Alaskan DPE pulled, 140 check rides up for a re-test

killbilly said:
What @SteveC said is correct - they just have to SCHEDULE the 709 ride with an ASI. Given how backed up FSDOs are these days, that's gonna take a while. However, if they're only going to make the applicants shoot precision approaches, they can probably knock this out in relatively short order.

Regarding the approach.....I believe - and I think we have more than one DPE here who can verify - you can use the LPV in lieu of an ILS for a precision approach if it meets specific criteria, but it doesn't relieve you of the obligation to shoot approaches from two different NAV sources. In other words, you can't have a GPS-only equipped airplane (common with EAB aircraft) for a check ride shooting an RNAV to LPV mins for a precision and then an RNAV approaches for NP to LNAV mins, for example. Gotta have some VHF in there somewhere.
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So what happens to the poor pilots in the meantime? Are they not allowed to exercise instrument privileges? Only requiring the precision approach makes sense, but I hadn’t seen that mentioned as an option anywhere before.
 
alaskadrifter said:
So what happens to the poor pilots in the meantime? Are they not allowed to exercise instrument privileges? Only requiring the precision approach makes sense, but I hadn’t seen that mentioned as an option anywhere before.
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I'm pretty sure that nothing happens to them unless/until they fail the re-check. Business as usual until then.
 
alaskadrifter said:
Fair question. I had read it as 15 days to get-er-dun, but I may be wrong.
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My understanding is it's "15 days to get it on the schedule with an ASI sometime before summer"

The FSDO doesn't want this workload on their plate any more than the pilots in question want to redo their rides. Note that this will be a 709 ride, not a repeat checkride the ASI has a bit more leeway to give in a 709 ride.
 
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rframe said:
Did you do an instrument or CFI-I ride with Don Lee?

www.adn.com

FAA tosses flight tests by well-known bush pilot, throwing some Alaska aviators into limbo

Pilots who took certain “check rides” from Talkeetna’s Don Lee will need to get re-certified — generally within 15 days of getting a Federal Aviation Administration notice.
www.adn.com www.adn.com
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You know... despite the fact that our POI has been AWOL for 4 months, maybe at least somebody at the FAA is actually working in service to his mission.

Sounds like a Sheble to me.

Then again, in this post-CF, post-pandemic, millennial world, I'm pretty sure I'm just lacking the new rule book.

Anyone got a "NEWRULEBOOK.pdf" they can send me?

You can differentiate it from the old rule book by looking for "Chapter 3: Standards". There will not be a Chapter three in the new pub.
 
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CFI A&P said:
One DPE that was in hot water for not being thorough enough on the check ride. They were caught when the FSDO audited the school's records and found the renter didn't have the airplane long enough to complete all necessary tasks on the ACS/PTS.

Another DPE in our area was famous for finding creative ways to fail students. One egregious example was failing an instrument student for poor crosswind landings - except that maneuver wasn't on the PTS.
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Miami FSDO?
 
Have people redo a checkride from almost 5 years ago? What kind of • is that? No common sense here from FAA, imo. I can understand a recent ride that you have proof may not have been up to standards, but dating that far back after a majority of those pilots probably used and exercised that license during this time makes no sense to me.

But hey, let’s keep the written test around…

The more experience I get in this industry seems like the less sense FAA makes on a daily basis. Typical government
 
tcco94 said:
Have people redo a checkride from almost 5 years ago? What kind of • is that? No common sense here from FAA, imo. I can understand a recent ride that you have proof may not have been up to standards, but dating that far back after a majority of those pilots probably used and exercised that license during this time makes no sense to me.

But hey, let’s keep the written test around…

The more experience I get in this industry seems like the less sense FAA makes on a daily basis. Typical government
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You wanna see this one from 2008 Checkride reexaminations may be required for some pilots — General Aviation News
 
alaskadrifter said:
So what happens to the poor pilots in the meantime? Are they not allowed to exercise instrument privileges? Only requiring the precision approach makes sense, but I hadn’t seen that mentioned as an option anywhere before.
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It's an option because it's a 709 ride - like @USMCmech said, the ASI has a lot of latitude on this. And yeah, this has to suck for them, too.

I also find this one kind of interesting, because they've targeted IR/CFII stuff. Typically in a DPE-checkride-recall situation, the applicant is absolved from the 709 ride if they've passed a more advanced check ride after the one in question. So, theoretically, if any of these applicants have gone on and passed an ATP ride, for example, they'll probably be exempt.

What I'm curious about is if any of them passed an MEI or CMEL ride, since a single-engine approach is on both check ride criteria, if there was a precision approach, (or whatever IR criteria is in question) would that satisfy the FSDO/ASI?

EDIT: single engine approach isn't on the MEI ride. Bummer.
 
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killbilly said:
It's an option because it's a 709 ride - like @USMCmech said, the ASI has a lot of latitude on this. And yeah, this has to suck for them, too.

I also find this one kind of interesting, because they've targeted IR/CFII stuff. Typically in a DPE-checkride-recall situation, the applicant is absolved from the 709 ride if they've passed a more advanced check ride after the one in question. So, theoretically, if any of these applicants have gone on and passed an ATP ride, for example, they'll probably be exempt.

What I'm curious about is if any of them passed an MEI or CMEL ride, since a single-engine approach is on both check ride criteria, if there was a precision approach, (or whatever IR criteria is in question) would that satisfy the FSDO/ASI?
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I don't remember a single engine approach being on an MEI add-on.
 
ahw01 said:
I don't remember a single engine approach being on an MEI add-on.
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I can't remember if it was an ACS standard (and I'm too lazy to look it up) but I know that I taught it on my MEI ride.

EDIT: Okay, I'm not too lazy. I looked it up. And it's not in there. Bummer for MEIs.
 
killbilly said:
I also find this one kind of interesting, because they've targeted IR/CFII stuff. Typically in a DPE-checkride-recall situation, the applicant is absolved from the 709 ride if they've passed a more advanced check ride after the one in question. So, theoretically, if any of these applicants have gone on and passed an ATP ride, for example, they'll probably be exempt.
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I did notice somewhere it mentioned that there might be exceptions. One would think an ATP ride with another examiner might do that. Also, perhaps if one had evidence that they DID fly the right combination of approaches on their checkride with this guy (if that was the root cause for the FAA's action). Dunno, all speculation.
 
Hey, that name looks familiar! Checks logbook. Yup, July 2018 did my float plane license with him.

For what it's worth, it was a great experience and I didn't sense anything out of the ordinary in his check ride vs any of the other dozen or so times I've gone up with a DPE over the years.

I've been through a 121 indoc and initial type rating since then and a number of CQs, but when I read the notice I can't help but wonder if I'll be seeing a letter in the future myself. "All airmen who were tested by and received certificates or ratings from Mr. Lee during the cited time period (July 2018 through May 2022) will be reexamined by an FAA inspector." The only exemption listed was if you did the Instrument with him and subsequently got an ATP in the same category and class. That's not me. Would be a huge bummer if I had to surrender my ASES that I got just to get and haven't used since.
 
Landis said:
Hey, that name looks familiar! Checks logbook. Yup, July 2018 did my float plane license with him.

For what it's worth, it was a great experience and I didn't sense anything out of the ordinary in his check ride vs any of the other dozen or so times I've gone up with a DPE over the years.

I've been through a 121 indoc and initial type rating since then and a number of CQs, but when I read the notice I can't help but wonder if I'll be seeing a letter in the future myself. "All airmen who were tested by and received certificates or ratings from Mr. Lee during the cited time period (July 2018 through May 2022) will be reexamined by an FAA inspector." The only exemption listed was if you did the Instrument with him and subsequently got an ATP in the same category and class. That's not me. Would be a huge bummer if I had to surrender my ASES that I got just to get and haven't used since.
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You’re good. Paragraph 6(a): “The reexaminations will be limited to Instrument Ratings and Flight Instructor Instrument exams.”
 
Well, fingers crossed, because I’m certainly not too interested in finding a clapped out float plane to do an instrument check ride with a Fed just to be able to go to work flying a 737.

Technically, although it would be a dumb idea, when I passed my ASES with Don I am now authorized to teach instrument flying in a SE sea plane. I’m not interested in demonstrating that ability.
 
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