Poll: Mythbusters - Will the plane take off?

[MidlifeFlyer]

Because the underlying conditions are irrelevant, is only included to produce an image in your mind of a car on a treadmill, and is what makes the riddle a "riddle"?

And a "riddle" is different that an "experiment" which is what we were supposedly being treated to.

I think you an I agree on the bottom line, the only difference being that I consider a "experiment" that does this to be a "failure."

 

[KC Jake]

And a "riddle" is different that an "experiment" which is what we were supposedly being treated to.

I think you an I agree on the bottom line, the only difference being that I consider a "experiment" that does this to be a "failure."

Actually, I would call this experiment a visual representation of why the answer is that airplane will take off. I don't think the original riddle was ever meant to cause this much argument. It was supposed to go something like this:

Q: A plane is standing on a runway that can move (some sort of band conveyor). The plane moves in one direction, while the conveyor moves in the opposite direction. This conveyor has a control system that tracks the plane speed and tunes the speed of the conveyor to be exactly the same (but in the opposite direction). Can the plane take off?

A: No

Q: Why not?

A: Because the conveyor belt holds the plane in place creating no relative wind for the plane to achieve lift off.

Q: Ahh, but remember, the wheels are separate from the plane and don't create any propulsion.

A: Oh, I get it, it's a tricky question...yes, the plane will take off because there is no way the conveyor belt can keep it stationary.

Q&A: Haha, funny riddle...NEXT!

 

[Berkut]

This was just posted by a "no-fly" person over at the Mythbuster's forum:

it's funny how everyone want's to argue with real pilots like myself who have studied and flown for years and fly jets and all. I fly for a living, and that fact just rolls over everyone. It's not easy to get to the point I'm at, getting a commercial licence is no different than getting a collage degree, there's a lot of work into it. Trust us real pilots, we know what we're talking about

Oh my.

nobody's listining to a REAL LIFE PILOT here i fly ERJ-145's for a living, I'm trying to explain the REAL LIFE reason why it would not fly, and it is the TRUE reason, all you Can-fly people are not putting the numbers in the right spots, I'm tired of having to explain it over and over again how and why it won't be able to achieve take off if the belt and plane accelerated together and or remained at a constant speed. everyone who argues with the Can-fly is not knowing how the speed for an airplane is measured, and i've expained it over and over again, and that's a huge factor, i'm tired of it, you can Trust me a REAL Pilot who fly's for a living and has had much much experiance physics and has graduated with top grades in physics that it will not take off, or you can believe the people who have never set foot in an airplane or even sat in the cockpit of one about how it will take off. My real life experiance and knowlage vs. their theories. This is my last post on this subject, if you want to see my whole explaination read back on my posts.

I feel like I have been in the presence of a great mind.

 

[KC Jake]

And we have yet ANOTHER vote for no-fly.

 

[SlumTodd_Millionaire]

This was just posted by a "no-fly" person over at the Mythbuster's forum:Oh my.I feel like I have been in the presence of a great mind.

I don't know about you, but I was thoroughly impressed with his "collage" education that provided him with so much "experiance and knowlage." :banghead:

 

[Berkut]

I don't know about you, but I was thoroughly impressed with his "collage" education that provided him with so much "experiance and knowlage." :banghead:

Oh man, that's not even the best part. He urged that Jamie and Adam contact him by phone so that he could straighten the whole mess out.

Skydrol isn't for drinking, kids. Learn from this guy's mistakes.

 

[nbv4]

There are 4 outcomes to this riddle:

First is the typiocal most common outcome. The person initially thinks the treadmill actually slows the plane down (based on the wording of the question), and says no. After the question gets explained further, the person realized their folly and changes their answer to "yes".

The second outcome is when a person is presented with the riddle, but instead of going with gut instinct, they think about it a little more. They come to the initial conclusion that the plane will take off, because they are able to catch the fallacy in the question. They also realize that this is a tricky question and other intelligent people may easily fall for it.

The third and fourth outcomes are the most common. The third outcome is when the person thinks they're hot #### and has it all figured out. They say it won't take off because the "plane has no airspeed". When explained the premise of question a little more clearly, they (out of arrogance and/or stubbornness) refuse to think any differently and will argue on and on and on.

Of course the fourth kind (which seems to populate this place) are the kind that believe it will takeoff, but who also believe that if you think it won't, you are the biggest moron on the face of the planet. The third and fourth personalities collide and produce 9 page threads throughout the internet's forums.

Anyways, on a side note, I used to be based out of the airport where they filmed this myth. It was nice seeing my old home on TV. I had no idea they filmed it there, and am quite curious to know when they did it. When I was based there, I flew pretty much every day, so I', kind of surprised I never saw them doing this. If I knew the date I could check my logbook and see what I was doing on that day. Most likley I was in my night flight stage, where I was waking up at 8PM, flying all night, then going to bed at like 11AM ...

 

[SteveC]

There are 4 outcomes to this riddle:

First is the typiocal most common outcome. The person initially thinks the treadmill actually slows the plane down (based on the wording of the question), and says no. After the question gets explained further, the person realized their folly and changes their answer to "yes".

The second outcome is when a person is presented with the riddle, but instead of going with gut instinct, they think about it a little more. They come to the initial conclusion that the plane will take off, because they are able to catch the fallacy in the question. They also realize that this is a tricky question and other intelligent people may easily fall for it.

The third and fourth outcomes are the most common. The third outcome is when the person thinks they're hot #### and has it all figured out. They say it won't take off because the "plane has no airspeed". When explained the premise of question a little more clearly, they (out of arrogance and/or stubbornness) refuse to think any differently and will argue on and on and on.

Of course the fourth kind (which seems to populate this place) are the kind that believe it will takeoff, but who also believe that if you think it won't, you are the biggest moron on the face of the planet. The third and fourth personalities collide and produce 9 page threads throughout the internet's forums.

Nailed it.

:bandit:

 

[Brian Z]

I sure hope that some of the 35% of JC members voted in sarcasm, because I cannot believe such a large percentage cannot grasp that the plane WILL most definitely fly.

Look at it this way. What if the plane was landing on a treadmill rotating at touchdown speed? Will the plane come to a grinding halt at the precise point it touches down?

 

[KC Jake]

I sure hope that some of the 35% of JC members voted in sarcasm, because I cannot believe such a large percentage cannot grasp that the plane WILL most definitely fly.

Look at it this way. What if the plane was landing on a treadmill rotating at touchdown speed? Will the plane come to a grinding halt at the precise point it touches down?

Hey, it's over. We're done here. The episode ran, the plane flew, the arguments subsisted, and the arguments have now come to a close. Deep breaths...it's over.

 

[LarryinTN]

I always thought the myth involced the treadmill's and the airplane's wheelspeed being identical.

If you believe that it is physically possible for the treadmill's speed to keep up with the wheel speed of the airplane once it's under power then you don't understand the physics involved.

The original question made no reference to "wheel speed" only to "plane speed".

Obviously if the wheels and belt match, the plane will remain stationary

No, that isn't true. If the airplane is under power the treadmill can not match the wheel's speed. It's physically impossible. What is true is that *IF* the airplane is stationary, the wheel speed is matched to the belt speed.

 

[Minuteman]

Im in a crash pad with some other pilots we saw this mythbusters and we thought that the plane was going to remain stationary and lift off.

Whoa, whoa, whoa ... your crashpad has cable?! :drool: