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Hey just wondering, why do so many people emphasize so deeply on the 19k first year?

Yeah it sucks, but you know it before going into it, and also it literally only lasts 1 year. After that an almost double up in pay and stuff.

If we all look at the first year pay for alot of jobs, we would never go into those type of fields, but it's just that...a first year pay.
 
zmiller4 said:
Nah, he's saying that its the legacy carriers that have bloated labor costs. Also, everybody likes to talk about the 19k/yr, but I'm not sure how accurate that is. My first year at SKW, before taxes, will be almost 28K (still low IMO), and I've been holding 14-15 days off a month and about 85-90hrs credit.
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Good job!
 
I don't see how it is possible to earn 28K at 19.02 an hour. First of all, the first 2-3 months of the year are taken up by training, so at best you are getting guarantee. (keep in mind this is a new concept at SKYW)

$19.02*75 hour guarantee = $1426/month before taxes
9 months at 90 hours equals out to roughly $16,000 before taxes.

Where are you earning the addition $8,000 per annum?

Even with 300 hours of per diem per month you would still come out $4,000 short.
 
The only way to do it is pick up trips in open time and take one day off a week. Most first year pilots aren't familiar enough with the system to work it well.
 
Bigey said:
Hey just wondering, why do so many people emphasize so deeply on the 19k first year?

Yeah it sucks, but you know it before going into it, and also it literally only lasts 1 year. After that an almost double up in pay and stuff.

If we all look at the first year pay for alot of jobs, we would never go into those type of fields, but it's just that...a first year pay.
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It's not just the $19k - it's the fact that it takes you several years to make a reasonable wage ($40k+). So you get bumped to $28k the second year - that still blows. And if you can't make payments on your loan the first year, it doesn't matter - you won't be flying long. Not to mention what happens to you when you finally do make it to a livable wage and your airline hits the crapper. Then it's back to $19k - only this time, you have a kid or two.

Truth is, there's no full-time job out there that's worth $19k that isn't given exclusively to the mentally retarded. In a lot of ways, it's about pride. Do you feel the job you do is equal to that of a Taco Bell clerk? If so, by all means, take the $19k job. I'd love to fly airplanes for a living, but $19k-$30k isn't a living in my mind. So I'll keep my office job and hopefully CFI on the side one day.
 
Murdoughnut said:
It's not just the $19k - it's the fact that it takes you several years to make a reasonable wage ($40k+). So you get bumped to $28k the second year - that still blows. And if you can't make payments on your loan the first year, it doesn't matter - you won't be flying long. Not to mention what happens to you when you finally do make it to a livable wage and your airline hits the crapper. Then it's back to $19k - only this time, you have a kid or two.

Truth is, there's no full-time job out there that's worth $19k that isn't given exclusively to the mentally retarded. In a lot of ways, it's about pride. Do you feel the job you do is equal to that of a Taco Bell clerk? If so, by all means, take the $19k job. I'd love to fly airplanes for a living, but $19k-$30k isn't a living in my mind. So I'll keep my office job and hopefully CFI on the side one day.
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I see

Now, i'm not agreeing with the airlines with paying that crappy first year, but playing a little devils advocate. It's an acknowledged thing getting into it, the crap first year pay. Okay, so maybe the second year is 30k. Now i know how everyone hates this type of rationalization, but i have a friend who's cousin is first year resident and he complains about how he's gonna do about 21k this year and he has huge loans also.

I'm not saying its justifiable, but i am saying, theres not enough people sticking up for better wages, except for the online posters saying "PAY US MORE." Also, if it's too difficult to get into then dont.

After 3-4 years at a regional you can expect 60+ a year. Somewhat of an investment if you look at it.

Just from a different persepective.
 
I spent 5 months at the 75 hour guarantee and I'll gross between 24k and 25k. 2nd year projections are easily around $45,000.
 
GaTechKid said:
I spent 5 months at the 75 hour guarantee and I'll gross between 24k and 25k. 2nd year projections are easily around $45,000.
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See, kinda my point.

Duke it out for a year, and get much better and comfortable return after that 1 year mark.
 
Bigey said:
See, kinda my point.

Duke it out for a year, and get much better and comfortable return after that 1 year mark.
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UNLESS...that is, you're still sitting reserve in your second year and only making your 75 hr. guarantee plus what little per diem you make for the few trips you fly. :p
 
Bigey said:
I see

Now, i'm not agreeing with the airlines with paying that crappy first year, but playing a little devils advocate. It's an acknowledged thing getting into it, the crap first year pay. Okay, so maybe the second year is 30k. Now i know how everyone hates this type of rationalization, but i have a friend who's cousin is first year resident and he complains about how he's gonna do about 21k this year and he has huge loans also.

I'm not saying its justifiable, but i am saying, theres not enough people sticking up for better wages, except for the online posters saying "PAY US MORE." Also, if it's too difficult to get into then dont.

After 3-4 years at a regional you can expect 60+ a year. Somewhat of an investment if you look at it.

Just from a different persepective.
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It all depends on where you are in your life. For instance, I have an inlaw who has seven daughters - yes, seven daugters - all under the age of 12 (some are his, some are his wife's from a previous relationship). He owns his own A/C business and makes enough to take care of his family. However, he just recently decided that he wants to pursue his recent dream of becoming a minister. So he's picking up his 9-person family and moving them to Georgia (from Ohio) so he can go to school to be a minister.

Honestly, I think what he's doing is horrible - he has a resposibility to the well-being of his family first, and there's no way his wife will be able to pick up the slack in order for them to live comfortably.

Now my first job out of college was teaching while in graduate school - I made a whopping $12k a year. It was awful, but I got free tuition out of it. I could afford it, but just barely. I literally had no money left at the end of each month.

If your young, I say go for it - as long as you don't take out one of these $50k plus loans to do it. If you're the primary bread winner for your family, though - I think you should re-evaluate your potential decision. Just my .02
 
So what people are thinking on this thread here is that is acceptable to get paid above $40,000 as an FO on a plane that is comparable to the DC-9 series and 737-200 series of aircraft which guys in the second year pay tier made $60,000 to $90,000 maybe ten short years ago?

For inflation, cost of living increases, and other increases in other aspects of life, how are we ahead as pilots?

Can someone explain this to me?
 
Seggy said:
So what people are thinking on this thread here is that is acceptable to get paid above $40,000 as an FO on a plane that is comparable to the DC-9 series and 737-200 series of aircraft which guys in the second year pay tier made $60,000 to $90,000 maybe ten short years ago?

For inflation, cost of living increases, and other increases in other aspects of life, how are we ahead as pilots?

Can someone explain this to me?
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But dood, it's a jet, and stuff!!! Just think, I'll get my 1000 TPIC and be making mad money, duh!! I'll be flying my own Baron soon, so that's when I'll need my piston basics, but not now!!! Screw the rest...

Now you may really get this thread rolling in the direction it was already heading, again!!!:rolleyes:
 
Seggy said:
So what people are thinking on this thread here is that is acceptable to get paid above $40,000 as an FO on a plane that is comparable to the DC-9 series and 737-200 series of aircraft which guys in the second year pay tier made $60,000 to $90,000 maybe ten short years ago?

For inflation, cost of living increases, and other increases in other aspects of life, how are we ahead as pilots?

Can someone explain this to me?
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So how much do you think your pay rate / benefits / QOL will increase once ALPA is on property? Yea it sucks, but its what is there now. It wont be an overnight change to the good life again. :(
 
Stone Cold said:
But dood, it's a jet, and stuff!!! Just think, I'll get my 1000 TPIC and be making mad money, duh!! I'll be flying my own Baron soon, so that's when I'll need my piston basics, but not now!!! Screw the rest...

Now you may really get this thread rolling in the direction it was already heading, again!!!:rolleyes:
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That would be hilarious...................................................if it werent true
 
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