As I'm ready to retire, I need to ask/vent

ATN_Pilot said:
Again, you have to understand it from the view of the pilot, who is using a box to control the airplane. "Delete the speed at STYLS" is a perfect description of what he's doing and what you want him to do. He's going into the FMS and deleting the speed restriction next to the STYLS fix. This will cause the airplane to speed up at 10k, just like you want.

Sorry, but you're getting bent out of shape for nothing on this one.
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Yo airplane fancy.
 
I did 11 years at ZAU and am year two (and counting) at C90. We just assign the speed we need (even assigning 250 knots when below 10k). I lost count how many times I get called center or pilots call without an ATIS code. Around Chicago we change ATIS codes a lot more than once an hour, so it's no big deal. I've noticed most pilots who fly in and out of Chicago know the score, and do a good job helping us move traffic.

I did chuckle hearing the bit about Atlanta assigning 10/28 and it being a pain. It reminds me of assigning 9L/27R at ORD and hearing pilots beg for another runway.

To A80, thanks for your service brother. Enjoy retirement.
 
I was a controller as well (KNMM, FJDG, KNZY, ORSH, ORBM).

Part of the problem, and differences that I've noticed is that, among controllers, there is a "stupid pilot" mentality. It starts on ground from the controller's earliest days as a new controller. It's quite easy to sit in a tower cab, issue an instruction and stand there, pointing, and say, "What is wrong with this retard? Why is he not moving? Why did he go that way? Pilots must be stupid." having no idea that the pilot is in the cockpit with 2 other voices in his head sorting out the clearance on the airport diagram, etc. I can't tell you how many times I heard the remark "stupid pilot" in my controlling career.

Pilots, on the other hand, tend to be too busy most of the time to sit around talking about "stupid controllers". However, when we do it's LEGENDARY!!! Most of the time we talk about work...work... work.... TA... per diem... hot/old/lazy/gay FA (take your pick).... Zombies.... Liberals/politics.... MONAYYYY!!!....schedule.....scope clause.... and LIVIN THE DREAM!

The irony of the name CONTROLLER isn't lost on me. ;) Sounds like you need a few days off. Enjoy it. Find a hobby.
 
GX said:
I was a controller as well (KNMM, FJDG, KNZY, ORSH, ORBM).

Part of the problem, and differences that I've noticed is that, among controllers, there is a "stupid pilot" mentality. It starts on ground from the controller's earliest days as a new controller. It's quite easy to sit in a tower cab, issue an instruction and stand there, pointing, and say, "What is wrong with this retard? Why is he not moving? Why did he go that way? Pilots must be stupid." having no idea that the pilot is in the cockpit with 2 other voices in his head sorting out the clearance on the airport diagram, etc. I can't tell you how many times I heard the remark "stupid pilot" in my controlling career.

Pilots, on the other hand, tend to be too busy most of the time to sit around talking about "stupid controllers". However, when we do it's LEGENDARY!!! Most of the time we talk about work...work... work.... TA... per diem... hot/old/lazy/gay FA (take your pick).... Zombies.... Liberals/politics.... MONAYYYY!!!....schedule.....scope clause.... and LIVIN THE DREAM!

The irony of the name CONTROLLER isn't lost on me. ;) Sounds like you need a few days off. Enjoy it. Find a hobby.
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We are probably inverse of one another with the additional factors being you likely never worked ATC outside of the military just like I've never flown a turbojet, but I flew for years before I was a controller. You're forgetting or never experienced how most controllers will rip someone a new one for a bad sequence very publicly. We spend more time talking about how stupid the last poor sequence we saw was than the last "stupid pilot". For the record I saw both a terrible sequence today and an instance where the pilot flying didn't hear the pilot not flying in a regional jet check in, so he checked in again fresh causing me to scramble to figure out where this invisible plane was, turned 15 miles early and was descending to an entirely wrong altitude. I'm not sure how the PF misses the other guy checking on and trusts them so little that they ignore their insistence that they did, but it happened. Actually I'm not sure how they screwed up anything, but just like the controller, it happened, no big deal.

Even in that gem of CRM I'm still more aghast at the sequence. Insinuating its easy to stand and watch someone from the tower and insult a pilot from the cab rather than diffuse or deescalate the situation in the face of a near incursion makes me wonder about your relevant experience to the topic. I can fill post after post equally with both stupid pilot tricks and stupid controller tricks. I'm wagering that your cohorts in the tower were enlisted and in their late teens to mid 20's with around 5-8 years in at most. Telling someone 30 years older than you were with an entirely different experience might garner different results.
 
jtrain609 said:
When we get a turn while getting slowed on the final turn, it means we're reconfiguring, which requires us to verbalized everything we're doing.

Sorry if we miss your call, but if you tell us to turn and slow and then 15 seconds later clear is for the approach, we'll miss it because we're "coordinating," in ATC speak.
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"Flaps two." "Flaps two."

....

?
 
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