100yrs Speech at Kitty Hawk

pilot602

If specified, this will replace the title that
pulled from here Cnn.com

[ QUOTE ]
"By our skill and daring, America has excelled in every area of aviation and space travel, and our national commitment remains firm," Bush told an audience gathered in steady rain on the Outer Banks, where the Wright Flyer first took off December 17, 1903. "By our skill and daring, we will continue to lead the world in flight," he said.


[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah. He' is so committed to aviation that he/they threw up a 10mile TFR (instead of the usual - before 9/11 - 3 or 5 mile TFR which would have left the other two, nearby GA airports open), they are still enforcing the "temporary" TFRs around DC and he wants to privatize ATC. We have the TSA and his government is taxing the airlines to death. And everytime he visits Texas a fifty mile TFR goes up effecively closing several airports and of course who can forget the "roving" TFR that stays on top of him when he travels yet is unpublished due to security concerns - but it's still the pilot's responsibility to not fly into the TFR he knows nothing about!

If that is "commitment" I'd rather he be uncommitted and leave us alone!
 

av8rmsu

Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
pulled from here

[ QUOTE ]
"By our skill and daring, America has excelled in every area of aviation and space travel, and our national commitment remains firm," Bush told an audience gathered in steady rain on the Outer Banks, where the Wright Flyer first took off December 17, 1903. "By our skill and daring, we will continue to lead the world in flight," he said.


[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah. He' is so committed to aviation that he/they threw up a 10mile TFR (instead of the usual - before 9/11 - 3 or 5 mile TFR which would have left the other two, nearby GA airports open), they are still enforcing the "temporary" TFRs around DC and he wants to privatize ATC. We have the TSA and his government is taxing the airlines to death. And everytime he visits Texas a fifty mile TFR goes up effecively closing several airports and of course who can forget the "roving" TFR that stays on top of him when he travels yet is unpublished due to security concerns - but it's still the pilot's responsibility to not fly into the TFR he knows nothing about!

If that is "commitment" I'd rather he be uncommitted and leave us alone!


[/ QUOTE ]



Cry me a river.
 

pilot602

If specified, this will replace the title that
[ QUOTE ]
Cry me a river.

[/ QUOTE ]

One day when GA is all but non-existant; remember that.
 

av8rmsu

Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Cry me a river.

[/ QUOTE ]

One day when GA is all but non-existant; remember that.


[/ QUOTE ]




It will never be non-existant; remember that.
 

Kristie

Mama Bear....
Staff member
We all know that our government "really" does not support aviation the way they should.. so...on a happier note... here's the interview from CNN with John Travolta ...

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Travolta: Aviation at a crossroads

(CNN) -- A nearly weeklong celebration to mark the 100th anniversary of the Wright brothers' first flight culminates Wednesday with an attempt to re-create the historic 12-second trip.

Actor John Travolta, who is also a pilot, was the master of ceremonies for the event. Travolta discussed the festivities beforehand Wednesday with CNN anchor Soledad O'Brien.

O'BRIEN: Give me a sense of why you wanted to be part of this big celebration? Notwithstanding the history, of course. You have an obvious passion for flying. Tell us a little bit about that.

TRAVOLTA: Sure. Well, I've had it most of my life. This passion for flying, it's hard to kill.

But, other than that, today, it's about the next 100 years, I think. You know, we're at a crossroads in the aerospace industry and aviation where we need to move on from where we've progressed.

And we've progressed, you know, to new arenas that we never thought we would achieve in this 100 years. But now it's important for the next generation to inspire those young people to get interested in the industry and take us to other places.

O'BRIEN: As we mentioned, part of the big event will be this re-creation of the first flight 100 years ago. And I understand there's this sort of wood replica. You're a pilot. Any interest in getting in on that and flying across for a few seconds? It does sound a little dangerous quite frankly.

TRAVOLTA: It was actually proposed to me to do that. One of the flights. One of a few flights they're making. And I just didn't have the schedule to do it. But, yeah, that would be fun.

I fly ultralights as well. I'm a 707 and 747 pilot. But I do have in my repertoire ultralights, which are very similar to [what] the Wright brothers [used]. Although the Wright brothers' Flyer was much more difficult to fly than anything we have today.

O'BRIEN: Of course, and certainly back then. I've flown an ultralight here and there myself. It's a lot of fun. Some big names are going to be joining you this morning. Astronauts Neil Armstrong and Buzz Aldrin and also John Glenn. Heroes of yours. What's it going to be like to be out there with some legends?

TRAVOLTA: Well, I've had the good fortune of knowing these men throughout the years, and it's always a pleasure and an honor to be in their same space. And today, the president of the United States will be with us as part of the ceremony, and I think it's an important day for the nation and the world.
 

pilot602

If specified, this will replace the title that
[ QUOTE ]
It will never be non-existant; remember that.

[/ QUOTE ]

Buy an airplane and say that with a straight face.

Costs are rising, insurance is running rampant, airports are being bulldozed at night by city mayors, airport "neighbors" are clammoring for closing them because "they are too noisey" but you're right it will never totally dissappear (notice I said "all but non-existant" ) but if things keep going the way they are it sure won't be like it is today or the way it was when my father started flying (it already is different). Hell, in two short years GA has changed drastically.]

As a pilot you should be a little more defensive of your privilige to fly.
 

Tired

New Member
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
It will never be non-existant; remember that.

[/ QUOTE ]

Buy an airplane and say that with a straight face.

Costs are rising, insurance is running rampant, airports are being bulldozed at night by city mayors, airport "neighbors" are clammoring for closing them because "they are too noisey" but you're right it will never totally dissappear (notice I said "all but non-existant" ) but if things keep going the way they are it sure won't be like it is today or the way it was when my father started flying (it already is different). Hell, in two short years GA has changed drastically.]

As a pilot you should be a little more defensive of your privilige to fly.

[/ QUOTE ]

GA has changed drastically??? Please explain this. Other then the costs being somewhat higher, I don't see the difference. Yeah, insurance is up, not only aircraft insurance but all insurance. Reason, insurane companies are losing money on aircraft polcies. Stop crashing and stop the laywers and rates will go down. Yeah, Megis got shutdown, and we should fight this stuff, but how many GA airports are there in the US? I can't even think of one in your area that has been shutdown since I began flying.
 

tonyw

Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
I can't even think of one in your area that has been shutdown since I began flying.

[/ QUOTE ]

I can think of four that are under attack, three by our wonderful Department of Homeland [In]Security and one by local developers, within an hour's drive of my house.

And I can think another one that's been completely closed to GA as well.

There's the DC3 -- CGS, VKX, and W32. And then there's Suburban (W18), which developers want to turn into another housing development. And then there's the big Kahuna, DCA, which has been closed to GA and would have been closed to everyone if Homeland [In]Security had their way.

And according to AOPA, as many as two GA airports a week get shut down.
 

Grumpy01

New Member
[Grabs a BIG stick and starts to stir]

Closed Austin Exec.
Austin Rbt. Muller

And a correction, the Pres. TFR at Crawford is 30 mi dia. not 50.

Also All you have to do is file a flight plan and be in radar and radio contact with either an approach fac. or a tower.

Normally if you can get to 15-1800 ft they can pick you up.
So what you do is call prior and file then as soon as you get out of the area canx. and go on your merry way.

P.S. Tha above does not include P 49 [PROHIBITED] as opposed to TFR.

Works O K as long as the ceeling is above 2000 ft.
 

FLYMcDoofer

New Member
Do yall really think Bush pops open a sectional and looks and says "What airport can I shut down today?" by flying into or near?

Stop acting like he does this every morning with a grin.
(Yeah I know some believe he is Evil #1 Cursed Saint of all things Evil but get a life.)
 

kostcoguy

New Member
[ QUOTE ]
Do yall really think Bush pops open a sectional and looks and says "What airport can I shut down today?" by flying into or near?

Stop acting like he does this every morning with a grin.
(Yeah I know some believe he is Evil #1 Cursed Saint of all things Evil but get a life.)

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't think he is evil but i agree when you ask about Bush opening up the sectional chart. It's the same with every other president, its not like Bush sits there and says hmm, lets just make the TFR from 10 miles, to 30 miles just so I can screw people over. He probably doesn't even know what a TFR is and really has no say about it, its probably more of he security personals say.
 

SUSPilot

Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Yeah, insurance is up, not only aircraft insurance but all insurance. Reason, insurane companies are losing money on aircraft polcies. Stop crashing and stop the laywers and rates will go down.

[/ QUOTE ]

If you know anything about aviation insurance policies, they do not pay out as much as you think. If an engine quits and the plane crashes they would pay, but if the NTSB puts those two magic words "pilot error" on the report, the insurance company will come after you, especially if it is a rental aircraft.
 

Tired

New Member
[ QUOTE ]
If you know anything about aviation insurance policies, they do not pay out as much as you think. If an engine quits and the plane crashes they would pay, but if the NTSB puts those two magic words "pilot error" on the report, the insurance company will come after you, especially if it is a rental aircraft.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, let's say I was taxiing to fast and hit sometihng, casuing 40 million dollars of property damage. Whoops, my fault, I'll pay right up. You take a checks, right? Oh, and the passengers on the aircraft sued for another couple million. No problem, here's another check.
 

Eagle

New Member
[ QUOTE ]
I can't even think of one in your area that has been shutdown since I began flying.

[/ QUOTE ]

that is because you allow others to do the thinking for you..

Bader field has been closed then reopened then closed, then torn up, then fixxed, and reopened... now you can't even get gas there. Open ....yeah it has a runway.

Marlboro Airport (2N8), Marlboro, NJ Closed 2002.

Linden NJ, Solberg NJ and Easton PA are all on the short list. and could fall with in a year...
 

pilot602

If specified, this will replace the title that
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
It will never be non-existant; remember that.

[/ QUOTE ]

Buy an airplane and say that with a straight face.

Costs are rising, insurance is running rampant, airports are being bulldozed at night by city mayors, airport "neighbors" are clammoring for closing them because "they are too noisey" but you're right it will never totally dissappear (notice I said "all but non-existant" ) but if things keep going the way they are it sure won't be like it is today or the way it was when my father started flying (it already is different). Hell, in two short years GA has changed drastically.]

As a pilot you should be a little more defensive of your privilige to fly.

[/ QUOTE ]

GA has changed drastically??? Please explain this. Other then the costs being somewhat higher, I don't see the difference. Yeah, insurance is up, not only aircraft insurance but all insurance. Reason, insurane companies are losing money on aircraft polcies. Stop crashing and stop the laywers and rates will go down. Yeah, Megis got shutdown, and we should fight this stuff, but how many GA airports are there in the US? I can't even think of one in your area that has been shutdown since I began flying.

[/ QUOTE ]

1. 9/11/01- First ever groudstop of ALL aircraft.
2. TFRs that were established as "temporary" (it's what T.F.R. stands for) are now, for all practical purposes, permanent. Yet no GA aircraft were ever used in the attacks.
3. My father used to rent his 7AC Champ to his friends for $6/hr WET (50yrs ago). Costs have rapidly outpaced inflation. Why is it that a 182 (whose type certificate was issued 30 years ago, which means the costs of R&D have long since been recouped) costs close to half-a-million dollars?
4. Insurance carriers have a monopoly on the system (you can't shop for new coverage until you policy expires or you terminate because it's all tied to your tail number) which was not as big of a problem until you factor in no. 6.
5. ATC is threatening to be privatized - every other country with privatized ATC has watched it fail, miserably.
6. As a result of 9/11 insurance rates went up (even though not a single GA aircraft was involved in the attacks).
7. GA airports now have tightened security (not that it's a bad things but it is different from before).
8. The general public distrusts (this is getting better though) GA and aircraft in general. Don't believe me go fly 1,000 and 2,000 ft above a gathering a few times and see how many 911 calls you generate.

Two years ago these problems didn't exist and/or they were not as extensive/problematic as they are now. Hence, GA has changed drastically.
 

pilot602

If specified, this will replace the title that
Look,

All I'm saying is the GA (and aviation in general) has changed since 9/11. Not all of it is Bush's fault - no one's saying that. But he is the one in office and his lack of proactive steps (or the issuance of a mandate saying "hey let's fix this, etc.") doesn't jive with the speech he gave at Kitty Hawk. It doesn't matter what Gore (or Willy, or any other person) "woulda, coulda, shoulda" done because Bush is the head of the show right now. He's the one calling the shots and the one ultimately responsible for any decisions or lack thereof.

I don't think he's a horrible president. He's had his moments of a really good job. I won't vote for him and that's no secret but just because someone has an issue with his policy doesn't turn the person questioning that policy into a Bush Basher. (This is kind of related to the other "GA Barred from Kitty Hawk" thread)

But the current atmosphere at the FAA and from the administration is not overly aviation firendly and that is contradictory to his speech - which was the point of the post. That's all.

If any mods feel like it this probably should have been posted in Squawk ... feel free to move it.


In other words let's all calm down before Doug has to break out the big, be-nice stick.
 

Derg

New Arizona, Il Duce/Warlord
Staff member
[ QUOTE ]
It will never be non-existant; remember that.

[/ QUOTE ]

Actually, I'd like to agree with this, but I can't.

General aviation is under attack more than you might possibly realize. Almost every GA airport across the country is under some local regulation in order to restrict noise, or jealously watched for destruction and redevelopment as a condominium complex.

GA pilots are seen by the voting public as either the super elite buzzing over their heads in dangerous, noisy aircraft or flown by wannabe hotshot pilots perilously over their child's soccer fields.

GA is being pressured by regulation on the local side, and pressured economically by the insurance industry.

A brand new Cessna costs upwards of $200,000. Most of that goes towards liability insurance coverage for the manufacturer.

Say you purchase a Cessna, you've got to insure the hull on the aircraft, unless you're able to 'self-insure'. Next, where are you going to park it? Gotta find hangar space and a GA-friendly airport to park it at.

Where are you going to fly it? There are so many noise restrictions and neighborhoods with a low tolerance for aircraft noise. Believe me, I live in one of them.

And that's just Y2K3. Imagine the predicament we're going to be in ten more years if the current trend in overregulation of GA continues.

Open up a flying magazine from the mid 1970's and compare it to now. In the mid/early 1970's middle and upper-middle class people could afford a semi-decent new GA aircraft. Can that same demographic afford to do so now? Very doubtful.

The future does NOT bode well for general aviation and I urge you to vote locally and nationally those candidates that support general aviation and keep updated at AOPA because GA can and if we're not careful, WILL go away.
 

FL270

New Member
AMEN, FEARLESS LEADER! Heed what the man says folks ... on this issue he is absolutely square on the bulls-eye. That $39 to AOPA is the best money you'll ever spend in aviation. Small price to pay to make sure you can keep freely using all those ratings we all spent thousands of dollars for.

FL270
 

tonyw

Well-Known Member
Another thing to make sure you do is write to your elected officials -- all of them -- when you hear about an airport that's under threat. As soon as I figure out who exactly is behind the plan to turn W18 into just another housing development, I will do just that.

I believe that AOPA has a lettter on their site that you can use for just this. I will find the link and post it.

We need to make sure that we act proactively to ensure that future pilots get the chance to learn just how much fun flying can be. We need to make our voices heard among our elected officials.

If you don't think it can happen to your airport, think about Meigs and the DC3 and how DCA is closed to GA.
 

agcatman

New Member
[ QUOTE ]
If you know anything about aviation insurance policies, they do not pay out as much as you think. If an engine quits and the plane crashes they would pay, but if the NTSB puts those two magic words "pilot error" on the report, the insurance company will come after you, especially if it is a rental aircraft.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't think YOU know anything about aviation insurance policies.

Hmm, how many airplanes you crashed? Don't mean to be offensive, but what you've written is incorrect.

First, insurance WILL pay. Pilot error or not. It's ludicrous to suggest otherwise.

Second, if it happens as you've written above, you are correct, insurance won't pay as much as you're probably going to want, but it's got nothing to do with "pilot error".

It's because the engine quit before you hit the ground. And they will NOT cover an equipment malfunction unless you have a special policy and I'm not even sure there is such a thing.

Engine quits, you wreck. The insurance will pay to repair the aircraft frame to at least the condition prior to the accident. The engine? That's your baby. That's the way it is.

Plane is running fine but you quit, you wreck. Insurance pays BUT it may not be what you want. Say you have 1400 hours on the engine when you crash. Engine is totalled. What will insurance pay? Well, first off, they're not going to buy you a new engine. They may have a new engine installed, or reman, or whatever, but they are going to charge you BETTERMENT. Ooh, and it can hurt. Say that 1400 hour engine had a 1500 TBO and they replace it with a factory new engine. They will take the cost of the engine, divide it by 1500 to get the cost/hour. Say the engine costs $30K. $30K/1500= $20/hr cost. You had 100 hours left before TBO on the crashed engine. 100hr X $20= $2,000 that they owe you. But the balance of the cost, $28,000 is coming out of YOUR pocket. And that's the way it works. I know. Trust me, I know.
 
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