Interesting thoughts on ORD layout...

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I always dreaded the non-western controller overseas. I remember holding forever in a -60 at OKBK. I finally asked who we were waiting for after five minutes and no traffic. "Liberty 71, you waiting for a 747, 30 mile final.":bang:
 
On a lighter note i found a video of my crew at ZAU during a KORD arrival rush.




yea that supervisor was a real bastard !!!!!!!!!!!
 
MikeD said:
Toughest I've ever personally seen are US/ROK PAR controllers in the GCA at KwangJu recovering multiple out of fuel F-4/F-5 fighters in the middle of a Korean snowstorm, without a hitch and without a missed approach. Well done jobing it there.
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The flip side were the ROK controllers.
"Red Baron 26, IFR cancelled. You go now."
"Ummm... what do you mean IFR cancelled?? We're IMC??"
"Yes. IFR cancelled. You go now. Bye bye."
"Mother..... go where??? WE ARE IMC."
"Bye bye."
"Crap. Osan approach, Red Baron 26 on guard."
 
Blackhawk said:
The flip side were the ROK controllers.
"Red Baron 26, IFR cancelled. You go now."
"Ummm... what do you mean IFR cancelled?? We're IMC??"
"Yes. IFR cancelled. You go now. Bye bye."
"Mother..... go where??? WE ARE IMC."
"Bye bye."
"Crap. Osan approach, Red Baron 26 on guard."
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Or this ROK controller...


"This is Watchman on Guard, Gunhog flight you are approaching P-79, turn east immediately or you will be fired upon!"
 
jtrain609 said:
I'm pretty much ok with O'Hare being neutered. "Stabilized approaches" aren't a recommendation, they're a mandatory go around. Maybe someone can get NorCal approach and SFO tower in line next.
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Kinda, except that one pilot's constant descent, constant bank, constant power reduction, minimum radius circle to land with wings coming level over the numbers is another pilot's, OMG! we're all going to die!
 
queeno said:
Sorry i got to weight in on this, KATL A80 is the biggest one trick pony in the ATC world and never took any great skills to work a 2 flow airport with with little to no SAT traffic. When i got to C90 our the C90 7110 had 14 different arrival depature confg we had to know. Then add the South SAT mess we had with KMDW that made C90 KORD a REAL controllers place to work .and we did it without a bunch of gy FMS SID/STARS. Here is all it takes to work depatures at A80 , "XXX radar contact" , "XXX contact atl center " wow !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! the problem is C90 KORD has been castrated just like the rest of the ATC world ................................. That is all carry on !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

P.S. if passion for my home ATC makes me a dik well so be it !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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A - perhaps - helpful guide for the uninitiated... such as I was before my recent google search... :confused:

Tracon IDs.jpg
 
Derg said:
Epic controller fight! I think. I really don't know what anyone is talking about.
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All I know is that yesterday after I filed Direct with remarks: "No RNAV SIDs or STARs," clearance delivery gave me the six (6) RNAV/GPS waypoints of an RNAV departure (yup, that took a few minutes to copy and enter) and assigned an initial of 3000. At take off, tower changed initial to 2000 and assigned a left turn to a heading away from the fixes previously assigned, and then handed me off to departure. Tracon immediately climbed me to final altitude and turned me direct my destination. I'm going with Tracon... 'cause apparently they are the only ones actually reading the filed plans.
 
Vector4Food said:
Here's all you need to know about controllers, this is universal, and always applies.

We all think we're the busiest, most complex sectors/tower controllers in the world... All of us, because guess what radar sectors are generally kept at a complexity or volume level so one controller can work it, most of the time, with some exceptions.

I've sat at approach sectors for Class 3 airport (out of max of 6 up here) and I've also sat at a class 6.

The class 6 traffic is so heavily structured that the class 3 (when it was busy for an hour or two per day) was infinitely more complex, and required a massively larger skill requirement.

We rate airports by volume of IFR traffic, not controller skill requirement.


My point is every controller is busy in their own way.
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Good air traffic control is like good sex... you just know it when you are experiencing it. When exceptional, it's transcendent.
 
Crop Duster said:
A - perhaps - helpful guide for the uninitiated... such as I was before my recent google search... :confused:

View attachment 33432
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I still remember SoCal Approach as Coast Approach.

ELP and ABQ Class C not served by a stand alone TRACON? Wondering because not on the list. Unless possibly they are Tower Approach control facilities and maybe those aren't included?
 
Crop Duster said:
Kinda, except that one pilot's constant descent, constant bank, constant power reduction, minimum radius circle to land with wings coming level over the numbers is another pilot's, OMG! we're all going to die!
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I've got no problems with tight circles that are briefed. DCA 01 circle 33 is a blast.

My problem is NorCal saying, "See that traffic ahead for the right side? No? See the airport? No? Alright, follow the traffic ahead and to the right you're cleared for the ILS 28L call the tower."

Then when I'm at 200' on final SFO tower clears the guys on the 1's to go.

Terrible, terrible, terrible decision making going on in that part of the country.

Newark, which is a procedural superfund site, is a well oiled machine in comparison.
 
ASpilot2be said:
I recently had my first trip through Canuckistan airspace. Awesome controllers.

I noticed that center would have aircraft switch to a frequency that I wasnt listening to, and still heard them transmitting. Is that the frequency coupling?
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I like them, but for the most part they all sounds like they're controlling from inside a bathroom stall.
 
Crop Duster said:
A - perhaps - helpful guide for the uninitiated... such as I was before my recent google search... :confused:

View attachment 33432
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Working at one of those TRACONs I can't for the life of me figure how those figures are relevant. Its main airport only traffic count, which in some places like SoCal is doing them a disservice (but hey, metrics!). Not only that, if its an up down it isn't on the list. I guarantee CLT and PHL are busier than U90
 
Screaming_Emu said:
I like them, but for the most part they all sounds like they're controlling from inside a bathroom stall.
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I describe most Latin American controller transmissions sounds as this: Take a radio, put it and the controller in a tiled bathroom. Take a beer can and cut the top off. Fill beer can with rocks. Tape microphone to the bottom of the beer can. Key The mic and speak through the top of the beer can. Not the bottom. The bottom is where the microphone is located. You want as much space/echo/noise between you and the microphone.

I thought it was just Mexico until I went to Central/South America. I thought it might end in Panama but continued as far south as Uruguay. It got real bad in Argentina, to the point I couldn't hardly hear a human voice. When I told them, they flipped a switch or some thing and it sounded like he was sitting between the two of us in the cockpit. Why they weren't using that all the time, I have no clue.
 
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