There Is A Magical Place Called Bomber Camp

RDoug

RDoug

Well-Known Member
This sounds just too neat:

There Is A Magical Place Called Bomber Camp Where B-17s And B-24s Still Drop Bombs
  • Another adventure like none other has been added to that list—experiencing a full recreation of a World War II bombing mission, including the actual bomb dropping part.
  • The Collings Foundation's WWII era B-17G, B-24J, B-25, and P-51, as well as a PV-2D and other assorted planes, have been integrated into the program.
  • The gunnery classes include how to operate the aircraft's Browning 50 caliber machine guns and how to employ the bomber's turrets. Bombing instruction includes the fundamentals of hitting targets with once top-secret Norden and Sperry computing bombsites.
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If you want all out, Resurrect a couple of "big belly" B-52Ds, and have bomber camp, Linebacker II style. Complete with dropping 108 x Mk82 500 pound bombs per plane, against the deadliest Integrated Air Defense System we have faced in our history, to date.
 
MikeD said:
If you want all out, Resurrect a couple of "big belly" B-52Ds, and have bomber camp, Linebacker II style. Complete with dropping 108 x Mk82 500 pound bombs per plane, against the deadliest Integrated Air Defense System we have faced in our history, to date.
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Let's make it really realistic and stack everyone in cells of three and have everyone use the *exact same* ingress and egress vectors.

To be painfully pedantic, there were a bunch of B52G models in LB2 out of Andersen, as well. My uncle was the commander of the first B52 shot down in LB2.
 
FlyingAccountant said:
Let's make it really realistic and stack everyone in cells of three and have everyone use the *exact same* ingress and egress vectors.

To be painfully pedantic, there were a bunch of B52G models in LB2 out of Andersen, as well. My uncle was the commander of the first B52 shot down in LB2.
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The first 3 days were a clown act like that sadly. Until we got some real planning done like the crews were demanding, with multiple ingress/egress routes and varying times, to overwhelm the NVN air defense system.

Yup, the Gs shared Guam with the Ds, although the Ds were the bulk of the force. The Gs apparently didn't have a particular ECM upgrade for electronic defense, and also weren't big belly mods so they had fewer bombs. They were eventually pulled following a number of losses. However the G model served a great career and served well in Desert Storm.

That's very interesting about your uncle. Can't imagine having gone up against those defenses during Linebacker II, which were far more dense and dangerous than Rolling Thunder operations from 1965-68 were in the same place.

One of the B-52s that was shot up by SAMs over Hanoi and managed to limp all the way back to Thailand, but crashed on landing during a go-around, had only 2 survivors, the co-pilot and the tailgunner, who were pulled out of the burning wreckage. The co-pilot, Robert Hymel, finished his career in the USAF, retiring as a LtCol in the early 1990s after recovering from his wounds from that 1972 crash of his B-52. Sadly, he was killed on 9/11/2001 in the Pentagon, where he was working as a civilian in the same wing that American 77 crashed into.

Interesting article here on a Linebacker II mission:

http://www.historynet.com/nightmare-up-north-b-52s-over-hanoi-in-linebacker-ii.htm

The jets who the NVN feared during Linebacker, were the B-52 and the F-111. The F-111s were particularly nasty with their low-level radar evading night all-weather abilities, hitting targets before the NVN knew they were there.
 
Murdoughnut said:
Maybe even gentiles only.
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There were plenty of American pilots that happened to be Jews. Here are some of the ones that helped set up Israel's Air Force and win their independence.

Amazing new movie about the Jewish-American WWII pilots that helped fight Israel's first war - Martha Hall Kelly

Here's a british source talking about Jewish pilots flying during the battle of britain.

Jewish Pilots and Aircrews in the Battle of Britain

I have to catch a flight, but there are some fascinating stories for sure.
 
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IMS, the pilot who put a bomb through Roland Friesler's window was reputed to be Jewish, which must have been a pretty nice feeling for said pilot.
 
The US military didn't care what religion you were, just your skin color. It was the country clubs that didn't let Jews in until the 60's.
 
MikeD said:
The first 3 days were a clown act like that sadly. Until we got some real planning done like the crews were demanding, with multiple ingress/egress routes and varying times, to overwhelm the NVN air defense system.

Yup, the Gs shared Guam with the Ds, although the Ds were the bulk of the force. The Gs apparently didn't have a particular ECM upgrade for electronic defense, and also weren't big belly mods so they had fewer bombs. They were eventually pulled following a number of losses. However the G model served a great career and served well in Desert Storm.
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Yeah, it's my understanding the G's had bigger fuel tanks and longer range than the D's, which is why they were stationed out at Andersen, as opposed to U Tapao.

That's very interesting about your uncle. Can't imagine having gone up against those defenses during Linebacker II, which were far more dense and dangerous than Rolling Thunder operations from 1965-68 were in the same place.

Interesting article here on a Linebacker II mission:

http://www.historynet.com/nightmare-up-north-b-52s-over-hanoi-in-linebacker-ii.htm
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The Christmas Bombing | Military Aviation | Air & Space Magazine

Check this out. This account was written based off a memoir written by the EWO in my uncle's aircraft. They got hit by two SAMs in the cockpit area. My uncle and his co-pilot were fatally injured by the missiles but were still able to eject themselves. They were both dead by the time they hit the ground. Three guys survived including the EWO, and became short term residents of the Hanoi Hilton. The wreckage of the plane is in a military museum in Hanoi.

Back on topic, I'd love to see a flyable B52 make it into civilian hands at some point. Although, I doubt that will happen as long as they're in active service. I'll be a very old man by the time that happens, if ever.
 
Interviewer at mainline: "I see you have 1.2 logged in a B-17"

Interviewee: "Yup"

Hired.

I'd love to bank some" volunteer time" at a place like this one.
 
FlyingAccountant said:
Yeah, it's my understanding the G's had bigger fuel tanks and longer range than the D's, which is why they were stationed out at Andersen, as opposed to U Tapao.



The Christmas Bombing | Military Aviation | Air & Space Magazine

Check this out. This account was written based off a memoir written by the EWO in my uncle's aircraft. They got hit by two SAMs in the cockpit area. My uncle and his co-pilot were fatally injured by the missiles but were still able to eject themselves. They were both dead by the time they hit the ground. Three guys survived including the EWO, and became short term residents of the Hanoi Hilton. The wreckage of the plane is in a military museum in Hanoi.
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Excellent article. Yeah SAC HQ, in their nuke attack mentaility, demanded to plan the missions instead of delegating it to the Guam/Thailand operations staffs who knew the air war first hand and thought in a conventional bombing mindset tactics-wise. Those early losses the first few days need not have happened had SAC listened to their guys in the field.

The night when Hanoi was first annpunced as the target the B-52s were going to go up against, the descriptions and pictures of the bomber crew briefing rooms do seem to be straight out of WWII 8th Air Force bomber command briefings where the mission briefer first announces the target of Schweinfurt or similar........just with a setting 28 years later, and with B-52s instead of B-17s.

"When Certain’s crew entered the briefing room at 11 in the morning on Monday, December 18, it was packed with over a hundred crew members. In a scene that seemed right out of the World War II film classic Twelve O’Clock High, the briefer came to the podium and announced, “Gentlemen, your target for tonight is Hanoi,” as a slide of North Vietnam with a target triangle over the capital lit up the screen behind him. This was the first time the big bombers would be sent against Hanoi’s heavy defenses."

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