FAA Issues Emergency Order of Revocation Against TapJets, Inc.

tomokc said:
A student pilot asked if she could have a "dual, cross-country instructional flight" to the OU-Texas football game with two friends in the back of a 172. Just a quick, same day down & back. Nothing in the regs prohibited it, but how would we explain it to FAA & NTSB if something went wrong? We declined.
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Texas fan? Let's do this.

OU fan? Obviously couldn't keep the greasy side down long enough to get there.
 
This is very simple, was money exchanged...period. And that is very simple to find out. And trust me, a person will not lie when the federal government is asking questions, why? They never ask a question they already don’t have the answer too.
 
SFLAX said:
And trust me, a person will not lie when the federal government is asking questions, why? They never ask a question they already don’t have the answer too.
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People lie all the time when the feds are asking questions. Even if they don't mean to. It's literally how they've gotten a bunch of the Trump stooges in the last few months.
 
tomokc said:
A student pilot asked if she could have a "dual, cross-country instructional flight" to the OU-Texas football game with two friends in the back of a 172. Just a quick, same day down & back. Nothing in the regs prohibited it, but how would we explain it to FAA & NTSB if something went wrong? We declined.
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Uhh, why would you ever not do this? There's nothing illegal about this at all. The student is paying for everything. The people riding in the back are friends of the student. It's a good training event (how often do you get to flight plan with a full plane as a student pilot), and did I mention there's nothing illegal about it?

I mean, the student needs cross countries, why not bring friends? You could fly out with the student, get a hamburger, and fly back and have it count. I really don't see the problem with this at all.
 
ppragman said:
Uhh, why would you ever not do this? There's nothing illegal about this at all. The student is paying for everything. The people riding in the back are friends of the student. It's a good training event (how often do you get to flight plan with a full plane as a student pilot), and did I mention there's nothing illegal about it?

I mean, the student needs cross countries, why not bring friends? You could fly out with the student, get a hamburger, and fly back and have it count. I really don't see the problem with this at all.
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I think it's a closer question than some think. No harm, probably no foul. But if there is a problem, what will the passengers say was the purpose of the flight and whether they contributed to the cost of the rental and the instruction?

I'm not saying there is anything wrong with it. Taking a friend on a flight is a great idea for many reasons. Just that it's not as clear once there is a purpose to the flight other than purely instruction.
 
MidlifeFlyer said:
I think it's a closer question than some think. No harm, probably no foul. But if there is a problem, what will the passengers say was the purpose of the flight and whether they contributed to the cost of the rental and the instruction?

I'm not saying there is anything wrong with it. Taking a friend on a flight is a great idea for many reasons. Just that it's not as clear once there is a purpose to the flight other than purely instruction.
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If the guy paid for the whole flight (what with it being a lesson and all) and then they went and did something before doing another lesson...what are the feds gonna say? That he was secretly offering charters with a student pilot onboard?

Nah. They’d lose that battle and they know it unless the student was doing the pro-rata thing with the other people, or something financially fishy, but honestly literally all you’d have to check is who paid.
 
SFLAX said:
This is very simple, was money exchanged...period. And that is very simple to find out. And trust me, a person will not lie when the federal government is asking questions, why? They never ask a question they already don’t have the answer too.
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Most criminal kingpins that are nabbed under Federal law are nabbed exactly for this - lying to the Fuzz.

The wheels turn slowly, but surely they turn.
 
NovemberEcho said:
SFLAX said:
So, test flights go from point A to B, people get off at point B and then....nice try.
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How is it different than if you gave some friends a one way ride in a 172? (Legitimate question, I know nothing about FARS)
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Money. Money is what makes this different. Taking a friend for a one way ride is normal. As long as said friend doesn’t pay you or offer to pay for the airplane. There are ways to share expenses on a trip with a common interest/ purpose, but if the purpose is one way transportation with compensation for a passenger that’s not permitted.


Sent from my Startac using Tapatalk.
 
CFI A&P said:
Money. Money is what makes this different. Taking a friend for a one way ride is normal. As long as said friend doesn’t pay you or offer to pay for the airplane. There are ways to share expenses on a trip with a common interest/ purpose, but if the purpose is one way transportation with compensation for a passenger that’s not permitted.


Sent from my Startac using Tapatalk.
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Well they are saying they were non-rev passengers
 
NovemberEcho said:
Well they are saying they were non-rev passengers
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Something about this doesn’t add up....they’re supposed to be an Uber of 135 operators, yet they supposedly flew their own pax and airplane? Did they have their own 135 cert? What plane were they flying that needed 2 crew?
 
Roger Roger said:
Something about this doesn’t add up....they’re supposed to be an Uber of 135 operators, yet they supposedly flew their own pax and airplane? Did they have their own 135 cert? What plane were they flying that needed 2 crew?
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That's what I was saying from the beginning. This supposedly happened over a year ago when they were just starting up. It sound to me like it was a test flight for their app and they happened to bring some friends and family along. They're more a travel agent than an airline. Wonder if maybe someone didn't get their cut or got fired and made an phone call to the FAA.
 
Roger Roger said:
Something about this doesn’t add up....they’re supposed to be an Uber of 135 operators, yet they supposedly flew their own pax and airplane? Did they have their own 135 cert? What plane were they flying that needed 2 crew?
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Like other pooplords, I'm sure that their model is so innovative and disruptive that we can't understand it. :)
 
NovemberEcho said:
Well they are saying they were non-rev passengers
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Of course they are. Doesn't everyone initially deny the crime when caught?

Fun fact: An inspector once told me that the FAA isn't the one to catch a illegal charters. The FAA has to catch you in the act during a ramp check or audit (91 operators performing illegal 135 trips don't get audited). Usually the IRS catches them. Always follow the money.
 
CFI A&P said:
Of course they are. Doesn't everyone initially deny the crime when caught?

Fun fact: An inspector once told me that the FAA isn't the one to catch a illegal charters. The FAA has to catch you in the act during a ramp check or audit (91 operators performing illegal 135 trips don't get audited). Usually the IRS catches them. Always follow the money.
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DOT is pretty good at that too.
 
Was there a filed FPL? If so, was it N or G?

If it was G, and the airplane is single pilot, then they have a case. Payment or not.
 
ppragman said:
If the guy paid for the whole flight (what with it being a lesson and all) and then they went and did something before doing another lesson...what are the feds gonna say? That he was secretly offering charters with a student pilot onboard?

Nah. They’d lose that battle and they know it unless the student was doing the pro-rata thing with the other people, or something financially fishy, but honestly literally all you’d have to check is who paid.
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The best way to win a fight is by not getting into one in the first place. And given the unpredictability of some investigators, who knows the outcome? We explained, she understood, and drove to Dallas with her friends.
 
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