she was genuinely interested in aviation.
She was fun to be around, smart and good looking. I meet a lot of famous people at work. Overall she was nice and genuine for a local celeb. She didn't seem to be trying to use her background or name for fame. Mostly she was just having fun.
Don't be a hater
A Life Aloft
Well-Known Member
I listed a few off the top of my head that had immediately come to mind and then said "and so many more." I was not intentionally trying to leave out anyone nor list every single female pilot. It's a very long list in all truth.
A Life Aloft
Well-Known Member
I never said she was any Bob Hoover in terms of being an ace aviator. It was her attitude, what she did manage to accomplished at her time in history, her courage, her faith, her determination, being a woman, her writings, and so much more that has made her an inspiration for me (along with many other historical aviators).It's been a while since I last read about Amelia E., but most things were not praising her skills as a pilot. She didn't lack courage, and the media coverage, along with being the first woman to do what she did, made her a legend. Personally, when it comes to stick and rudder skills I prefer Amelia Reid. Might have something to do with local pride, as I did my CFI training at the club she founded, which is now owned by one of her former students
WacoFan
Bigly
Jackie Cochran is a name that is missed - great flyer. Bessie Coleman was a lady flyer...AND black....which in those days made everything harder. Wiki her - it is well worth reading.
The Cirrus offends me. As if flying a Cirrus has anything to do with a Mystery Ship (Pancho Barnes), a Vega (Earhart), Wedell-Williams (Haizlip), et al. - no plastic, nosedragging, parachute equipped planes in that bunch.
You can mock Earhart's flying abilities all day - and lots of people do. I might as well - after I've gotten lots of Vega and Electra time. I mean, I once (slow-speed) groundlooped an Aeronca Chief - I'm not ripping on anyone.
The Cirrus offends me. As if flying a Cirrus has anything to do with a Mystery Ship (Pancho Barnes), a Vega (Earhart), Wedell-Williams (Haizlip), et al. - no plastic, nosedragging, parachute equipped planes in that bunch.
You can mock Earhart's flying abilities all day - and lots of people do. I might as well - after I've gotten lots of Vega and Electra time. I mean, I once (slow-speed) groundlooped an Aeronca Chief - I'm not ripping on anyone.