737 goes down off Hawaii
- Thread starter GypsyPilot
- Start date
BEEF SUPREME
Well-Known Member
Pilots do dumb things. I try and learn from it, so I maybe will stop myself from doing dumb things too....
Cherokee_Cruiser
Bronteroc
You’re delusional if you think all 121s are the same.
Murdoughnut
Well sized member
Question for the pros - does the wrong engine get rolled back as frequently in the sim as it does (seemingly) in real life? Was just wondering if this was a function of stress that can't really be replicated in the sim.
KLB
Well-Known Member
All 91/135 operators aren't the same just like all 121 operators aren't the same. This isn't a complicated concept the grasp.
Same back to you about 91 operations
BobDDuck
Island Bus Driver
I think it's more a question of training scenarios. It's very rare to get an insidious failure in the sim. Normally it's a big bang and total loss of power. Or a generator that blows and can't be reset. The reality though is that often times when things break they do it in unspectacular ways. The engine slowly looses power or just starts to run rough. The number 2 AC bus keep fluctuating and load shedding and then picking things back up again and again.
We (generally) don't train how we fight.
zmiller4
Well-Known Member
Says the dunderhead who is trying pathetically to create a derogatory term for *all* corporate pilots.
Well done, ya dingus.
Screaming_Emu
Well-Known Member
We’ve been waiting for you to do this for a long time…
GypsyPilot
Mohawk Town
What? Running checklists?
CoffeeIcePapers
Well-Hung Member
Checklists that take too long to run, instead of prioritizing getting the aircraft on the ground. The engine failure after takeoff at spirit took about 20 minutes to run. That’s excessive.
Wardogg
Meat Popsicle
Almost to a fault. Didn't Sully start the APU after flameout even though it was step 23 in the dual engine failure? And caught flak for it?
Lets not forget this was at night. Over water. Black hole departures are a thing and add complexity and stress to a situation that is rapidly going south.
Wardogg
Meat Popsicle
And probably written by lawyers not pilots.
The GIV checklists for an engine failure after V1 first step was 1. Maintain directional control.
Really?
Hey, that’s the NearJet’s step 1 too!
BobDDuck
Island Bus Driver
There have been a pretty high number of hull losses due to pilots trying to troubleshoot and do other stuff right after an engine failure. Procedures are written for the lowest common denominator.
BEEF SUPREME
Well-Known Member
GypsyPilot
Mohawk Town
If the engine isn’t an uncontrolled fire that won’t go out, who cares?
I’ve flown as a PIC in 135 charter, 91 corporate, and 121. The more experienced I get, the more I chill out and take my time. I’ve seen some real cowboy stuff in my 91/135 days…. No thanks. I’ll take my time and make sure it’s done right.
Pilots that rush make me nervous.
Boris Badenov
Fortis Leader
Well, in this case the engine was very not on fire, but they wound up crashing in to the ocean in the middle of the night and very nearly becoming fish-food, when they could easily have turned around and landed right now.
Landing an airplane isn't a freaking shuttle launch. Is the gear down? Are the flaps configured? Is the runway long enough? Do we have a good ref?
In general I agree with the "slow and steady" philosophy, but there are going to be some moments, however well one tries to engineer a "slow and steady" solution to every situation, which are exigent enough to require some individual initiative for an optimal outcome. IMHO, this was one of those.
Cherokee_Cruiser
Bronteroc
Same back to you about 91 operations
Fair enough.
But it’s the structural issues you can’t change. Eg, it’s legal in a 91 to depart 0/0, I mean crap like that is BS.
Requirements - in general - are more robust in 121 versus others.
Plus - and don’t deny this - but the Corpie world is FULL of the good ol boys club.
GypsyPilot
Mohawk Town
There was no reason to rush in this incident, not sure why you think that had anything to do with it.