Obstacle Departure Procedure Question

L

Louie1975

Well-Known Member
OK folks:
Took my brand new IFR student on a x-country. We filed IFR from Castle Airport(KMER) to Fresno Chandler(KFCH), which is non-towered. Weather was CAVU, as is usually the case here in the San Joaquin Valley this time of year. We also filed for the return trip as well. While setting up for the approach at Chandler, the approach controller told us we could get our clearance for the return trip while on the ground at Chandler just by contacting her on the freq. We did that, and were instructed to report airborne. Then we took off for our return trip to Castle.
Now, my question is, was I required to follow the ODP as instructed on the airport diagram? We took off on RW 30, which pretty much put us on heading to our first fix. So I assumed a straight out departure. The ODP for RW 30 states: climb heading 345 degrees to 1000' before proceding on course. Which would have required a right turn, and only after passing 400 agl, which would have been 680'msl. I did NOT follow the ODP, but just continued straight ahead until TPA and then turned toward our fix. Please help!
 
Operating under Part 91, the AIM gives the pilot discretion to either follow the ODP or take some other type of obstruction clearance action after departure. Under Part 135/121, operations specificiations issued to the operator typically require the ODP to be flown precisely as published.

Personally, under Part 91...in VMC...I would proceed on course visually avoiding obstructions. In IMC...I would fly the ODP.
 
You are expected to fly the ODP if you are not given any other departure instructions. This is your only way of obstacle obstruction.
 
Champcar said:
You are expected to fly the ODP if you are not given any other departure instructions. This is your only way of obstacle obstruction.
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Champ, like Mike said previously I think you should add "If in IFR conditions...", since your Mach 1 eyeballs is an approved method of obstacle avoidance when VMC, at least for Part 91 operations.
 
I think he was talking about the obstacle DP out of Chandler, but MER has one too, and no there are no obstacles. Pissed me off a bit that we were always asked to fly the DP. Off of 31 you have to make a climbing right 180 to overfly El Nido VOR, then on course. So if you are flying from MER to anywhere north, you have to take off, make a 180, fly over HYP, then make another 180, fly back over MER, then on you're way. You could easily and very safely takeoff straight out to MOD VOR. I've requested that prior to departure, but they always tell me I have to make that request with Norcal, and they sometimes don't hand me off to Norcal until I'm half-way to HYP. :banghead: [/rant]
 
B767Driver said:
Operating under Part 91, the AIM gives the pilot discretion to either follow the ODP or take some other type of obstruction clearance action after departure.

Personally, under Part 91...in VMC...I would proceed on course visually avoiding obstructions. In IMC...I would fly the ODP.
Click to expand...

AIM 5-1-2 also suggests to maintain IFR proficiency, "pilots are urged to practice IFR procedures, whenever possible, even when operating VFR.

I suggest to all my instrument students to fly the ODPs when available for practice. It only adds to one's ability, capability, and proficiency.
 
flyguy said:
I think he was talking about the obstacle DP out of Chandler, but MER has one too, and no there are no obstacles. Pissed me off a bit that we were always asked to fly the DP. Off of 31 you have to make a climbing right 180 to overfly El Nido VOR, then on course. So if you are flying from MER to anywhere north, you have to take off, make a 180, fly over HYP, then make another 180, fly back over MER, then on you're way. You could easily and very safely takeoff straight out to MOD VOR. I've requested that prior to departure, but they always tell me I have to make that request with Norcal, and they sometimes don't hand me off to Norcal until I'm half-way to HYP. :banghead: [/rant]
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Is it for noise abatement?
 
meritflyer said:
AIM 5-1-2 also suggests to maintain IFR proficiency, "pilots are urged to practice IFR procedures, whenever possible, even when operating VFR.

I suggest to all my instrument students to fly the ODPs when available for practice. It only adds to one's ability, capability, and proficiency.
Click to expand...

No argument there.
 
Some Odd things about it:

-I know even though it does not specifically say in the ODP, but you are supposed to wait until 400 AGL before commencing any turns. Since Chandler is at 280' MSL, it would have been 680' before commencing the turn. Which means, even at the miserly climb rate of the Alarus, it would have been a short time until I would have rolled back left to track toward El Nido VOR(the fix I was cleared to, if I remember correctly).

-Chandler lies under the Shelf Area of the Fresno Yosemite(KFAT) Class Charlie Airspace, which starts at 2500' above Chandler. This ODP turns you TOWARDS the surface area, which looks like it starts a mile or two away from Chandler(in the direction of the 345 degree turn). But I guess if I picked up a clearance on the ground then I am free to go right in the Class C...even before I report airborne. Correct?

-Another weird thing....after departure I saw NO obstacles straight ahead. But in the direction of the turn I saw a tower!

So I just want to get this straight. In VMC, but under an IFR clearance, it was acceptable for me to just do a straight out departure, climb to TPA, then turn toward my first fix? All before reporting airborne?

Hey Flyguy...good to see you still mingling with us piston dudes! And you are right about the ODP at Castle. I am planning to file up to Willows(Nancy's diner!). I am already sulking at having to go to El Nido before embarking Long Haul to Willows(yes, 150 Nm is long haul in an Alarus!). But I have heard usually NORCAL will clear you on course before you get to El Nido. I will be asking Castle tower for a freq change at 100'AGL!
 
And Subpilot you are correct...coming into RW30 it looks like your wings are brushing those tall palm(?) trees that sit there!
 
I've never actually had to go all the way to HYP, but somtimes I've made the full 180 before the handoff, and then had to turn around again after I'm cleared on course. If its VMC, the easiest way is to just takeoff VFR and pick up your clearance in the air once you are on course. Have fun in Willows. You'll love Nancy's.
 
You are legally allowed to fly any obstacle departure you want. It is your responsibility to provide obstacle clearance. Just inform the controller that you can provide your own obstacle clearance.
 
Champcar said:
You are expected to fly the ODP if you are not given any other departure instructions. This is your only way of obstacle obstruction.
Click to expand...

SteveC said:
Champ, like Mike said previously I think you should add "If in IFR conditions...", since your Mach 1 eyeballs is an approved method of obstacle avoidance when VMC, at least for Part 91 operations.
Click to expand...

Champcar said:
Why not practice it.
Click to expand...

I think that's a good idea.

I think you missed the point of my comment though. My post was directed at your "This is your only way of obstacle obstruction." comment, which failed to include what I thought would be a proper disclaimer, specifically "...if in IFR conditions". Visually avoiding obstacles is an acceptable method as well. I was not debating the wisdom of flying ODP's, just the assertion that it is the "only way". Words mean things.

:)
 
In regards to SID's. On the NACO chart if it lists takeoff minimums are 2300-2 or STD.....what exactly does that mean????
 
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