AA (Aviation and Alcohol)

Chris_Ford said:
One could make a case then that it is influenced by alcohol, could one not?
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it may be "influenced" by alchohol... but by the time you get a hangover, all the alchohol is gone from your system and your body is craving rehydration because it didn't have enough while you were drinking - hence the dryness, headache, cotton mouth that is a hangover!!
 
Kristie said:
it may be "influenced" by alchohol... but by the time you get a hangover, all the alchohol is gone from your system and your body is craving rehydration because it didn't have enough while you were drinking - hence the dryness, headache, cotton mouth that is a hangover!!
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Great Answer! Somebody give that lady a cigar :)
 
skydog said:
Just learned that a former co-worker of mine got busted yesterday in a random drug and alcohol test. He was escorted off the property.

Yesterday he was making good money, and because of his seniority, could pretty much hold whatever schedule he wanted. Today he is unemployed, and unemployable, at least in this business. Some Christmas present!

As we move into the Holidays, remember to "Think before you drink."
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So we still don't know, was it drugs or alcohol? Or both?
 
skydog said:
I don't really know for sure, but knowing this guy, it was probably alcohol.
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Assuming it was alcohol, and since it is legal to drink, I guess that would mean that he was tested at work, or at least while on duty and came up over the limit?

It is not my place to pass judgment, but that would really be asking for it.

I was under the impression that a pilot that was caught over the limit could also be subject to civil or criminal penalties, on top of dismissal?

Either way I feel bad for the guy, but it sounds like he might need help.
 
Keep in mind that the 'limit' for most airlines is a 'traceable amount'.

Remember, the "8 hour" rule and the .04 FAA BAC limit are mutually exclusive rules.

You can have a .02 BAC during a standard drug & alcohol random screening, probably not get violated by the FAA but would be suspended/fired by your employer.
 
Doug Taylor said:
Keep in mind that the 'limit' for most airlines is a 'traceable amount'.

Remember, the "8 hour" rule and the .04 FAA BAC limit are mutually exclusive rules.

You can have a .02 BAC during a standard drug & alcohol random screening, probably not get violated by the FAA but would be suspended/fired by your employer.
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I didn't know that, I always thought that airlines rules were inline with FAA rules.

However, I do recall, I guess about a year ago (I am sure others on the board will remember better then I) two pilots being faced with some sort of civil charges after they were caught intoxicated shortly before there flight was to depart.

When does the law get involved, and not jut you employer or the FAA?
 
X-Forces said:
I didn't know that, I always thought that airlines rules were inline with FAA rules.

However, I do recall, I guess about a year ago (I am sure others on the board will remember better then I) two pilots being faced with some sort of civil charges after they were caught intoxicated shortly before there flight was to depart.

When does the law get involved, and not jut you employer or the FAA?
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Well, consider the two rules like this. You can be on a day-long bender, stop drinking brandy alexanders 9 hours prior to duty. You get a full night of sleep go to work and indicate a .04 BAC, you're in violation of othe .04 BAC FAA rule, even though you aren't in violation of the 8 hour "bottle to throttle rule".

That distinction, I think, has gotten A LOT of guys in trouble for not understanding that difference.

Adhering to the "8 hour" rule will not protect you from the FAA's .04 BAC limit or many airline's .02 BAC limit.

Even the "12 hour rule" that many airlines have will not protect you from the BAC limits either, depending on what you've been doing.

A couple of drinks with dinner is hunky dory, but if you're planning on partying "college style" on a layover, or have been, you're rolling the dice.
 
Doug Taylor said:
Keep in mind that the 'limit' for most airlines is a 'traceable amount'.

Remember, the "8 hour" rule and the .04 FAA BAC limit are mutually exclusive rules.

You can have a .02 BAC during a standard drug & alcohol random screening, probably not get violated by the FAA but would be suspended/fired by your employer.
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WOW! That's scary. Is that a Delta rule, or a DOT rule? I've never been told what the threshold was that they're screening for. I always assumed if you followed the FAA 8 hour bottle to throttle rule you were golden?

Not that it's a major issue for me. I'm kind of a wuss and rarely drink while out on a trip. I don't like the way I feel the next day, and 7 leg days like that are murder, legal or no.
 
E6BAV8R said:
Throw food in that mix and unusual attitudes start getting fun.
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OMG! Just thinking about that makes me want to puke. I've only drank enough to have a hang over a couple times, but I seriously can't immagine trying to fly with a hangover. I can barely even walk with a hangover.

On a side note...sometimes 8 hours is not enough. Sometimes 12 hours is not enough. If you do some heavy partying, it can take up to 24 hours to really sober up. NEVER drink more than 1 or 2 if you are flying any time the following day.
 
The .04 is FAA, the "traceable amount" (aka .02 BAC which is supposedly the lowest traceable amount) is what many airlines use as criteria.

I might be talking out of my butt, but that distinction is what gets a lot of pilots in trouble.

Back in the old Southernjets Express days on the 737, I was on a 22 hour layover in PBI and went to the local layover crew dive for a burger and a beer. There were a LOT of folks partying like it was 1999. A crew from another airline (you can tell, it's not that hard), who had seemingly been there for a LONG time were doing jaegermeister shots and were laughing about how slow the bartender was because they were pressing up against the 8 hour limit and had to leave soon.

Classic example. You can't pound beers and do jager shots like you're pledging a fraternity and expect the "8 hour" rule to bring you below the .04 FAA limit or your airlines .02 limit.

That's not the way the body works and reliance on "Well, we stopped 9 hours prior" isn't going to save you from the BAC limits.
 
The hangover effect is due to increased levels of acetaldehyde in the body. This is the metabolic produce of alcohol before it becomes acetic acid and finally carbon dioxide and water.
 
:)

"Naw, naw, he ain't got no dia...dia... oh hell, he just gots the poops!"
 
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