PPL x-ride = PIC?

bLizZuE

bLizZuE

Calling for engine starts en français
For some reason, the only checkride I haven't logged PIC on is my initial PPL. Is this correct? I've had DE's say that checkrides are always logged as PIC. Some even say that you don't log dual on checkrides, yet every one of mine has dual received logged.

Help.
 
bLizZuE said:
For some reason, the only checkride I haven't logged PIC on is my initial PPL. Is this correct? I've had DE's say that checkrides are always logged as PIC. Some even say that you don't log dual on checkrides, yet every one of mine has dual received logged.

Help.
Click to expand...

The rules are different at 141 schools with self examining athurization (like FSA).

You havent ever taken a actuall checkride, you have taken stage checks which the FAA accepts in leiu of a "pratical test".

Therefore all your "checkrides" were actually dual instruction flights, and durring your PPL ride the ceck airman was the PIC.


Out in the real world, The examiner is NOT a instructor (at least not durring the checkride) and is expressly forbiden from giving instruction durring a checkride.

Therefore durring the checkride you should not be loging dual recived.
 
Interesting. I have taken one part 61 checkride, for my ASES. No dual, just PIC.

However- if what you say is correct, then I should have PIC logged on my PPL?
 
61.51 E

(4) A student pilot may log pilot-in-command time only when the student pilot--
(i) Is the sole occupant of the aircraft or is performing the duties of pilot of command of an airship requiring more than one pilot flight crewmember;
(ii) Has a current solo flight endorsement as required under Sec. 61.87 of this part; and
(iii) Is undergoing training for a pilot certificate or rating
 
Captain_Bob said:
Your PPL Checkride should be PIC.
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:yeahthat: That's right... I "Yeah That'd" myself... ;)

FAR 61.47
FAR 61.47 said:
Status of an examiner who is authorized by the Administrator to conduct practical tests.

(a) An examiner represents the Administrator for the purpose of conducting practical tests for certificates and ratings issued under this part and to observe an applicant's ability to perform the areas of operation on the practical test.
(b) The examiner is not the pilot in command of the aircraft during the practical test unless the examiner agrees to act in that capacity for the flight or for a portion of the flight by prior arrangement with:
(1) The applicant; or
(2) A person who would otherwise act as pilot in command of the flight or for a portion of the flight.
Click to expand...

This thread is done...

;)
 
Captain_Bob said:
:yeahthat: That's right... I "Yeah That'd" myself... ;)

This thread is done...

;)
Click to expand...

Exactly.

Our DPE starts each checkride by saying this each time (PPL-ATP):

"You (the student) are Pilot in Command on this checkride. If there was to be an emergency, I won't act as Pilot in Command, but I will assist you in any way you need me to except for flying the airplane."
 
mojo6911 said:
The way I see it, you aren't rated for the aircraft until you have your license, so the flight isn't PIC.
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Ian J said:
So what about solos?
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mojo6911 said:
You are the sole occupant of the aircraft. It spells it out in part 61.
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Well, Bob already closed it, but I responded to your assertion that you had to be appropriately rated to log PIC. Clearly you don't, as you pointed out with pt 61.
 
tgrayson said:
Nope. That regulation has nothing to do with logging PIC. It only pertains to acting PIC. As we all know, two different things.
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Hmmm... Let me look at this from your perspective...

FAR61.47 said:
The examiner is not the pilot in command of the aircraft during the practical test
Click to expand...
So what you are saying is... A flight will occur... in which nobody will "log" PIC...

Does that effectively summarize your viewpoint?

Unless through prior agreement... Examiners are required to NOT be the PIC and thus will not be logging it as PIC. So... by your example... we now have several thousand planes every year flying around with no "official" documentation of "logged" PIC... ??

That dog just doesn't hunt... ;)

Bob
 
Captain_Bob said:
So what you are saying is... A flight will occur... in which nobody will "log" PIC...
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Unless you can point out a paragraph in 61.51 that allows the logging of it, that conclusion seems inescapable, since no other regulation guides the logging of PIC time. There are other well-known situations in which no one can log PIC time, such as when a private pilot allows a non-pilot friend to fly the airplane.

Captain_Bob said:
Examiners are required to NOT be the PIC and thus will not be logging it as PIC.
Click to expand...

Remember, logging and acting are two different things.
 
tgrayson said:
Unless you can point out a paragraph in 61.51 that allows the logging of it, that conclusion seems inescapable, since no other regulation guides the logging of PIC time. There are other well-known situations in which no one can log PIC time, such as when a private pilot allows a non-pilot friend to fly the airplane.
Click to expand...

You should be logging it as PIC if your non-pilot friend is flying because you are ACTING as PIC.
 
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