TSLA now valued at 464.3B

I’m surprised to hear you say that, usually you seem like someone that can be objective. Teslas are cool, but their fit and finish is awful. Not only is that well known by like every automotive journalist, you can see it for yourself in person. Thin paint, panel gaps, etc. I notice it all the time when walking by them. They also have horrific reliability, finishing almost last in rankings for years now:


The interiors are also cheap, and the display/driver dash is lacking.

I’m very pro-American business, and am stoked we have this amazing car company to somewhat “disrupt” the industry. But they have some major challenges, and as a former mechanical engineer and lifetime car guy that has designed and built FSAE race cars I see some major issues that need to be dealt with. It would be extremely foolish to think Tesla is somehow untouchable when it comes to quality, value, and (shortly down the road) technology.

I said it before, but it bears repeating: EVs are MUCH simpler than ICE cars and there's really no reason every established auto manufacturer can’t come up with a very nice product in the next couple of years. The Mach-E quite frankly has surprised me with how quickly it came along.

As someone who actually owns one and has put 14,000 miles on it, I can say with certainty that that’s all BS. I don’t know anyone who actually owns a Tesla who would agree with any of that.

Are the finishes German luxury quality? No. But they’re far superior to anything Toyota has ever put out. And the technology more than makes up for it.
 
As someone who actually owns one and has put 14,000 miles on it, I can say with certainty that that’s all BS. I don’t know anyone who actually owns a Tesla who would agree with any of that.

Are the finishes German luxury quality? No. But they’re far superior to anything Toyota has ever put out. And the technology more than makes up for it.

I don’t know man, the new Supra looks pretty nice!

Wish it came in a manual!
 
As someone who actually owns one and has put 14,000 miles on it, I can say with certainty that that’s all BS. I don’t know anyone who actually owns a Tesla who would agree with any of that.

Are the finishes German luxury quality? No. But they’re far superior to anything Toyota has ever put out. And the technology more than makes up for it.

Your anecdotal experience doesn’t mean anything. Again, Teslas are cool and if I were looking for a car a Model 3 Performance would be on my radar. I have been looking at these cars for years, and the only concern I do have that keeps coming up is reliability and fit/finish.





Are they pieces of junk? Absolutely not. But they aren’t perfect either, and I have no doubt that other manufacturers will have similarly competitive offerings in the near future. There’s nothing Tesla does that is out of reach.
 
Your anecdotal experience doesn’t mean anything. Again, Teslas are cool and if I were looking for a car a Model 3 Performance would be on my radar. I have been looking at these cars for years, and the only concern I do have that keeps coming up is reliability and fit/finish.





Are they pieces of junk? Absolutely not. But they aren’t perfect either, and I have no doubt that other manufacturers will have similarly competitive offerings in the near future. There’s nothing Tesla does that is out of reach.
We’re very happy with our Model 3. There are issues but no more than I’ve had with my Tacoma. The big difference? I have to call the Toyota dealer, head to their shop, spend hours of my time there, and hope it’s fixed. Tesla on the other hand, you make a service request through the app, they come to your house and fix it in your driveway. On the off chance you have to take it in to the dealership they get you an Uber and a $200 travel voucher.
 
Yes, TSLA is now worth more than 464.3B USD. That's as much as the combined total of GE, Toyota, Boeing, FedEx, UPS, GM, Ford, and Honda (464.6B).

What is going on with this market? Is anyone else concerned?
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As someone who actually owns one and has put 14,000 miles on it, I can say with certainty that that’s all BS. I don’t know anyone who actually owns a Tesla who would agree with any of that.

Are the finishes German luxury quality? No. But they’re far superior to anything Toyota has ever put out. And the technology more than makes up for it.


I don’t know man, the new BMW Z4 M40I Coup looks pretty nice!

Wish it came in a manual!

FTFY

Wish it came WITH a manual...and... wish I could READ.

FTFY.
 
We’re very happy with our Model 3. There are issues but no more than I’ve had with my Tacoma. The big difference? I have to call the Toyota dealer, head to their shop, spend hours of my time there, and hope it’s fixed. Tesla on the other hand, you make a service request through the app, they come to your house and fix it in your driveway. On the off chance you have to take it in to the dealership they get you an Uber and a $200 travel voucher.

Wow, that definitely is impressive service!
 
We’re very happy with our Model 3. There are issues but no more than I’ve had with my Tacoma. The big difference? I have to call the Toyota dealer, head to their shop, spend hours of my time there, and hope it’s fixed. Tesla on the other hand, you make a service request through the app, they come to your house and fix it in your driveway. On the off chance you have to take it in to the dealership they get you an Uber and a $200 travel voucher.

That's Toyota? I know for both my father's Porsche and BMW when they needed MX (under warranty) a guy from the dealership drove the loaner home, and took our car back to fix. Then brought it back once fixed and took the loaner back. This is 1 hr drive to nearest Porsche dealer and about 35 minutes for BMW. He didn't pay anything extra for this.


And if your car is out of warranty, I always use www.yourmechanic.com . Just as you said, they come to your house and do whatever work you need done on your car.
 
We’re very happy with our Model 3. There are issues but no more than I’ve had with my Tacoma. The big difference? I have to call the Toyota dealer, head to their shop, spend hours of my time there, and hope it’s fixed. Tesla on the other hand, you make a service request through the app, they come to your house and fix it in your driveway. On the off chance you have to take it in to the dealership they get you an Uber and a $200 travel voucher.

That’s got a lot to do with the current volume of market share they enjoy, a few years from now I expect their levels to drop to more the status quo experienced in the general population. Just for baseline, particular niche cars within bland who gives a crap brands enjoy special status. Chrysler is by no means the benchmark in customer service, but if you’re a viper owner with an issue they will put a guy on a plane and send him to fix your car because only certain people are cleared to work on it.

I’ve driven Tesla’s, and I’ve got 2 guys I work with that own them. They work but they are by no means special or head and shoulders above something. Honestly the hype reminds me of Toyota Tundra owners in the 2010 prior talking down their noses as everybody because “Toyota’s are the best” and meanwhile they had more recalls than any other truck in the country. It was way more perception than reality and this feels very similar.

Tesla’s days are numbered because brands like Audi are coming for their special cool car status putting affordable and mass produced EVs in all those popular segments (cross overs/suv/family cars) and unlike Tesla they are going to do it en mass with quality that is the enth degree. That’s fine because they are far more invested in the infrastructure with batteries and other products than they are with actual automobiles. They jump started an evolution to EV when their real interest was owning the patents on all the tech people are now leveraging to make the new models in segments they’ve always made. Nobody made a damn hover car. When that happens call me.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 
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That's Toyota? I know for both my father's Porsche and BMW when they needed MX (under warranty) a guy from the dealership drove the loaner home, and took our car back to fix. Then brought it back once fixed and took the loaner back. This is 1 hr drive to nearest Porsche dealer and about 35 minutes for BMW. He didn't pay anything extra for this.


And if your car is out of warranty, I always use www.yourmechanic.com . Just as you said, they come to your house and do whatever work you need done on your car.
We clearly grew up in different worlds.

If my car is out of warranty I fix it myself.
 
We clearly grew up in different worlds.

If my car is out of warranty I fix it myself.

I wish I grew up learning how to do that kind of stuff with my hands. Since it's too late for that, now I youtube things to see what I can do. Last time around on my E300 I changed the air filter under the dashboard and saved ~$110 from having it done at the dealership. But oil change, brakes, rotors, I have used yourmechanic.com for that.
 
We clearly grew up in different worlds.

If my car is out of warranty I fix it myself.

I’ve rebuilt engines and countless carbs, ground valves/seats, turned rotors, and welded frames. I’ve even done some electrical work and engine tuning/mapping.

But the past few years I just took my cars to a mechanic I trust. It’s just a lot easier, and the time spent I’d be much better off just working a little extra or be outside mountain biking or something. Of course, I don’t even own a car anymore so that definitely makes things easier!
 
I’ve rebuilt engines and countless carbs, ground valves/seats, turned rotors, and welded frames. I’ve even done some electrical work and engine tuning/mapping.

But the past few years I just took my cars to a mechanic I trust. It’s just a lot easier, and the time spent I’d be much better off just working a little extra or be outside mountain biking or something. Of course, I don’t even own a car anymore so that definitely makes things easier!
That’s cool, and a different conversation can be had about the merits of DIY vs shops. My only point is that for a mid level sedan, the Tesla is a very easy car to own.
 
Wake me when Toyota has a car that drives itself all the way from Atlanta to Daytona Beach without me touching a thing. Because my Tesla does that for me every week. I won’t hold my breath.

I hear you Todd, but I think the other guys are catching up quickly. GM supposedly has some pretty impressive autonomous technology in testing, and the Ford Mach-E currently does and is releasing more functional updates within the next 6 months.

If I were to guess, I’d imagine both GM and Ford are still playing catch-up... But I don’t see this as an insurmountable engineering challenge for them to at least be close to Tesla in the near term.


The hardest thing to do in engineering is to be innovative, but once something exists it’s relatively simple to reverse engineer it within the realm of legality (i.e. avoiding patent infringement and that sort of thing).
 
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That’s cool, and a different conversation can be had about the merits of DIY vs shops. My only point is that for a mid level sedan, the Tesla is a very easy car to own.

I think the overall reliability of EVs is going to be insane as they continue to evolve. They are extremely simple compared to an ICE drivetrain.
 
Wake me when Toyota has a car that drives itself all the way from Atlanta to Daytona Beach without me touching a thing. Because my Tesla does that for me every week. I won’t hold my breath.

Toyota, GM, and a half dozen other bland who cares established car manufacturers all have self drive programs in development to demonstration models.

The difference is they haven’t had to explain to the NHTSB why their car inexplicably killed somebody or caused a crash under that mode of driving.

Tesla hasn’t done anything impossible with their tech, they’ve just been willing to go there first when they lack the ability to manufacture enough product to completely monopolize the market. The rest of the market is happy to let them plow ahead through the deep snow and enjoy shorter and cheaper development timelines when they can produce en mass what Tesla can only make in small numbers.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 
I think the overall reliability of EVs is going to be insane as they continue to evolve. They are extremely simple compared to an ICE drivetrain.
No doubt, what’s there to work on?

Tesla has production quality issues, no question. But because they make it so easy to address anything that comes up they’ve taken the headache out of dealing with them. Perfect product? No. Functional and easy to live with through excellent customer service? Yes. Replicable from other manufacturers? We’ll see.
 
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