Pinnacle Hiring Low Time Pilots?

Captain Bob- 2 of the guys in my new hire class are on that list, towards the bottom. I will not post names but they are on there. I was talking with one of them the other day and he said he was getting close to 400 hours now, which would be in line with getting hired in the 250-300 range.
 
Bob, I gotta back Highney on this one. We've got guys coming straight outta the ATP carreer program with nothing but that and the RJ transition course. Now, these guys COULD potentially make decent CAs one day if they do they're homework as FOs and become sponges, soaking up as much knowledge from the CAs they fly with. However, there's a fine line between teaching an FO some tips and tricks and teaching an FO EVERYTHING. We've already had a few check airman announce their displeasure of this hiring practice, and my Cat II training class became a CA bitchfest. Basically, all they CAs wanted to know if the company had their back if they decided NOT to fly a CAT II approach with an FO they didn't feel comfortable with. Honestly, I think I'd be a little shaky going that low with an FO that has about 20 hours of actual time under his belt. The official response was "Well, if you don't feel a CAT II is safe, you're tha CA. Use your judgement." Personally, the thing that has me scared is the potential push to lower the CA total time mins. I don't think many of these guys will be seasoned enough at 1500-1800 hours to make safe CAs. Heck, I'm getting close to 1500 now, and I KNOW I'm not ready to move to the left seat. But, there are a lot of guys that think their seniority and TT entitle them to a CA slot. Some of those guys are FOs again.....
 
Steve... I can definately see that. In fact I can see how I was wrong just by reading PCL letter signed my your chief pilot. No mins... I was just as surprised to see that as you guys are.

Although... let me bring this up... purely for the sake of arguement, I'm bored, and the fact that it appears that the majority of Regionals only have ATP mins of 1500TT for upgrade.

Let's say the 250 ATP/UND/Purdue/etc. "wonder" does get hired at PCL and they lower the captains hiring mins from 3000TT to 1800TT. Now... let's say that a PPL instructor gets hired on at 1300TT and had just completed a 100hr time building program to get his ME time up to mins.

Let's also say that upgrade time is down to 6 months with the new wonder company of Pinnacolgan.

Compare the 250 hour dude... who would have over 1500 SIC Turbine at upgrade with the other guy who would have 600 SIC Turbine. It's all hypothetical... I know... but just curious about what other's think about that.

Also... that "sense of entitlement" has hit here at XJT too... Our Sr. Director of Flt Ops just put out a voicemail that indicates that there will be MANY upgrades coming this summer and upgrade time will drop well below the 2 year mark... he basically told folks that if they didn't feel ready... and weren't prepared to devote 100% of their time to upgrade... then to just hold out. It seems we've had a rash of folks failing out of upgrade who thought it would just be some sort of enhanced re-current and that they were ready... just because their seniority number could hold it.

Bob
 
Captain_Bob said:
Although... let me bring this up... purely for the sake of arguement, I'm bored, and the fact that it appears that the majority of Regionals only have ATP mins of 1500TT for upgrade.
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Which regionals? Here it's currently 3000TT and Skywest has 2500TT for the CRJ? I don't know about Air Whisky or the other CRJ operators like Mesa. I know it's that way at XJT, but you guys don't have NEAR the attrition we do, so the odds of a 1500TT guy getting upgraded at mins is a lot less likely.

Let's say the 250 ATP/UND/Purdue/etc. "wonder" does get hired at PCL and they lower the captains hiring mins from 3000TT to 1800TT. Now... let's say that a PPL instructor gets hired on at 1300TT and had just completed a 100hr time building program to get his ME time up to mins.
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Ah, the age old question. The main difference is, as SIC, you can skate by looking at your CA saying "Uh, what do YOU want to do?" As an PPL instructor and time builder by flying in the ATC system, YOU have to make the "what do you want to do" decisions. I'm not saying the 250TT wonder would just skate by, but the odds of someone with that attitude getting through are there. It kinda scares me that those guys who have never made a critical in-flight decision in their lives could be responsible for a CRJ with up to 54 people on board.
 
kellwolf said:
Which regionals?
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OK... I may be mis-informed on this one... Ya got me curious now... What are the upgrade mins at the other regionals? Can anyone fill in the blanks?

ExpressJet - 1500
Pinnacle - 3000
SkyWest - 2500
Air Wisconsin -
Republic -
Eagle -
PSA -
TSA -
Colgan -
Commutair -
ASA -
Mesa -
Midwest -
Great Lakes -
ComAir -

kellwolf said:
Ah, the age old question. The main difference is, as SIC, you can skate by looking at your CA saying "Uh, what do YOU want to do?"
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I think that's an appropriate question... and I'd hope the Captain would think so too... Hopefully the Capt may respond back with something like "I have a pretty good idea... but let's hear your suggestion first." :)

I would also like to think that after a year+ of flying in the system for 80-90 hours a month as SIC and actually seeing and physically being a part of the decision making process for that long... that anyone... no matter how much time they have... will have absorbed enough experience to make them reasonably safe...

Alas... We currently have low timers and high timers alike failing out of upgrade right now because they didn't prepare... or pay attention for the past two years... I just don't get that part. Very dissapointing that folks are going into upgrade with the attitude that they deserve it... just because their seniority number holds it.

kellwolf said:
responsible for a CRJ with up to 54 people on board.
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Don't forget the lap children and the FA jumpseat! ;)

Bob
 
Captain_Bob said:
Alas... We currently have low timers and high timers alike failing out of upgrade right now because they didn't prepare... or pay attention for the past two years... I just don't get that part. Very dissapointing that folks are going into upgrade with the attitude that they deserve it... just because their seniority number holds it.
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That's been a problem here as well.

Don't forget the lap children and the FA jumpseat! ;)

Bob
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CRJ doesn't have a second FA jumpseat like the ERJ-145 does. Sucks for the commuting FAs. But, for the lap kids, we'll up it to 57 souls. :)
 
kellwolf said:
CRJ doesn't have a second FA jumpseat like the ERJ-145 does. Sucks for the commuting FAs. But, for the lap kids, we'll up it to 57 souls. :)
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Would you believe... we just got authorization recently to occupy the FA JS for commuting... That makes life a bit more easy on us...

Bob
 
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