My friend was doing an instrument check ride today with the FAA and he did great and thought he passed etc. What they failed him on was that when he was doing a partial panel VOR approach he went down to mins and had to do a circle to land, so the Examiner said take off your hood and circle north. So he took off his hood and the mda was like 630 or something so during the vfr circle to land he descended down to 600 or possibly a little lower but that is what he failed on. So I just wanted to know what all of you thought about this? I was always the impression that when you go visual that as long as you can see the runway and are within the category of your airplane with distance that altitude didn't matter. As long as you are in a position to land. So let me hear what you think....
? about instrument check ride
- Thread starter Tazman282
- Start date
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So he took off his hood and the mda was like 630 or something so during the vfr circle to land he descended down to 600 or possibly a little lower but that is what he failed on.
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Never ever go below MDA. Obviously you will have to go below to land, but when circling, never go below MDA. Better to be a little high, than a little low. If you were in IMC and went below MDA, you might not be able to see some obstacle to which the MDA will protect you from.
<this coming from someone who will be taking the IFR checkride by the middle of the month>
So he took off his hood and the mda was like 630 or something so during the vfr circle to land he descended down to 600 or possibly a little lower but that is what he failed on.
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Never ever go below MDA. Obviously you will have to go below to land, but when circling, never go below MDA. Better to be a little high, than a little low. If you were in IMC and went below MDA, you might not be able to see some obstacle to which the MDA will protect you from.
<this coming from someone who will be taking the IFR checkride by the middle of the month>
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In regards to the IMC. You would not be circling if you were IMC. If you were to lose contact with the airport while circling you would immediately go missed.
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Not entirely so. You could get to the MDA in IMC and have only a portion of the req'd visual ref's and still continue the approach. If you do go missed, you would make a climbing turn towards the ldg. rw and continue according to the missed approach instructions.
In regards to the IMC. You would not be circling if you were IMC. If you were to lose contact with the airport while circling you would immediately go missed.
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Not entirely so. You could get to the MDA in IMC and have only a portion of the req'd visual ref's and still continue the approach. If you do go missed, you would make a climbing turn towards the ldg. rw and continue according to the missed approach instructions.
BobDDuck
Island Bus Driver
As JEP said, you can't go below MDA until you are in a "normal position" to land. What normal is, could be up for some interpretation, but I have always read it as that you will continue a constant descent, using normal (for aircraft type) pitch and speed. 91.175 I think (I left my FAR at the office so I can't be sure.)
Ethan
Ethan
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However, in regards to going below MDA while circling, I thought that it never stated that you must stay at or above the mda. Perhaps I am wrong.
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For the purpose of the test, although you may be VFR, you are simulating IMC and in IMC you never, never, go below MDA until in position to make a "Normal" final approach to landing. If you are on a downwind leg, say midfield, you could not make a Normal approach to landing. Therefore you do not go below MDA until you can do so.
However, in regards to going below MDA while circling, I thought that it never stated that you must stay at or above the mda. Perhaps I am wrong.
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For the purpose of the test, although you may be VFR, you are simulating IMC and in IMC you never, never, go below MDA until in position to make a "Normal" final approach to landing. If you are on a downwind leg, say midfield, you could not make a Normal approach to landing. Therefore you do not go below MDA until you can do so.
PhotoPilot
New Member
According to the infamous FARs (91.175(c)), a pilot may descend below MDA/DH when three conditions are met. First, the pilot must be in a position to make a normal descent to land using normal maneuvers and a normal rate of descent. Second, flight visibility must be at or above the value specified for your category and the conditions under which the approach is made (circling, straight in, GS out, etc.). Lastly, the airport environment must be in sight (There's a specific list of 10 items that constitute the 'airport environment' in the FARs.).
The first item is the one that likely caught your buddy. If he dropped below MDA before he was ready to make his final descent to land, he busted the FAR. Even if he was circling to land and the airport was in sight, it's always possible that he might fly back into a cloud and once again be in IMC . . . and below a safe altitude. Even though you have 'gone visual,' the approach isn't over until the airplane is safely on the ground or you've canceled IFR.
Better luck next time . . .
The first item is the one that likely caught your buddy. If he dropped below MDA before he was ready to make his final descent to land, he busted the FAR. Even if he was circling to land and the airport was in sight, it's always possible that he might fly back into a cloud and once again be in IMC . . . and below a safe altitude. Even though you have 'gone visual,' the approach isn't over until the airplane is safely on the ground or you've canceled IFR.
Better luck next time . . .