About that time T-38s or T-1s?

[MikeD]

On the USAF side, at least, O-1s and O-2s should never make choices about ANYTHING in their career based on perceptions/beliefs/rumors/conventional wisdom about chances of future promotion.

By the time one gets to the O-4 and above ranks where promotions are truly competitive, it's 10 years down the road in your career. 10 years might as well be a lifetime in the military, and just about anything and everything can change during that time. Whatever is 'true' today will very likely be different by the time you get to that point...including your own personal desires about what you want from the military and life.

The number O-1s I saw who were in Phase III UPT or at FTUs who were so deeply concerned about where and when they were doing their master's degrees, or were doing them concurrently, was very disconcerting.

Their job should be sitting in the vault and getting smart. However, Big Blue has certainly conditioned them early.

 

[bunk22]

as i was discussing with bunk, I was told, that with that track chance of promotions were slim.

Not so sure I said that. A COD pilot can make O-5, no problem. In the Navy, one has to have a command in order to make O-6 so former COD skippers make O-6 as well. A COD guy, IMO, will never make Flag rank.

 

[BAMCIS]

Probably not relevant, but I was all about strike going through primary. Fate found me in maritime, where I very quickly came to realize was where I belonged all along. I have seldom heard anyone (in my albeit limited experience) speak disparagingly about their own community. Even the UAV guys I have talked with espouse the superiority of the UAV. I think whatever you choose and wherever you end up, you're going to come to regard it as the absolute best possible place to be. That has been my experience, at least.

 

[///AMG]

I think that is good gouge BAMCIS.....I've yet to meet a guy/gal who doesn't like their community, at least in terms of the aircraft specifically.

 

[MikeD]

I think that is good gouge BAMCIS.....I've yet to meet a guy/gal who doesn't like their community, at least in terms of the aircraft specifically.

Is there anything good about the E-6 community?

 

[BAMCIS]

They seem to like it...

 

[MikeD]

They seem to like it...

Is it pretty easygoing, for the most part? Or do the fun police work in that community too?

 

[///AMG]

Is it pretty easygoing, for the most part? Or do the fun police work in that community too?

It sounds more relaxed than VP from what I've heard, but then again they are pretty handcuffed from going anywhere cool on roadshows or the like because of all the secret squirrel stuff in the back.

 

[bunk22]

We have an E-6 pilot down here in Kingsville, he liked it well enough but not going back. Boring flying.

 

[MikeD]

It sounds more relaxed than VP from what I've heard, but then again they are pretty handcuffed from going anywhere cool on roadshows or the like because of all the secret squirrel stuff in the back.

We have an E-6 pilot down here in Kingsville, he liked it well enough but not going back. Boring flying.

Yeah, when the E-6 shows up at KDMA, it's treated just like the AF E-4B......parked by it's lonesome with entry control points around it and dedicated armed security.

 

[BAMCIS]

The E-6 guys in maritime are definitely laid back. It seems like the lifestyle is extremely relaxed and easy. I can't imagine the flying is too exciting, but the dudes that go that route don't seem to be looking to put the dirty side up anymore.

I flew with a Herc guy recently, however, that showed me a thing or two. Pretty awesome.

 

[bunk22]

The E-6 guys in maritime are definitely laid back. It seems like the lifestyle is extremely relaxed and easy. I can't imagine the flying is too exciting, but the dudes that go that route don't seem to be looking to put the dirty side up anymore.

I flew with a Herc guy recently, however, that showed me a thing or two. Pretty awesome.

Pilots get used to flying straight and level, doing nothing but benign maneuvers. Get them to T-34C or T-6A/B land and things change. I was way out of the loop so to speak when I became a T-34C IP after flying the COD for 8 years. It helped though when I transitioned to the T-45C as I was used to being upside sideways, etc. I used to hear studs talk about not liking the C45XX block at all. I told them get through it, go P-3/E-6/Helo and you'll never have to go upside again, intentionally at least.

 

[BAMCIS]

I loved C45XX. There were plenty of helo guys that hated it, but I couldn't get enough. Also, I thought the training value of it was very high, and not just because I liked it. It was a great demonstration of using all the forces together to manage the energy state, as well as exposing the pilot to extreme angles of bank and pitch, which instilled confidence not only in the aircraft, but the pilot's own abilities. Same with spins, I could spin all day. A lot of the prop guys are very happy never to have too do it again though.

 

[CzechAirman]

I guess I'm biased and don't get my wrong, I have tons of respect for the heavy drivers out there, but I think if you go T-1's you will always wonder "what's it like to fly one of those pointy fast jets?" And for good reason, because it's pretty damn cool.

That said - the fighter world is brutal. I'm just finishing the Viper B course and already I'm exhausted, with no additional duties, from 12+ hour days and spending all my spare time in the vault. So understand that there are pros and cons to both tracks. I do think the -38 will give you more options since they are dropping heavies out of those too. Just don't get slow in the final turn...

Vault? You doing planning for your SIOP mission?

 

[MercFE]

Is there anything good about the E-6 community?

Gotta say, I LOVE it! 17 year Navy enlisted that has done other stuff both overseas and stateside. Now stationed as a Flight Engineer on the Mighty Merc.

Family life is excellent compared to the ship... Get to travel fairly routinely. Only thing that sorta sucks about it is the on again/off again way of deployments.

When I first came to TACAMO, I really didn't know what it had to offer. But glad that I wound up here for the past 9 years of my career!

 

[bunk22]

I loved C45XX. There were plenty of helo guys that hated it, but I couldn't get enough. Also, I thought the training value of it was very high, and not just because I liked it. It was a great demonstration of using all the forces together to manage the energy state, as well as exposing the pilot to extreme angles of bank and pitch, which instilled confidence not only in the aircraft, but the pilot's own abilities. Same with spins, I could spin all day. A lot of the prop guys are very happy never to have too do it again though.

IMO, I think every Navy pilot should do a tour as a primary IP, it is such a good way to continue to develop and finesse basic flying skills. I did so many spins and OCF stuff as a primary IP...stuff you don't and won't get as a E-6/E-2/C-2 pilot. I seriously don't recall any of that stuff from primary as I did maybe a half-dozen spins. I've done 100+ now, it's good to know flying.

 

[MikeD]

Gotta say, I LOVE it! 17 year Navy enlisted that has done other stuff both overseas and stateside. Now stationed as a Flight Engineer on the Mighty Merc.

Family life is excellent compared to the ship... Get to travel fairly routinely. Only thing that sorta sucks about it is the on again/off again way of deployments.

When I first came to TACAMO, I really didn't know what it had to offer. But glad that I wound up here for the past 9 years of my career!

Cool. So long as you enjoy what you're doing, then the job is a great one. And all have their ups and downs.

Curiously, are E-6s something a pilot could get assigned to out of flightschool? Or is it a job that you come to from another community, such as P-3s, first? If not, what is the most common background that pilots have come from, if any? Also, are there any NFO crewmembers onboard?

 

[MercFE]

Curiously, are E-6s something a pilot could get assigned to out of flightschool? Or is it a job that you come to from another community, such as P-3s, first? If not, what is the most common background that pilots have come from, if any? Also, are there any NFO crewmembers onboard?

While we have had a couple transition guys come to the community, primarily from the shutdown of S-3s, pilots mainly come straight out of training. Once within, the standard "career path" pushed on them takes them from JO to Flight Instruction to Disassociated and back for DH tour.

Normal crew for an E-6 is around 13 or 14. 3 Pilots, 2 NFOs, 2 Flight Engineers, 2 In Flight Techs, 3 Airborne Communicators, and 1 or 2 Reel Operators.

 

[MikeD]

While we have had a couple transition guys come to the community, primarily from the shutdown of S-3s, pilots mainly come straight out of training. Once within, the standard "career path" pushed on them takes them from JO to Flight Instruction to Disassociated and back for DH tour.

Normal crew for an E-6 is around 13 or 14. 3 Pilots, 2 NFOs, 2 Flight Engineers, 2 In Flight Techs, 3 Airborne Communicators, and 1 or 2 Reel Operators.

The NFOs do a navigator job? Or more an ECM job? (if releasable info)

Battle staff-wise, is the aircraft jointly manned with AF personnel, since it now does the job of the former USAF EC-135s?

An interesting aircraft indeed. When you guys come through KDMA, your jet is often parked on the north ramp right next to my unit's ramp, with the requisite security.

 

[MercFE]

The NFOs do a navigator job? Or more an ECM job? (if releasable info)

NFO's act as the Communications Officer primarily. They do claim some "Strategic Navigation," learning to assist during air refueling and such, just to keep them as NFO's and not SWO's.

Battle staff-wise, is the aircraft jointly manned with AF personnel, since it now does the job of the former USAF EC-135s?

Battlestaff is provided by USSTRATCOM up at Offutt AFB in Nebraska. Part of our three week deployment is a week of alert up there. When they're on board, the crew normally max's out at our limit of 23 people on board. STRATCOM is a joint command, primarily AF personnel, but quite number of each branch. Typically, we'll fly with a 1 or 2 star on board, normally an AF or Navy type.

An interesting aircraft indeed. When you guys come through KDMA, your jet is often parked on the north ramp right next to my unit's ramp, with the requisite security.

Yeah, the Strategic Command tie makes its a pretty impressive aircraft. Not too many aircraft around that can launch ICBMs, when properly configured. Security can be a chore sometimes.

Of course, I have to say the ties to the Strategic mission are part of the appeal... When I first went to enlist, I thought about AF, but the Navy advancement was much better. Now I have the best of both worlds... I'm in the Navy, but normally deploy to AF bases and get the AF aircrew treatment, which is MUCH better than the Navy's lack of understanding about what an "alert" aircraft and its crew does.