SpiceWeasel
Tre Kronor
The nAAtives love prospective coworkers, I see.
APA and AAG Senior Management Meeting Synopsis
- Thread starter chrisreedrules
- Start date
The nAAtives love prospective coworkers, I see.
chrisreedrules
Master Blaster
I am in my "lane". Again, some of you are making this something it isn't.
Kingairer
'Tiger Team' Member
Prospective being the key word. I won't go into it all, but not a fan of flow through programs and the entitlement and eventuality it produces.
chrisreedrules
Master Blaster
Get real. It's not like any of us except those who are 1 or 2 years from flowing are even counting on it. And many are here because they specifically want to work for AA and a WO with a flow seems to be about the best way these days. Maybe you are taking your feelings on the flow through programs out on the wrong people. We didn't make the game or even deal the cards, we just play it.
L-16B
Well-Known Member
I'm not a fan of flow agreements at all, but I dont really see an entitlement issue either. Then again the only wholly owned people I know are former pinnacolaba people at PSA. None of the flows/preferential hires from my summer 2013 class seemed entitled to me at all.
@chrisreedrules what you brought up is a good example on why to not vote yes on anything that doesn't meet your standards. Dougie is a good CEO, but will never be labor friendly or give things up mid contract. The paltry profit sharing was a gesture for share holders and wall street, not the employees.
@chrisreedrules what you brought up is a good example on why to not vote yes on anything that doesn't meet your standards. Dougie is a good CEO, but will never be labor friendly or give things up mid contract. The paltry profit sharing was a gesture for share holders and wall street, not the employees.
Gonzo
Well-Known Member
That isn't right, with flows at AA. Eagle help make this • game up and PSA and PDT and asked to join the game.
chrisreedrules
Master Blaster
That's not how that worked.
Stone Cold
Well-Known Member
Eh, not worth the argument that would ensue after my comment.
Best of luck to all out there.
Gonzo
Well-Known Member
So please fill me on how it worked, you answer is wrong if it does not include letter 3 somewhere in it.
jynxyjoe
Queso King
3 is the number thou shall countith to... niether thee 1 nor 2 is thigh number... 4! Is right out. The number youshall countith to is 3 and 3 is the only number though shall use
chrisreedrules
Master Blaster
AAG management wanted all THREE of its wholly owneds to have a flow to make them all the same across the board. It had a lot less to do with the respective pilot groups wanting it than AAG synergy at its WOs. They offered it in exchange for no concessions (which doesn't mean we should have taken their first offer, but that is besides the point of this conversation) so why not take it? Most of the current pilots on property at PSA weren't even eligible to vote on the flow agreement, and many are not happy with it (believe it or not). And PSA/PDT already had interview programs in place on the US side that were essentially flows themself.
Autothrust Blue
"Well, on the Brasilia..."
Christ, I worked there and I still can't keep it all straight.
Autothrust Blue
"Well, on the Brasilia..."
Well, isn't that just too damn bad.
chrisreedrules
Master Blaster
SpiceWeasel
Tre Kronor
You're righteousness against the flow is taken under advisement. Next thing you know I'll be told that Endeavor shouldn't have voted on a bankruptcy contract that included an SSP. We will definitely fall on our swords for everyone else.
Autothrust Blue
"Well, on the Brasilia..."
A deal done in bankruptcy may be a rotten deal, but you won't find me hugely critical of that particular arrangement (or the people behind it, either) beyond pedagogic reasons.
BobDDuck
Island Bus Driver
Actually, PSA had "LOA TBD" a bit before Eagle got Letter 3 (which I agree with you was long before PSA and PDT got their current flow language).
Of course the TBD never was determined , but that's not the point.
RPM
Well-Known Member
You should tell that to one of the current Eagle pilots flowing that has dedicated 16-20 years of his life to AMR, now AAG. You know.. the guys that lost their CA seats and stagnated their careers for YEARS due to hundreds of AA pilots that flowed back to Eagle and occupied our seats (as part of the Letter 3 deal). I spent several years flying with AA flow-backs here as well which stagnated my movement almost a decade ago. Flow was a 2 way street for Eagle/AA. Our pilots could go up, they could come back if they furloughed, and they did. Funny how a bunch of people over there forget "that" part of the deal, which gave a home to AA guys at our highest CA pay rates to their furloughed pilots when they needed it, yet now the mainline guys have a problem with flow since their buddies can't get hired. Most guys get it, it's typically Usair people nowadays complaining about it for the most part since they have no idea about how any of the convoluted "letter 3" situation came to be.
Then, back in 2011 ALPA decided to give up the rights of us flying our own American Eagle aircraft in a "grievance settlement" with AMR to get a flow deal for more of the pilots here at Eagle that weren't part of the 824 arbitrated agreement for harmed flow pilots. This covered all pilots on property up to 10/2011. Supposedly it was just going to provide our more junior pilots with enhanced job protections and no harm would come from it. It was just a legality/paperwork thing the company needed if we were divested they claimed.. Yeah.., since that screw job deal was made via ALPA/management our fleet has been decimated and handed out to multiple other carriers due to that messed up back-room agreement that allowed our Eagle flying/aircraft to transfer without us or our contract attached with it anymore. The pilots at Eagle earned their flow rights to AA through taking in AA flow-backs into our CA seats, YEARS of stagnation and displacements, and now, loss of our aircraft to others due to that grievance settlement/flow deal with AMR. These guys here have earned this flow-through a lot more so than some person hired off the street who has invested nothing into AA.
Maybe not the new hires that just walked into this newest post bankruptcy "eNvoy" flow deal without paying for it, but the rest of us have paid and sacrificed for many years for this court ordered flow & the current contractual flow rights we have paid dearly for. Some more than others.
As far as PDT and PSA, I have no idea what kind of agreement they had or didn't have with USair before the merger. One of those guys would have to comment on that..
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Autothrust Blue
"Well, on the Brasilia..."
I'm going to start saying "TBD" from now on.
