The College Degree thing

I

ilove747s

New Member
I realize a degree is very important to have in order to go to larger gigs at larger places if not just for a career backup. Here's the situation.

I'm almost 21, i work 9-5 m-f most weeks with 40 - 45 hours which i need to do so I don't have to finance my training with loans and such. I'm left with just enough time to do my flying but very little time for school. My plan was to start going to a community college next year and also work to get all my ratings through PPL - CFII by this time next year. It will be tough but I think I can do school part time as I have an extra 3-4 days where I'm not currently flying after work.

I feel it is best that I get to a regional airline as soon as I can A) for senority b) the younger i am, the easier it will be to live off the first few years pay. (keep in mind I plan to have very little debt if any at all so my bills will be controlled).

Now, I know online classes are difficult to keep up with especially if you are working in the aviation industry, but I think this might be my best option with planning to be at a regional asap. It would seem the only advantage on focusing on college for the next 4 - 5 years would be that it's much easier, but then thats 4-5 years senority at a regional I could have.

Either way I would have to work and go to school whether I'm working for regional or at my current job so why shouldn't go to a regional and then get my degree if it is the most cost effective way (for me)?

I know there are many ways you can go to make it to where you want in aviation and I guess I'm just looking for some reassurance that my goal is somewhat realistic as it's a very long path ahead.

Thanks for reviewing my situation. :)
 
ilove747s said:
Now, I know online classes are difficult to keep up with especially if you are working in the aviation industry, but I think this might be my best option with planning to be at a regional asap. It would seem the only advantage on focusing on college for the next 4 - 5 years would be that it's much easier, but then thats 4-5 years senority at a regional I could have.
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Not entirely true. Depending on the degree they can actually be quite easy. I finished most of my coursework for this semester a week after it started. I wrote a paper yesterday, that took about three hours. Now I have a couple quizzes and a final and I am done.

I'm not going to lie, I haven't done squat since the first week of September till now, and these are 400 level classes, I have six credits left till I graduate. If your not against an aviation degree having the ratings makes the classes pretty simple.

Go to the local community college to get your general ed credits covered and have a social life, then once you have your ratings that is a just add water 32 credits through UVSC
 
The online degree thing isn't too bad. I did my BS online and working on my MA online now. The undregrad courses (Embry-Riddle) were 12 weeks long and at one time I took 4 classes at the same time. I was taking these classes in 2002 while flying my f*ing butt off...and I mean A LOT!!! I was gone 26-28 days a month and flying consistant 24 hour duty days with 12 hours off. Was it hard...HELL YEAH it was, but I did it, and did it well. With some of the regional schedules out there...it would be real easy to do...IMHO. As Doug mentioned, it is IMPERITIVE that you get your degree if you want to step into the heavy metal. There are a gizzillon RJ drivers out there and well, not that many openings @ the mainlines...get the degree!!!

Also, Embry-Riddle will give you up to 60 credits for ratings and such...but I personally wouldn't recommend the degree as it is about worthless outside of aviation. I liked the classes much better than my master's crap...but not good for anything except checking that BS Degree block.
 
GalaxyIFE said:
Also, Embry-Riddle will give you up to 60 credits for ratings and such...but I personally wouldn't recommend the degree as it is about worthless outside of aviation. I liked the classes much better than my master's crap...but not good for anything except checking that BS Degree block.
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This isn't just an aviation-related thing. There are SCADS of people with degrees in something other than what they're doing. A friend of mine who was with the Dallas Morning News told me that almost NO ONE there had a journalism degree. Most of the people I work with have liberal arts degrees of one type or another, and we're a high-tech firm.

I'm just sayin' - the degree itself is important, but lots of industries don't care what it is. Carry on. Not intended as a de-rail.
 
ilove747s said:
It would seem the only advantage on focusing on college for the next 4 - 5 years would be that it's much easier, but then thats 4-5 years senority at a regional I could have.
:)
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Honestly man...The airplane will always be there...Going to college at this age wont. Go to college and have fun. Make new friends...Live with them and do stupid crap. Hook up with random girls...Paint your body and go to your schools football games and go out and get drunk....During all that, you can also learn a hell of a lot in class hehe.

I love flying...Its something i've wanted to do as a career ever since I can remember, but in my personal opinion, if it meant having to give up the four ( oops....five ) years I spent at college, I would drop a career in aviation in a heart beat. The people you will meet, the experiences you will have, the things you will do are things you only get a shot at doing once.......The airplane will always be there tomorrow....(and if you go to college and have a test, the bar will always be there tomorrow too).
 
MikeOH58 said:
Honestly man...The airplane will always be there...Going to college at this age wont. Go to college and have fun. Make new friends...Live with them and do stupid crap. Hook up with random girls...Paint your body and go to your schools football games and go out and get drunk....During all that, you can also learn a hell of a lot in class hehe.

I love flying...Its something i've wanted to do as a career ever since I can remember, but in my personal opinion, if it meant having to give up the four ( oops....five ) years I spent at college, I would drop a career in aviation in a heart beat. The people you will meet, the experiences you will have, the things you will do are things you only get a shot at doing once.......The airplane will always be there tomorrow....(and if you go to college and have a test, the bar will always be there tomorrow too).
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:yeahthat: Best advise you are going to get
 
MikeOH58 said:
Honestly man...The airplane will always be there...Going to college at this age wont. Go to college and have fun. Make new friends...Live with them and do stupid crap. Hook up with random girls...Paint your body and go to your schools football games and go out and get drunk....During all that, you can also learn a hell of a lot in class hehe.

I love flying...Its something i've wanted to do as a career ever since I can remember, but in my personal opinion, if it meant having to give up the four ( oops....five ) years I spent at college, I would drop a career in aviation in a heart beat. The people you will meet, the experiences you will have, the things you will do are things you only get a shot at doing once.......The airplane will always be there tomorrow....(and if you go to college and have a test, the bar will always be there tomorrow too).
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:yeahthat: College was a lot of fun man. I couldn't imagine not having gone
 
MikeOH58 said:
Honestly man...The airplane will always be there...Going to college at this age wont. Go to college and have fun. Make new friends...Live with them and do stupid crap. Hook up with random girls...Paint your body and go to your schools football games and go out and get drunk....During all that, you can also learn a hell of a lot in class hehe.

I love flying...Its something i've wanted to do as a career ever since I can remember, but in my personal opinion, if it meant having to give up the four ( oops....five ) years I spent at college, I would drop a career in aviation in a heart beat. The people you will meet, the experiences you will have, the things you will do are things you only get a shot at doing once.......The airplane will always be there tomorrow....(and if you go to college and have a test, the bar will always be there tomorrow too).
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I have a year of college and have been paying my loan back for over a year, There where great time's and everything said above. But I wish everyday I would have started my flight training out of high school. Maybe its just me, But on the other hand I would not have the motivation, confidence, etc, that I gained from my short college experience. I found a local college here that charges $30 dollars per credit hour and plan on taking classes sometime after getting hired with a airline.
 
ilove747s said:
I feel it is best that I get to a regional airline as soon as I can A) for senority b) the younger i am, the easier it will be to live off the first few years pay. (keep in mind I plan to have very little debt if any at all so my bills will be controlled).
...
Either way I would have to work and go to school whether I'm working for regional or at my current job so why shouldn't go to a regional and then get my degree if it is the most cost effective way (for me)?
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I would finish college first. It will be much harder to finish it while you working. You can always fly on the side if you can afford it. Build some experience and ratings over the years and once you're done with college everything will click in place. You are too young to be trying to do everything at once. Go to school, have fun, if you don't do that now, you'll have to do it some time later when it won't be fun at all trust me on that.
 
Why not get the best of both worlds? Get through CFII and instruct while going to school. You can drop the bank job or maybe go part time, and have all of my students when I leave in May. Build tons of time so you can have your pick of regionals later or maybe even find a sweet on-call gig...God knows there's plenty to be had out of KAUS.

ACC is not that demanding and pretty cheap. I don't know where you're looking to go to school or what will be transferable, but you could at least get started with an online course or two there. I wonder if you knocked out some credits at ACC and tried to transfer to OSU or someplace with an aviation program if they'd even hire you as a CFI? In the mean time you've got UT right around the corner and 6th street...get the best of the college experience without having to actually do homework!

Hey by the way, did you solo or what man? Let's do some XC's!
 
I agree with Mike that the best thing would be to get a four (or five) year degree from a "real" college. It is the best time of your life and you might even learn something. Plus, you'll be 21 by the time you start so everyone will want to be your friend. You could feasibly go to school, work part time and slowly get your ratings. By your junior or senior year you could instruct and have well beyond regional mins by the time you graduate.

I also realize that given your situation, it might not be possible to spend $100k on college while paying for flight training.

An online degree seems like a great idea but i wonder whether it will have any clout in 10 years. (this is where I start pissing people off). I mean no disrespect to anyone who got their degree online, but these programs have become a dime a dozen, some are very easy, and there is no way to sort out the good from the bad. Hiring is competitive and I see it being possible, in a few years ,that a pilot with 1500h turbine PIC with a traditional 4 year degree will have an advangage over the same time pilot with an online degree. This is purely speculation so if getting your degree from an online university works best for you, do it but I think its a bit of a risk.

Then again, I could just be bitter becasue the online students paid half as much and finished 2 years before me :D
 
My opinion:

Go to college and get your degree. You might find after flying a RJ for a few years, at ~$20k/year, that it's not everything you hoped it would be. It would be wise to have a degree to fall back on.
 
Degree first. Fly second. I didn't even join the military until I was out of college for 3 years.

Without a degree, you're not getting past an RJ job.
 
My opinion is that:

1. The field you get a degree in RARELY matters, so an aviation degree is worth as much as about any of them for MOST jobs (flying or not). Credibility of online degrees is INCREASING, not the converse!;

2. Getting on with a regional NOW and gaining those numbers can make SO much difference in a seniority based system that anyone giving contrary advice is either burying their head in the sand or wants you to suffer as much as they have!;

3. The ONLY downside is missing the "fun" of college. So, the question becomes, do you want to be one of those bitter guys that constantly yearns for their life back in their youth, or do you want to be a super senior pilot at a relatively young age and coast the second half of your career?
 
Except, seagull, not having a degree is a disqualifier at most major airlines. I guess if you goal is to be a super senior RJ Captain, then go for it.
 
Velocipede said:
Except, seagull, not having a degree is a disqualifier at most major airlines. I guess if you goal is to be a super senior RJ Captain, then go for it.
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Didn't think anyone was talking about NOT getting a degree, just whether it was a valid option to get it via an accredited online/distance learning program. Obviously, NOT getting a degree is a VERY bad idea!
 
Velocipede said:
Except, seagull, not having a degree is a disqualifier at most major airlines. I guess if you goal is to be a super senior RJ Captain, then go for it.
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It's not a matter of degree or not degree nowadays. You can get the regional job and work on the degree on the side, which is what I recommend.

Seagull, I agree with your comments completely. I've never run into an old guy at the end of his career that said "I wish I would have spent more time getting drunk in college." I have, however, heard a lot of guys say things like "I wish I had had more time off to be with my family and not missed so many holidays and birthdays." If you want that time off with your family, you need to get the seniority as quick as possible, and that can be accomplished the quickest by working on the degree and building time simultaneously. You just have to make sure that you have the discipline to get it done and not procrastinate on the degree while flying.
 
PCL_128 said:
You just have to make sure that you have the discipline to get it done and not procrastinate on the degree while flying.
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Your points are well taken, but your last point is where the hitch is. Flying a full schedule AND going to college is a tough nut to crack. Perhaps going to college and doing CFI work to build time is a better answer.

It all depends on what kind of a workload an individual can carry. Now, if I'm getting an F/O who breaks open the laptop at cruise to work on a term paper and ignores what we're supposed to be doing, I'd have a personal problem with that.

And, believe me we had a pilot who wrote his first novel while, supposedly, at the F/E panel.
 
So you guys realize that not everybody that is a professional pilot lives for huge airplanes and awesome places to fly to, right? I would give up my college experience for anything in life, and if this flying airplanes for a living gig sucks too much, I'll...uhm...do something else so I can be with my family more?

It's not that crazy of a concept.
 
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