A few questions...

TheFlyingTurkey

TheFlyingTurkey

Fetus Worshiper
I have always been fascinated by helicopters and thought I might add on the rating. Then I though I might look into flying helicopters for a living. I flew for Piedmont airlines for just under a year so I have 121 experience. I have my commercial single/multi land instrument and I also have my CFI CFII and MEI with 1460 TT 450 multi and 300 of it in turbo-props as an FO. I decided airline life wasn't for me (for the pay anyway) and left the company, but I'm still itchin to fly for a living.

I'm too lazy to look up the regs... can anyone tell me what is required to add on a commercial helicopter, and then add on CFI helicopter?

Also what is a realistic amount of helo time I'll need to apply for a job? 1000? Does my fixed wing experience help at all?

Do helo CFI's make good money or is it the same $16 an hour fixed wing CFI's get?

Sorry if this has been covered before.. :)
 
It generally takes 1000 pic in helicopter to get a decent job. Airplane time does not really help in the helo world. I do know of one operator that likes his pilots dual rated but thats only one. CFI's make about 15-20 an hour same as a fixed CFI. I will get back to you on the add on's. I have to look them up.
Shane
 
It takes 50 hours total helicopter time. 61.129(c)(1) and 35 hours helicopter PIC time. 61.129(c)(2)(i).
So if you can solo in 15 hours, you could do it with a minimum of 50.
But don't really plan on solo'ing in 15, and I would not have felt comfortable being a commercial helicopter pilot at 50.

Helicopter add-on to your CFI requires no specific time, as is the case with airplanes. It will be according to your proficiency.

Helicopter instructors/pilots do make more per hour on the low end, because their are fewer. As is in airplanes, time building is in teaching, and the R-22 is the C-152 of helicopters, and it requires special regulatory training to be PIC and instructor, so do at least some of your training in that helicopter to be employable.

I wouldn't want to live in it, though.
 
TheFlyingTurkey said:
I have always been fascinated by helicopters and thought I might add on the rating. Then I though I might look into flying helicopters for a living. I flew for Piedmont airlines for just under a year so I have 121 experience. I have my commercial single/multi land instrument and I also have my CFI CFII and MEI with 1460 TT 450 multi and 300 of it in turbo-props as an FO. I decided airline life wasn't for me (for the pay anyway) and left the company, but I'm still itchin to fly for a living.

I'm too lazy to look up the regs... can anyone tell me what is required to add on a commercial helicopter, and then add on CFI helicopter?

Also what is a realistic amount of helo time I'll need to apply for a job? 1000? Does my fixed wing experience help at all?

Do helo CFI's make good money or is it the same $16 an hour fixed wing CFI's get?

Sorry if this has been covered before.. :)
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Join the military and get them to pay for your training. You can then get your FAA tickets and with the pay/benefits get your fixed-wing tickets as well.

Helo training is expensive and dangerous in the civilian world.

Serve your country and let them prep / train you for the commercial helo world.

-LAFF
 
I agree that helo training is expensive; but dangerous in the civilian world I would like to see where you are getting that information.That sounds like something that is unsupportable.
Shane
 
scottyboy75 said:
That sounds like something that is unsupportable.
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...uuuh, just look at'em, man. Sittin' on the ground with the rotors turnin'; one wrong control input can cause it to flop all over the place beatin' itself to a pulp - and you along with it.

79,000 moving parts (just in the main rotor system); parts that wear out and cause loss of control. It is just plain unstable and requires 100% attention at all times. You do not ever let go of the controls - it never trims out - you handfly this thing in cruise just like you handfly and airplane during the landing flare - constantly.

Thery're fun - like motorcycles (dirt bikes on rough trails), but demanding and exausting when you live in one all day.

And human error takes a quick bite.
 
I do agree that helos are not easy to fly. But, to make the statement that civillian training is more dangerous than military is the one I question. I feel safer in a helo than I do in a plane. Maybe it is just the familiar factor but planes scare me.
 
nosehair said:
...uuuh, just look at'em, man. Sittin' on the ground with the rotors turnin'; one wrong control input can cause it to flop all over the place beatin' itself to a pulp - and you along with it.

79,000 moving parts (just in the main rotor system); parts that wear out and cause loss of control. It is just plain unstable and requires 100% attention at all times. You do not ever let go of the controls - it never trims out - you handfly this thing in cruise just like you handfly and airplane during the landing flare - constantly.

Thery're fun - like motorcycles (dirt bikes on rough trails), but demanding and exausting when you live in one all day.

And human error takes a quick bite.
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You used to fly helicopters, right? Then you know its really not as bad as you make it out.
 
First, if you left aviation ( regional flying ) due to the constraints of finances you will be sorely disapointed in Rotary Wing Aviation. It is better than it has been in the past, but it will always lag behind financial opportunities that Fixed Wing flying offers. Sounds to me like perhaps corporate flying would be more appealing to you.

Never admitt you're too lazy to do something for your self... leave that up to speculation.

As far as amount of time for a helicopter job ... it just depends. Your over all experience, life and aviation, does play into the equation. The real factor here is Insurability. Insurance companies demand a lot more time in category and type when it comes to helicopters, and for good reasons. Unfortunately the Military is still the best way to go for a career in Rotary Wing aviation. As far as training being more dangerous in civilian ... I would have to agree with the statement. Consider that most civilian flight training programs use the R-22 variety of helicopter and the mere fact that there is a special FAR covering that aircraft should tell you something. Typicall experience levels in civilian helicopter instructors is far below the experience level that is afforded a Military flight student.

Helicopter flying is infinatley more fun than fixed wing flying but fun don't pay the bills.

Nosehair ... you're off the mark a little bit. A wrong input is not what causes a helicopter to flop all over the place beatin' itself to a a pulp, what you are describing is ground resonance, which was a problem in some earlier designs.

79,000 moving parts? Shirley you must be joking, and yes I did call you Shirley. While a helicopter is perhaps inheriantly unstable it is certainly controllable with little effort, and Yes you can let go of the controls without catostauphic consequences.

Yes Helicopters are fun ... but as I always say ... Skids are for Kids. There is just not enough money in rotary wing aviation for me.

Now get out there and have some fun.

Jim
 
C650CPT said:
79,000 moving parts? Shirley you must be joking, and yes I did call you Shirley.
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Yeah, I started adding up the parts in the Chinook rotor system from the swashplate up and couldn't come close to 79,000 even if I included cotter pins and pressure pop-up buttons.
 
My copilot is a CH-47 Test Pilot and I asked him about parts ... he doubts there are 100 parts on a small helicopter's main rotor system.
 
The SFAR came about because people were letting students solo in about 10 hrs. This is not enough time for a new student to learn how to control any helo really. The requirements of the SFAR are that of the dominant insurance company for helos at the time it was written. In fact the SFAR was set to expire but Robinson wanted to keep it around. I even looked at getting checked out in a 300C which some say it is safer but even that company stated I would have to have 20 hrs dual with their instructor to solo it.To say that civilian training is more dangerous and civilian students do not have enough experience is not accurate. Sure the trainining is diffrent in many ways but not inferior. How many military pilots have the experience of a zero hour student trying to kill them? I may not have the experience of flying NOE or doing lights out landings in tight places; but in the civilian world do I need it?
 
C650CPT said:
Nosehair ... you're off the mark a little bit. A wrong input is not what causes a helicopter to flop all over the place beatin' itself to a a pulp, what you are describing is ground resonance, which was a problem in some earlier designs.
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Yeah, I wasn't trying to get into the various reasons and ways it can happen, but many different ways with a variety of jerky spastic student induced control inputs on or near the ground can get the helicopter and the ground trying to occupy the same space at the same time.
79,000 moving parts? Shirley you must be joking,
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Of course, I'm joking - just making the point to a fixed-wing pilot about how many more moving parts there are on a helicopter.

and don't call me Shirley.;)
 
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