ATP thoughts from currently attending or most recent grads

Re: ATP thoughts from currently attending or most recent gra

meyers9163 said:
An education? Really.... I would call it more so a skill. By no means is it an EDUCATION. But that's my 2 cents. An education takes time and isnt done over night.... How many people get their BS in 90 days? Not many..... Just my 2 cents though no need to go off on this.

In addition if you are not digusted with pilots losing their jobs perhaps you need to check your desire to get into this industry. One who wants to be a professional pilot would wish on ill will on anyone and would wish for the best. They certainly would have and would not show no emotion at all towards them. After all they are your fellow pilots!
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Im pretty sure you misquoted him. He said he wasnt disgusted with a flight school because airlines are laying off pilots.

Anyway, it will pick back up. My entire family is in aviation and all of them are doing well and would recommend the career to anyone wanting to be a pilot. Also, most pilots dont become pilots for the money.

I have an uncle that just made captain at world airways flying the MD-11. My godfather is a captain for US Air flying A-320's. My father is a flight engineer on a corporate 727. My grandfather flew connies, then worked for the NTSB for awhile and is now working as an FAA inspector.

A bit off topic but you can actually see him this documentary that aired on discovery channel about the tenerife disaster. His name is Luis Carmona.

Part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kmItf4Um7EA
Part 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aLYaZ3Ek8yY&feature=related

Anyway, thats my backround and I hope to one day follow in their shoes. All of them love flying and would recommend this career to anyone. So dont turn away just because there is a lull in the industry. There are jobs out there they are just harder to find right now.
 
Re: ATP thoughts from currently attending or most recent gra

BillH said:
At the end of the day, everyone has to pass the same check rides no matter where they went or how they got there.
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True, but I fail to see the relevance. There are many more people out there who can pass a Part 121 PC than will ever be invited for an interview at UPS.
 
Re: ATP thoughts from currently attending or most recent gra

meyers9163 said:
An education? Really.... I would call it more so a skill. By no means is it an EDUCATION. But that's my 2 cents. An education takes time and isnt done over night.... How many people get their BS in 90 days? Not many..... Just my 2 cents though no need to go off on this.

In addition if you are not digusted with pilots losing their jobs perhaps you need to check your desire to get into this industry. One who wants to be a professional pilot would wish on ill will on anyone and would wish for the best. They certainly would have and would not show no emotion at all towards them. After all they are your fellow pilots!
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You misquoted me. education, skill, qualification, whatever. Thats not the point. (but its called a flight school for some reason.)

I was referring to DE727 about him being disgusted with ATP cause the regional airlines might be furloughing pilots that might have done training with ATP. I guess ATP does something wrong by advertising their program as the fastest way to get in at a regional.
 
Re: ATP thoughts from currently attending or most recent gra

germb747 said:
True, but I fail to see the relevance. There are many more people out there who can pass a Part 121 PC than will ever be invited for an interview at UPS.
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There are plenty of reasons one wouldnt be invited to an interview. Where you got your training wouldnt be one of them.
 
Re: ATP thoughts from currently attending or most recent gra

3enginejock said:
There are plenty of reasons one wouldnt be invited to an interview. Where you got your training wouldnt be one of them.
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Why could they not say no thanks based on training? If you do an accurate flight resume your training should be in there some where. That's a topic in which you cover or at least all the resumes of friends I've viewed had on theirs. If a company had a beef with a certain school and their pilots werent doing as well they certainly could say "no more DCA guy" "no more FSI" etc etc.... Its their choice as to who they ask to interview.
 
Re: ATP thoughts from currently attending or most recent gra

meyers9163 said:
Why could they not say no thanks based on training? If you do an accurate flight resume your training should be in there some where. That's a topic in which you cover or at least all the resumes of friends I've viewed had on theirs. If a company had a beef with a certain school and their pilots werent doing as well they certainly could say "no more DCA guy" "no more FSI" etc etc.... Its their choice as to who they ask to interview.
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Like I said before my whole family is in the aviation industry, some at top levels in their airline. With that of course we also know a lot of people in the industry. Also I never said that an airline "cant" say no to you based on where you got your training, they just dont practice that policy at all. Where you got your training is not a factor in most cases.

Ive asked this question before and every time the answer is no, where you got your training will never be an issue. You could attend the worst flight school in the country and still be invited to a major airline interview. Right now its about who you know and your experiance, where you went to school is not a factor.
 
Re: ATP thoughts from currently attending or most recent gra

It's not what you know, but who you know, and more importantly, who knows you! :banghead:
 
Re: ATP thoughts from currently attending or most recent gra

BillH said:
It's not what you know, but who you know, and more importantly, who knows you! :banghead:
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Exactly... and also one thing to keep in mind those who hire changes constantly. One who has a dislike could change their minds whenever they please. Just keep that in mind. It shouldnt matter but they could show preference to whom they wish. Thus perhaps they are an ERAU grad and choose them because of that..... Connections are everything and that YOU should know since you are so endowed with professionals in your family.
 
Re: ATP thoughts from currently attending or most recent gra

meyers9163 said:
Exactly... and also one thing to keep in mind those who hire changes constantly. One who has a dislike could change their minds whenever they please. Just keep that in mind. It shouldnt matter but they could show preference to whom they wish. Thus perhaps they are an ERAU grad and choose them because of that..... Connections are everything and that YOU should know since you are so endowed with professionals in your family.
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Didnt I say that in my post? Of course connections are everything and some schools have connections which will help you. But no airline is going to outright refuse to interview you because you went to such and such flight school.

But some are posting here implying that airlines will refuse you an interview just because you got your training through a 90 day program at ATP, which is completly wrong. If anything ATP has connections to possibly help you, definatly nothing about ATP is going to hurt you when trying to get a job just because you went through the 90 day program.
 
Re: ATP thoughts from currently attending or most recent gra

"nothing about ATP is going to hurt you when trying to get a job just because you went through the 90 day program."

I don't believe going through all those ratings in such a short time produces a pilot as proficient as one who would take their time and get some experience outside the training enviornment. But, since I don't have anything to do with pilot hiring anywhere, at the moment, I'd say your safe.
 
Re: ATP thoughts from currently attending or most recent gra

3enginejock said:
Didnt I say that in my post? Of course connections are everything and some schools have connections which will help you. But no airline is going to outright refuse to interview you because you went to such and such flight school.

But some are posting here implying that airlines will refuse you an interview just because you got your training through a 90 day program at ATP, which is completly wrong. If anything ATP has connections to possibly help you, definatly nothing about ATP is going to hurt you when trying to get a job just because you went through the 90 day program.
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Alright.... I see you are at ATP and you have family that is established in the industry and know more then I do and care to really debate to be quite honest.
 
Re: ATP thoughts from currently attending or most recent gra

"I guess ATP does something wrong by advertising their program as the fastest way to get in at a regional."

The day the AE or Xjet annouce a furlough, I most certainly will have something wrong with the way ATP advertises their program. I will be very concise and direct on that day. Stay tuned.

Until then, I'm only pointing out that ATP marketing may be doing a disservice to some newbs in the biz by inhibiting their education about the industry. Such education could be had by simply including a JC link at the ATP website.

Both Skymates and CPS seem to think JC is worthy of a link. ATP does not. Enquiring minds would like to know why....
 
Re: ATP thoughts from currently attending or most recent gra

DE727UPS said:
"I guess ATP does something wrong by advertising their program as the fastest way to get in at a regional."

The day the AE or Xjet annouce a furlough, I most certainly will have something wrong with the way ATP advertises their program. I will be very concise and direct on that day. Stay tuned.

..
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The point is, if the regionals slow hiring to a trickle, then those with more in depth training will be able to sustain a career other than right seat of a shiny new jet. It's the same for folks who go to the majors before getting the 1000 pic at a regional, except they already should know the game, unlike a newby shelling out the better part of 100G.

If either of these individuals get layed off, then they have a very low marketability on the street. That is what I belive Don is saying here. It is certainly what I am saying.:)
 
Re: ATP thoughts from currently attending or most recent gra

Bumblebee said:
If either of these individuals get layed off, then they have a very low marketability on the street. That is what I belive Don is saying here. It is certainly what I am saying.:)
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I think anyone with EXPERIENCE, even the slightest in the industry, would strongly agree with you.... I personally know I do.
 
Re: ATP thoughts from currently attending or most recent gra

DE727UPS said:
Such education could be had by simply including a JC link at the ATP website.

Both Skymates and CPS seem to think JC is worthy of a link. ATP does not. Enquiring minds would like to know why....
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AMAZING how that happens. Hmm perhaps because they might get some more honesty about things. Thus find out not only the peachy things that Eric sales ya on the phone (Eric you are good at your job man). But its the truth. Makes ya wonder why they dont place it on their site?
 
Re: ATP thoughts from currently attending or most recent gra

I wasn't saying you won't be invited for an interview at a place like UPS just because you did the 90-day program to get your certificates/ratings. I was just saying the guy doesn't have a dog in the fight because no one will be hired off the street at UPS with nothing more than a fresh commercial ticket from ATP without years of experience and thousands of hours subsequent. By that time, it is true that it doesn't matter where you got your ratings from. With that said, go to a regular Part 61 school and do it the old-fashoned way. If you still insist on spending 60K on a rush program thinking the airlines will come knocking on your door right away, you have a rough road ahead of you. Maybe your regional captains do have a dog in the fight, because there is a chance one of these 90-day wonders will be in the seat next to him, but still the hiring picture wasn't what it was 6 months ago.
 
Re: ATP thoughts from currently attending or most recent gra

It could be that ATP doesnt link to JC because the statements about ATP on JC are not checked for accuracy. There are people who post on this site who have an opinion about things that comes from experience in the Industry- that is great and helpful. But there are many that post opinions ABOUT ATP without current information, and it starts all kinds of rumors and bad information. If I didnt currently instruct for ATP I would think that it is a horrible place run by money hungry monsters who could care less about safety or teaching people to fly. Well, I instruct for ATP and can tell you it aint like that. There are people who dont like it- it aint for everyone. But the vast majority do- or it wouldnt be so successful.

just a thought...
 
Re: ATP thoughts from currently attending or most recent gra

eclipse said:
If I didnt currently instruct for ATP I would think that it is a horrible place run by money hungry monsters who could care less about safety or teaching people to fly.

just a thought...
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Perhaps the truth should be said..... But you know it all. Funny too how many of us still have students there and therefore our information come straight from them. But I guess you would know EVERYTHING that happens at all the different locations huh? Fact of the matter is ATP fails to link anything on their website due to the fact they dont want students to get the information of other places who could do a better job at a cheaper price then them. But again you know everything so how about you walk right into Jims office and ask him. Then you can report back to us! Sounds like a great plan.

Funny how things have changed so much in 3 months... AMAZING. Oh wait yeah the airlines did change as well. I wonder how those who have a CMEL wet and trying to find a job are doing right now? Those who didnt go and get their CFI's? Oh that's right I would want a former 121 guy with 4000hours over an ATP person any day. Fact of the matter most recent Comair interviews most had 4k plus in hours. Best of luck guys.

Anyways I dont even care to debate this issue. Any negative words about ATP you all cry as if the world is coming to and end and cry foul. Yet you cant handle truth and peoples thoughts who have experience about things.

So you are in Richmond huh? You have a CFI there BF... I talk to him all the time. But you probably would just say what he thinks if false as well.....
 
Re: ATP thoughts from currently attending or most recent gra

"It could be that ATP doesnt link to JC because the statements about ATP on JC are not checked for accuracy."

Can we have an accuracy check on register 12.....

Tell ya what, call the ATP 800 number if you want accuracy. Then ask them about the IRS 20 point independent contractor rule.

After that, come back and knock JC as an accurate source of info.

Eclipse is right, though, if you're in the system you will see no wrong. I call that the Kool-aide factor. YMMV....
 
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