#5 in line for takeoff and the aircraft in front of you...
- Thread starter derg
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Re: #5 in line for takeoff and the aircraft in front of you.
If it seems far below the others, I'd probably let ground know so they can pass it to that aircraft. What they want to do after that is their call.
If it seems far below the others, I'd probably let ground know so they can pass it to that aircraft. What they want to do after that is their call.
ppragman
FLIPY FLAPS!
Re: #5 in line for takeoff and the aircraft in front of you.
I'd mention it, can't hurt. Makes you kind of a D-Bag if he turns about, heads back to base and its fine, but its win win for you. If he says "ehh, no worries," you get to be relieved, if he goes back, you may have saved the day, and you move up a place in line (if its possible for him to move at this point), and you don't have to watch the blow out cause an accident on takeoff now that you know about it too (which is unlikely but possible). It does however look bad for his company, costs a lot in fuel, and wastes precious time. I'd say something.
I'd mention it, can't hurt. Makes you kind of a D-Bag if he turns about, heads back to base and its fine, but its win win for you. If he says "ehh, no worries," you get to be relieved, if he goes back, you may have saved the day, and you move up a place in line (if its possible for him to move at this point), and you don't have to watch the blow out cause an accident on takeoff now that you know about it too (which is unlikely but possible). It does however look bad for his company, costs a lot in fuel, and wastes precious time. I'd say something.
Re: #5 in line for takeoff and the aircraft in front of you.
It's indeed possible, like the ill-fated NASA Convair 990 I profiled.
It's indeed possible, like the ill-fated NASA Convair 990 I profiled.
BobDDuck
Island Bus Driver
Re: #5 in line for takeoff and the aircraft in front of you.
In all honesty, could you even tell a tire was flat from just looking at it, especially from sitting in another plane? The few times I've had a flat, the other tire supported the weight just fine and the only way I could tell was by pushing on the flat tire and seeing it give a bit.
In all honesty, could you even tell a tire was flat from just looking at it, especially from sitting in another plane? The few times I've had a flat, the other tire supported the weight just fine and the only way I could tell was by pushing on the flat tire and seeing it give a bit.
PA44-LUV
Well-Known Member
Re: #5 in line for takeoff and the aircraft in front of you.
I'd say something. I mean what's more important, money, time, or lives? If you didn't say anything, and then the plane had a blow-out on takeoff, and people were injured, could you then live with yourself? maybe you could, but I'm not that well adjusted.
I'd say something. I mean what's more important, money, time, or lives? If you didn't say anything, and then the plane had a blow-out on takeoff, and people were injured, could you then live with yourself? maybe you could, but I'm not that well adjusted.
Firebird2XC
Well-Known Member
Re: #5 in line for takeoff and the aircraft in front of you.
I once remember hearing an aircraft radio LaGuardia tower about a CRJ-200 about to take the runway that didn't have takeoff flaps set.
While I'm no CRJ pilot, and I don't know if the crew calling tower had any CRJ knowledge, I'd imagine that having some flaps set for a short runway departure in a jet is at least.. likely.
All else fails.. err on the side of caution.
Personally I'd rather have someone point something like that out. Going back to the gate or having maintenance come out, etc isn't really the end of the world.
'Inconvenienced' is much easier to correct than 'dead.'
I once remember hearing an aircraft radio LaGuardia tower about a CRJ-200 about to take the runway that didn't have takeoff flaps set.
While I'm no CRJ pilot, and I don't know if the crew calling tower had any CRJ knowledge, I'd imagine that having some flaps set for a short runway departure in a jet is at least.. likely.
All else fails.. err on the side of caution.
Personally I'd rather have someone point something like that out. Going back to the gate or having maintenance come out, etc isn't really the end of the world.
'Inconvenienced' is much easier to correct than 'dead.'
Cptnchia
Dissatisfied Customer
Re: #5 in line for takeoff and the aircraft in front of you.
Watched an ASA Dash-7 do a three engine ferry flight out of ATL to MCN one day. Had all the Delta dudes on the tower freq stepping on each other trying to tell 'em they had one shut down.
Watched an ASA Dash-7 do a three engine ferry flight out of ATL to MCN one day. Had all the Delta dudes on the tower freq stepping on each other trying to tell 'em they had one shut down.
Firebird2XC
Well-Known Member
Re: #5 in line for takeoff and the aircraft in front of you.
Nice to know folks are looking out.
We had a lively discussion today about the Eagle crew that believed all three were down, green, and locked and landed gear up in Boston a few years back.
It's always interesting to hear about the JetBlue crew that just sat there and watched them and never spoke up. They were real quick to mention that they saw the whole thing happening right after the Embraer successfully executed a gear-up touch and go.
Nice to know folks are looking out.
We had a lively discussion today about the Eagle crew that believed all three were down, green, and locked and landed gear up in Boston a few years back.
It's always interesting to hear about the JetBlue crew that just sat there and watched them and never spoke up. They were real quick to mention that they saw the whole thing happening right after the Embraer successfully executed a gear-up touch and go.
CaptBill
Well-Known Member
Re: #5 in line for takeoff and the aircraft in front of you.
I recall being in a long line to take off out of Philadelphia a few years back. As we got closer to the runway we noticed the USAir A330 aircraft ahead of us had a large service door open - I was guessing a lav service door. I called ground who relayed the info to the crew. The crew went off frequency for a few minutes and came back saying they had checked with company and they were good to go. To my surprise they accepted a takeoff clearance and took off with a large access door flapping in the breeze. I wondered at what speed and altitude the door would be torn off - Not if, but when. I have wondered several times since then who I would trust on a company radio to give me the go-ahead to take off like that. The answer is nobody, that's who.
I recall being in a long line to take off out of Philadelphia a few years back. As we got closer to the runway we noticed the USAir A330 aircraft ahead of us had a large service door open - I was guessing a lav service door. I called ground who relayed the info to the crew. The crew went off frequency for a few minutes and came back saying they had checked with company and they were good to go. To my surprise they accepted a takeoff clearance and took off with a large access door flapping in the breeze. I wondered at what speed and altitude the door would be torn off - Not if, but when. I have wondered several times since then who I would trust on a company radio to give me the go-ahead to take off like that. The answer is nobody, that's who.
Polar742
All the responsibility none of the authority
Re: #5 in line for takeoff and the aircraft in front of you.
calcapt....that's why I like when you post. Good stuff.I've seen a certain airline's bacon saved by a generic "FLAPS!" over the freq when they were cleared to pos and hold. Hell, I even double checked mine!If my tire's flat, please let me know. (BTW- #3 is on the left wing gear.) Thanks!
calcapt....that's why I like when you post. Good stuff.I've seen a certain airline's bacon saved by a generic "FLAPS!" over the freq when they were cleared to pos and hold. Hell, I even double checked mine!If my tire's flat, please let me know. (BTW- #3 is on the left wing gear.) Thanks!
Re: #5 in line for takeoff and the aircraft in front of you.
Just keep in mind, not all tires are the same. As a former maint guy, I've seen three different tires on 1 landing gear truck. Goodyear, Michelin, Bridgestone and they all have different profiles. And looking at them from the front or rear they could look low compared to the others. It'd be the difference of running a 215/45R18 or a 225/40R18 on the same size rim on your car and it being totally within spec. The telltale sign would be when the tire is rolling as they taxi. They'll usually wobble left and right especially turning if they were really low. I'd definitely go back to check it out if you pointed it out, but would be too pleased if it was the one goodyear flight eagle that looked different from the other Michelin flight tires. I could see alot of people looking at their tires closely for the next few days from this thread.
Just keep in mind, not all tires are the same. As a former maint guy, I've seen three different tires on 1 landing gear truck. Goodyear, Michelin, Bridgestone and they all have different profiles. And looking at them from the front or rear they could look low compared to the others. It'd be the difference of running a 215/45R18 or a 225/40R18 on the same size rim on your car and it being totally within spec. The telltale sign would be when the tire is rolling as they taxi. They'll usually wobble left and right especially turning if they were really low. I'd definitely go back to check it out if you pointed it out, but would be too pleased if it was the one goodyear flight eagle that looked different from the other Michelin flight tires. I could see alot of people looking at their tires closely for the next few days from this thread.
TheresaPilot
Well-Known Member
Re: #5 in line for takeoff and the aircraft in front of you.
The summer after freshman year of college I was working as solo line crew at Bader Field in Atlantic city. One time while watching a Mooney come into land (short final), I looked at it with my binoculars because something looked rather interesting about it...I thought to myself 'Hmmm... No wheels.' Now, at this point I wasn't flying complex aircraft yet, but I was pretty sure you needed wheels to land on. I turned to grab my handheld sitting next to me in the truck, and as soon as I turned back towards the runway to say "GO AROUND, GEAR!" they had already landed... A little too late on my behalf, but at least I tried...
I witnessed WAY too much at that airport... Glad it's closed!
The summer after freshman year of college I was working as solo line crew at Bader Field in Atlantic city. One time while watching a Mooney come into land (short final), I looked at it with my binoculars because something looked rather interesting about it...I thought to myself 'Hmmm... No wheels.' Now, at this point I wasn't flying complex aircraft yet, but I was pretty sure you needed wheels to land on. I turned to grab my handheld sitting next to me in the truck, and as soon as I turned back towards the runway to say "GO AROUND, GEAR!" they had already landed... A little too late on my behalf, but at least I tried...
I witnessed WAY too much at that airport... Glad it's closed!
tsquare
New Member
Re: #5 in line for takeoff and the aircraft in front of you.
Since most of my flights these days leave when it's dark... and I mean really really dark... it's highly unlikely that I would be able to see his tires much less judge whether one is flat or not. :rotfl:
Since most of my flights these days leave when it's dark... and I mean really really dark... it's highly unlikely that I would be able to see his tires much less judge whether one is flat or not. :rotfl:
AirmetTango
Well-Known Member
Re: #5 in line for takeoff and the aircraft in front of you.
Sorry about going off topic, but Bader Field's closing is a real shame...great airport in it's day, but yet another airport that couldn't withstand the political pressure that wanted the land for more lucrative tax purposes. Far easier access to AC than International, and in the later years you had the Atlantic City Surf stadium right next door. Fly in, take in a ball game, hit the casinos, go home; fun, easy night out in a small airplane. Don't know if you were kidding, but never be glad when an airport closes!
Back on topic - I let 'em know about the tire. I like being able to sleep at night
Sorry about going off topic, but Bader Field's closing is a real shame...great airport in it's day, but yet another airport that couldn't withstand the political pressure that wanted the land for more lucrative tax purposes. Far easier access to AC than International, and in the later years you had the Atlantic City Surf stadium right next door. Fly in, take in a ball game, hit the casinos, go home; fun, easy night out in a small airplane. Don't know if you were kidding, but never be glad when an airport closes!
Back on topic - I let 'em know about the tire. I like being able to sleep at night
Re: #5 in line for takeoff and the aircraft in front of you.
Well, you know, the senior trips like ATH and NCE start fairly early there, El Jeffe Junior!
(I know I know, flying to MAN as a captain is certainly a lot better than TLV as a senior FO!
)
Well, you know, the senior trips like ATH and NCE start fairly early there, El Jeffe Junior!
(I know I know, flying to MAN as a captain is certainly a lot better than TLV as a senior FO!
)
TheresaPilot
Well-Known Member
Re: #5 in line for takeoff and the aircraft in front of you.
I was a nice field, but when you witness 2 gear up landings, and a fatal VMC spin by a TravelScare on short final... In ONE summer... You're kinda done with the airport. And not to mention the numorous aircraft runoffs into the bay.
Location was nice, but the safety factor is more important.
Sorry about going off topic, but Bader Field's closing is a real shame...great airport in it's day, but yet another airport that couldn't withstand the political pressure that wanted the land for more lucrative tax purposes. Far easier access to AC than International, and in the later years you had the Atlantic City Surf stadium right next door. Fly in, take in a ball game, hit the casinos, go home; fun, easy night out in a small airplane. Don't know if you were kidding, but never be glad when an airport closes!
Back on topic - I let 'em know about the tire. I like being able to sleep at night
I was a nice field, but when you witness 2 gear up landings, and a fatal VMC spin by a TravelScare on short final... In ONE summer... You're kinda done with the airport. And not to mention the numorous aircraft runoffs into the bay.
Location was nice, but the safety factor is more important.
Polar742
All the responsibility none of the authority
Re: #5 in line for takeoff and the aircraft in front of you.
I don't see where 2 gear ups and/or a Vmc spin correlates to a specific piece of concrete. I've seen my share of accidents, fatal and embarrassing, but none of them had to do with a specific airport I was at.
Was there an especially short runway? Terrain around?
I don't see where 2 gear ups and/or a Vmc spin correlates to a specific piece of concrete. I've seen my share of accidents, fatal and embarrassing, but none of them had to do with a specific airport I was at.
Was there an especially short runway? Terrain around?
Re: #5 in line for takeoff and the aircraft in front of you.
Might be more emotional than anything.
It's kind of like where they spend $$$ in AZ to repave and "straighten" a road that has a couple of curves in it, since there's been a number of accidents on it and now it's "unsafe". Mind you, the road itself isn't unsafe....it's just a strip of asphalt with stripes and markings that just sits there. It's the drivers that utilize that particular piece of road, who don't pay attention, who speed well past the speed limit, who cross left of center.....that's whats truly unsafe; not some piece of blacktop sitting there.
But it makes everyone feel better to know that the "unsafe road" is now safe having been rebuilt and repaved, even though nothing else has changed.
Might be more emotional than anything.
It's kind of like where they spend $$$ in AZ to repave and "straighten" a road that has a couple of curves in it, since there's been a number of accidents on it and now it's "unsafe". Mind you, the road itself isn't unsafe....it's just a strip of asphalt with stripes and markings that just sits there. It's the drivers that utilize that particular piece of road, who don't pay attention, who speed well past the speed limit, who cross left of center.....that's whats truly unsafe; not some piece of blacktop sitting there.
But it makes everyone feel better to know that the "unsafe road" is now safe having been rebuilt and repaved, even though nothing else has changed.