Jet Transition or CFI

D_R_ATC

D_R_ATC

New Member
I am in a bit of a dilemma. Due to the lower mins that the regionals have I am actually considering the possibility of dropping about 6k into the jet transition program over at ATP.
Here is the dilemma, I am currently doing my CFI at a local FBO and I estimate that it would take me maybe another month and 1/2 before I complete it. What happens is that no one knows how for long the regionals are going to continue with the lower mins. Maybe a week, a month, a year etc. and I don't want to miss the chance of getting some good 121 experience. On the other hand I can build some more time by instructing and in the process help future aviators achieve their dreams.
My times are 402TT and 105 Multi. I guess my question is what would be better in the long run?
Finish my CFI and Instruct for another year or forget about it and go ahead and drop the $$:banghead:
 
D_R_ATC said:
I am in a bit of a dilemma. Due to the lower mins that the regionals have I am actually considering the possibility of dropping about 6k into the jet transition program over at ATP.
Here is the dilemma, I am currently doing my CFI at a local FBO and I estimate that it would take me maybe another month and 1/2 before I complete it. What happens is that no one knows how for long the regionals are going to continue with the lower mins. Maybe a week, a month, a year etc. and I don't want to miss the chance of getting some good 121 experience. On the other hand I can build some more time by instructing and in the process help future aviators achieve their dreams.
My times are 402TT and 105 Multi. I guess my question is what would be better in the long run?
Finish my CFI and Instruct for another year or forget about it and go ahead and drop the $$:banghead:
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Let the nashing of teeth begin. My vote become a CFI not to pay your dues, if not for just learning to be a better pilot!
 
My vote comes after knowing your age... your desire (or lack thereof) to teach... your financial status... and what your ultimate long term goals are.

Bob
 
It's not really about dropping money for the RJ course. It's about whether you want to take the time to improve yourself as an aviator or pay the money to skip that step.

Personally, and with respect to F/O Bob, I don't think there is any substitute for paying your dues and taking the time to become a more seasoned and experieced aviator by doing the CFI thing.

With all due respect, it's NOT all about a seniority number, though you'll hear that over and over.
 
CapnJim said:
Are You Mad???

Instruct!!!!!!!!!!!!
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:yeahthat:. Yes!!!! Instruct for about a year, then apply. The CRJ program only guarentee's an interview, not a job. Besides, whenever you do get hired at a regional, its that airline's responsibility to train you. That 6000 bucks I'm sure can be better utilized somewhere else.
 
DE727UPS said:
It's not really about dropping money for the RJ course. It's about whether you want to take the time to improve yourself as an aviator or pay the money to skip that step.

Personally, and with respect to F/O Bob, I don't think there is any substitute for paying your dues and taking the time to become a more seasoned and experieced aviator by doing the CFI thing.
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Everyone is different... some folks have a wanton desire to teach... other's don't. It doesn't make them any less of a pilot. There are other options besides teaching... an RJ course is one of them... so is 135VFR... Traffic Watch, jump pilot, tours, etc... all of them have their good and bad parts depending on several factors. None of them... including teaching... guarantees a 121 job.

I completely understand where everyone is coming from with regards to the "Instruct!!!" mentality... however there is no "one way" that works for everybody.

I never said the program was right for him... all I did was ask him for more information so that we can all give him an informed response versus just call out a standard response that may not work for everyone in every situation.

FO Bob ;)
 
"versus just call out a standard response"

Capt Bob, I think the standard response works most of the time and is superior to the other ways for the reasons the multitudes have been more than happy to express.

I still question someone who has no desire to teach the next generation who comes before him and doesn't consider that time worthy as a way to increase one's experience/background. Some things in life you just can't pay for.
 
DE727UPS said:
Capt Bob, I think the standard response works most of the time and is superior to the other ways for the reasons the multitudes have been more than happy to express.

I still question someone who has no desire to teach the next generation who comes before him and doesn't consider that time worthy as a way to increase one's experience/background. Some things in life you just can't pay for.
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I think he obviously has "some" desire to teach since he stated that he's currently working on his CFI.

Overall... my "leanings" are about 90% to the CFI route. However, I think that those who choose not to teach don't necessarily feel that CFI time is "unworthy"... rather they simply make choices that they feel are in their best interests. Some will take the shortcuts and other's will actually gain some pretty darn impressive time working/flying their a** off to better themselves while building up their skills/hours.

Everyone on JC has their opinions and personal "beefs". One of yours has to do with big name flight schools and their marketing practices... One of mine has to do with labeling one route or one type of program "the best" for everyone without knowing more about the individual.

That's all...

Bob
 
I think for me personally, had I not instructed, I would not have gotten such a good grasp of the fundamentals of flying so early on. Some of the FO's I flew with still didn't have those same fundamentals, which is sad at this stage of their flying experience.

It's a decision only you can make. no one else walks your shoes.
 
DE727UPS said:
It's not really about dropping money for the RJ course. It's about whether you want to take the time to improve yourself as an aviator or pay the money to skip that step.

Personally, and with respect to F/O Bob, I don't think there is any substitute for paying your dues and taking the time to become a more seasoned and experieced aviator by doing the CFI thing.

With all due respect, it's NOT all about a seniority number, though you'll hear that over and over.
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Well said Don. Couldn't agree more.

Instruct. The RJ course does nothing for you in the long run, IMO.
 
All I can say having just gone through CFI training (I go to finish the checkride in 3 hours) is that it has taught me a whole lot of things that I honestly thought I already knew. I didn't understand things on the deeper level, though I thought I did.

There is no better test of one's knowledge and skill than to have to teach that to somebody else. In that process of preparing a lesson you discover the areas that you yourself are deficient in, and get to fill in the voids.

Checkrides only cover a few areas of operation, instructing covers them all.
 
Of course the problem with the CFI route is the huge liability that comes with it.

I think if you look at the financial difference though, you'd come out ahead as a CFI. Consider spending $6K, vs. making say $800 a month x 6 months as a CFI. Becoming a CFI if only for 6 months, saves you $6K and makes you $4800. That's over a $10K difference. How much time would the ATP course save over CFI? 3 months? 6 months? Being at the regionals 6 months sooner isn't going to profit you an extra $10K+ and with as much hiring as is going on right now, 6 months difference in seniority isn't going to be that significant most likely.
 
To me its not about how much you earn or save. Its about becoming a better aviator.

A commercial certificate, 250 hours, and a 7 day RJ course are no subsitute for being an instructor.
 
meritflyer said:
To me its not about how much you earn or save. Its about becoming a better aviator.

A commercial certificate, 250 hours, and a 7 day RJ course are no subsitute for being an instructor.
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But incase he still hasn't made up his mind based on that...then I provided the financial difference as a double reason. It would be one thing if one way meant more money and the other meant more experience, that may be harder to choose, but since I so kindly pointed out that one way is both more experience AND more money, and the other is neither, well, that should tip the scales I'd think.
 
The most difficult thing I ever put myself through was the CFI certificate. I am soooo glad I did it, and you will be too. Where would you be if after the massive hiring comes an extensive furlough? You can always find a place to teach somewhere, if you're resourceful enough.

Earn respect for yourself, earn the respect of your peers, get the CFI. You will learn so much about aviation, about people, and about yourself. Also, the Wife brings up a very valid financial point. First year regional pay is CRAP; you won't recover that 6K for a long time.
 
TheWife said:
Of course the problem with the CFI route is the huge liability that comes with it.

I think if you look at the financial difference though, you'd come out ahead as a CFI. Consider spending $6K, vs. making say $800 a month x 6 months as a CFI. Becoming a CFI if only for 6 months, saves you $6K and makes you $4800. That's over a $10K difference. How much time would the ATP course save over CFI? 3 months? 6 months? Being at the regionals 6 months sooner isn't going to profit you an extra $10K+ and with as much hiring as is going on right now, 6 months difference in seniority isn't going to be that significant most likely.
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Michelle...

There's a few things about your numbers that don't add up... I'm pretty sure I'll get flamed for this since folks may continue to think that I'm recommending the RJ program... but that's not the case... I'm just slightly showing a different point of view from your example.

You are comparing the cost of 6k for the RJ program with the ability to make @ 600/month as a CFI without taking into account the cost of actually getting his CFI ratings. That alone could easily be up to 6k... so your net difference isn't quite the $10K listed above.

Also... just from looking at the ATP website... folks are getting interviews within days of completing the course (which is 7 days). If they successfully pass the interviews then they are hired and start their airline training typically within 30 days. So... that means that they can be earning a paycheck and have benefits for their family within a very short time. You typically don't get bennies when CFI-ing. What happens if you have an illness that keeps you from flying for an extended period of time... how will you pay for it... what if it's your spouse or kids?

That could be a large factor in his decision... especially if a family is involved.

That's why I asked him about his financial situation early on... for some folks it doesn't make economical sense to go the CFI route and scratch and crawl your way to more hours in your logbook (see some of the CFI blogs).

Don't get me wrong... I did the CFI route... I enjoyed it... it was hard... at times it was great fun... at other times it was hell... it worked for me based on my individual situation and what I wanted to accomplish personally...

Would I recommend it to others as "a one pill does it all" type of solution?? Well... we'll see... let's sit down and talk about your situation and the "other" routes you are considering... and let's come up with a plan that works for you, your family, and your individual situation.

Bob
 
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