Speaking of Aircraft Crash Investigations

derg

derg

Apparently a "terse" writer
Staff member
At Embry-Riddle, we had a instructor named Bill Waldock. Bill Waldock is a world reknown investigator and always talked about, and I paraphrase, "Beware of arriving at the crash site and saying 'ah ha' because it's never that simple"

This is an important thing to remember:

"If you look back thoroughly enough in the investigation process, any accident involves a chain of events," said Bill Waldock, a veteran air-crash investigator and associate administrator for the Center for Aerospace Safety and Education at Embry-Riddle Aeronautical University in Prescott, Ariz.

"There is no such thing as a single-cause accident or a single-event accident," he said. "Rather, it's what we call a hierarchy of human error -- all the places in the system where people make mistakes. It can start way back in the design phase of an airplane."
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I had aircraft crash investigation right before my lunch period.

I think I took off a few pounds that year.
 
Doug Taylor said:
I had aircraft crash investigation right before my lunch period.

I think I took off a few pounds that year.
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What do you weigh, 150 pounds sopping wet with a wet towel wrapped around your head.


/grumbles off about loosing weight
 
I have started running again, but I'm way phatter than that! :)
 
That's a valid and well known observation from an expert.

On the other hand what we've been talking about in the LEX accident is the simple observation that the plane went off the end of the short runway. When you can't even comment on observable physical evidence (in a quite unofficial forum no less) you're taking Bill's teachings a little far imo.
 
Where was the statement that I said that people cannot comment made?

I've challenged comments, but I don't believe I said you cannot comment.

I gave someone a 'time out' until 7pm EDT, is that what you're referring to?

Besides, Mr. Waldock has investigated hundreds of aircraft accidents. I've been in zero and have investigated no live accident scenes in an non-academic environment. If Bill Waldock or MikeD aren't giving out valuable insight on tragic events such as this, who is?

Wolf Blitzer?!

Flyboi1337 at Airliners.net?
 
flyover said:
That's a valid and well known observation from an expert.

On the other hand what we've been talking about in the LEX accident is the simple observation that the plane went off the end of the short runway. When you can't even comment on observable physical evidence (in a quite unofficial forum no less) you're taking Bill's teachings a little far imo.
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Actually, I'm in agreement with the both of you, but I'm leaning more Dave's generalization of Bill D as valid. It wasn't specific to any comments on this thread.
 
flyover said:
That's a valid and well known observation from an expert.

On the other hand what we've been talking about in the LEX accident is the simple observation that the plane went off the end of the short runway. When you can't even comment on observable physical evidence (in a quite unofficial forum no less) you're taking Bill's teachings a little far imo.
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Bill is the expert. He is one of the top guys in the safety industry. I know that he wont speculate in the media cause he is smart enough not to do so. It is one of the first things he teaches us as investigators. I just wish more so called "experts" would do the same.
 
Champcar said:
Bill is the expert. He is one of the top guys in the safety industry. I know that he wont speculate in the media cause he is smart enough not to do so. It is one of the first things he teaches us as investigators. I just wish more so called "experts" would do the same.
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"teaches us as investigators"? Are you an investigator? There are many "experts", by the way, I would not classify him as "THE" expert. Personally, I would not trust anyone that calls themSELF an expert (like Archie Trammel, for example!), and I would venture that the gent you refer to would not refer to himself that way, either.

As for the top aviation safety investigator school, I think USC has that distinction, last I checked.
 
seagull said:
"teaches us as investigators"? Are you an investigator? There are many "experts", by the way, I would not classify him as "THE" expert. Personally, I would not trust anyone that calls themSELF an expert (like Archie Trammel, for example!), and I would venture that the gent you refer to would not refer to himself that way, either.

As for the top aviation safety investigator school, I think USC has that distinction, last I checked.
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The Prescott campus has a much better lab and resources than USC does. I said that Bill is the expert, not him. I know him because I worked for him for the past 3 years. I have trained to be an investigator with him but it is a very hard industry to get into.
 
There were crash scenes strewn across campus and we had the property to fairly accurately recreate them. I think it might be the only scale lab in the country.
 
Did you dig thru the CE-401A scene? Pretty nasty what happened with that one.
 
Oh yeah, I have spent so much time in the lab. The Caravan is the worst, but that may be to new for you.

The 401 is the most complex accident, Bill has too much fun buring that scene every year.
 
All light airplane stuff, or do they have some transports as well?

Been several years since I went through accident investigation school, at the time USC was noted, more for it's staff, though. I have had the unfortunate experience of getting to spend a lot of time on the real thing, but the labs are a good idea for training. Guess I learned the hard way!
 
Not when I was there. Hey, tell ya what, fly out to Arizona, Kristie, MikeD and I will take you out for some margaritas and tacos, then we can check out the crash lab up in PRC.

It's really pretty interesting.
 
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