Cloud Surfer
All Roads lead to Trantor
Their desperation literally reeks through my computer screen.
United Airlines Top Pilot Has A Lot To Say About Perceived Pilot Shortage
- Thread starter JetDoc
- Start date
Richman
JC’s Resident Curmudgeon
In the past year or so I've bumped into some "high ranking" people who are shockingly....and I do mean shockingly, un-informed on the "civilian pipeline".
I've had the kind of conversations where about 3 minutes in you're asking yourself "ok, clearly I'm coming from this from a different perspective, because there is no way that this person is this un-informed as to how the world really works", and about 3 minutes after that you're saying to yourself "holy cow, this person, who people actually listen to, is actually THAT un-informed as to how the world works!".
Throw in the people who don't care, those that don't want to care and add a dose of folks with ulterior motives, and it's a fun time.
I've had the kind of conversations where about 3 minutes in you're asking yourself "ok, clearly I'm coming from this from a different perspective, because there is no way that this person is this un-informed as to how the world really works", and about 3 minutes after that you're saying to yourself "holy cow, this person, who people actually listen to, is actually THAT un-informed as to how the world works!".
Throw in the people who don't care, those that don't want to care and add a dose of folks with ulterior motives, and it's a fun time.
F
Flying Saluki
Guest
The pilot shortage was caused by the downturn after 9/11 and the subsequent reductions in airline employee compensation packages. People who otherwise might have become pilots realized there were easier ways to starve to death. So they chose other professions. Regional airlines responded to the shortage by lowering the barriers to entry. Then Colgan 3407 happened, and ALPA and Congress colluded to raise hiring minimums rather than improving training, which further exacerbated the shortage.
Cptnchia
Dissatisfied Customer
mastermags
Well-Known Member *giggity*
Well placed
Richman
JC’s Resident Curmudgeon
Not to mention the rapid escalation in training costs post 9/11. If it had tracked inflation, it should only cost $30-35k for zero to hero.
The giant run up in college costs hurt as well, as it funneled money that could have been used for flight training.
Double whammy.
The giant run up in college costs hurt as well, as it funneled money that could have been used for flight training.
Double whammy.
Richman
JC’s Resident Curmudgeon
If the price of something goes up outside the normal CPI, either there is a shortage (IE basic economics) or there is some kind of revenue "leakage" going on (IE someone's cut is getting a lot bigger).
Health care and University's come to mind. I'm as much of a fan of higher education as you will find, but the collapse coming in that area, and the financial pinch for some it will cause, will be well earned.
Health care and University's come to mind. I'm as much of a fan of higher education as you will find, but the collapse coming in that area, and the financial pinch for some it will cause, will be well earned.
z987k
Well-Known Member
The unlimited flow of money is ridiculous. They can charge any amount because you have to go to college and they'll give you a loan no matter how much.
Roger Roger
Bottom of the list
It's almost like massive amounts of government money funnelling into an industry causes a bubble. If only we had some precedent in other industries to go by...
z987k
Well-Known Member
The housing bubble is going to burst again. You should see the amount they will loan me. I can't figure out how I'd make the monthly payment but they'll give me the loan.
I don't see why the airlines can't consolidate routes and fly larger jets. The regional model already has RJs flying traditionally mainline routes and with this huge proliferation in regional jets they can always sell off more and more RJs and fly bigger aircraft half as often which would also help out with airport congestion.
Richman
JC’s Resident Curmudgeon
...and coaches that make more than the University President.
Don't get me started on the whole college athletics thing....
Cóndor
Well-Known Member
Yup, the banksters come to mind almost immediately . . . and after the buble burst they were right back at it through the QE scheme lol
wheelsup
Well-Known Member
AA mainline CASM: $0.125
AA regional CASM: $0.197
If AA could consolidate their costs would almost halve
Pretty crazy how much those RJs cost to run
The problem is all of their hubs, unlike DAL who runs something like 80% of their traffic through ATL. It's a better system. DAL can run one MD80 to ATL where as AA will run RJs to DFW, CLT, PHL, ORD, etc.
That being said any company running RJs nowadays is at a disadvantage cost wise.
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z987k
Well-Known Member
I wonder how that compares to United and Delta's regional feed vs narrowbody. I also wonder the number of regional airplanes each has.
The cost per seat mile is less on a mainline but will they be filled if you (let's say) change from 5 RJ flights to 3 mainline flights? Will people be willing to have a longer layover? Will the flight times even line up with the connecting flights?
lets say someone is trying to fly from nashville to savanah on delta. Right now it's likely that they would have 2 short RJ flights with a small layover in atl, but if the frequency of both the RJ flights is cut what would be an hour layover would likely turn into 3 hours. With the high cost of air fair I would bet more people would just drive as it would take just as long from arriving at Nashville to collecting bags in Savannah. As more people drive or just skip out do to lack of convenience there will be a lot less seats filled then when on RJs, less seats filled means less or no profit on that flight. Lack of profit on a certain flight would cause more cuts, the more cuts the More likely people will skip flying,it's a vicious cycle. They need rjs to keep the convience factor for many smaller routes. Now that I have said that there is no reason that a lot of RJ routes can't be cut between some cities, ex slc-lax, there is literally a flight every hour or less being a mix of mainline and rj. Same goes for lax-sea, jfk-atl etc...
Cloud Surfer
All Roads lead to Trantor
Just spoke with a buddy of mine who recently graduated from UND. Most flight classes are overflowing with students who have been put on a waiting list to take courses. He instructs in FAR at a part 61 FBO. Several students there who wish to learn for a possible future profession. What is happening there is most likely occurring at other flight schools in the USA. This so called shortage at the regionals is but a temporary hiccup that could and will be relieved one day if pay and QOL keep on increasing at the regionals. Disclaimer: I have no hard stats to back that statement up, just a strong hunch.
Cptnchia
Dissatisfied Customer
Bad example. There are 11 flights a day between both SAV-ATL and BNA-ATL. All of them are mainline flights.
The places that Delta serves with RJ flights usually only have 4-5 flights a day to begin with. Those people are more likely to drive from the closer places because there is less frequency and longer layovers in ATL. Something like Chattanooga TN to Columbus GA. And even CHA has mainline service. So does AGS and GSP. It's a 20 minute flight to those places.