tcco94
Future GTA VI Pilot
I like AF a lot more but here's my thing..I'm paying for a room and will have airline tickets to come home. I realize flying stuff happens and etc so I am planning for that but when I called this weekend they said they were doing DPE's because he said include that into your costs....here's his email explanation which was a little confusing about Dallas...I went to both. It depends.
- In my experience ATP used DPE's, which have slightly higher pass rates, but more importantly, motivated scheduling. You're talking to a guy that waited months on the ATL FSDO for an inspector for my initial ride, then at least a month again for my retest (ending in a discontinuance), and then another long stretch for my final test. American Flyers used inspectors. They're free, which is nice because most students fail the first time regardless of who they're sitting in front of. DPEs are retesting next day in many cases.
- In my past experience ATP DPEs were charging 500 or 600 for initial test and at least half that for a retest.
Here's the deal though. Neither academy can cover everything that will be on the exam in a couple of weeks in such a manner that you can digest it.
- In my experience, American Flyers had more knowledgable instructors (myself included?
I don't work there anymore.)
- AF provided oral and group discussion-based ground, while ATP instructors made extensive use of powerpoints.
- Students will have quite a bit more control over instructors at American Flyers, arguably leading to better instruction. At ATP you have no control, but they do provide their CFIs with a first-time pass bonus. YMMV
- At AF students were assigned the CFI-A single engine ride first, while at ATP they do the MEI first, and later the instrument add-on in the PA44, then single engine add-on in 172 or archer. ATP will argue that the multi ride is easier, because the maneuvers are simpler, and for their fast track students they're probably right; they just finished up 50 hours of XC behind a seminole yoke. But for everyone else it could get expensive fast if your stick and rudder skills in a multi are not great to start with and then you end up retaking the exam once or twice, either because you busted in the flight portion and you need to retest, or (more likely) because you busted in the oral and now you need additional training because you're getting rusty sitting around for a DPE, or finally because maybe your luck sucks and the weather just wasn't working out and now you're rusty. We're talking 200 an hour for the AF 172RG or ~500 an hour for the PA44.
- ATP did not give students the option to save a few hours flight time in case a ride was delayed. We flew all of it out before they scheduled (could be tomorrow, probably a couple weeks, but it could be a month or month and a half for a DPE. Better hope you're still sharp!)
- ATP has financing available, so if you don't have the cash then ATP it is!
This ride is tough, and passes/fails are going to depend almost entirely on your preparation. For example, you need to be able to summarize pretty much everything in the aviation instructor's handbook. Laws/Principles of learning? REEPIR - readiness, effect, exercise, primacy, intensity, recency. What is the law of primacy Mr. Applicant? Primacy is the state of being; it's important that as an instructor we teach property the first time blah blah blah.... The FAA handbooks are gold; if you know them you're most of the way there, and if you don't, then you're screwed. PHAK, Aviation Instructor's Handbook, AFH, Part 61 and 91, NTSB 830, AIM are all critical. The CFI oral exam guide is great to test your knowledge, but it is not exhaustive.
90% of the time, if you are up to PTS standard then you'll pass, DPE or IA, and 90% of the time if you're not, DPE or IA, they're going to bust you.
It's pretty nuanced, I'd say it will boil down to the competency and dedication of your individual instructors. But. Yeah. American Flyers wins. :stir:
2. Check Ride Fee’s. Currently in Santa Monica, DPE’s do both check rides with the Initial being $900 and the add-on being $700. In Pompano Beach, Florida, DPE’s do both with the Initial being $800 and the add-on being $700. In Dallas, currently the FSDO is passing most of the check rides to DPE’s and the Initial is $600 and the Add-on is $500. In Morristown and Chicago, the FSDO does the Initial CFI for no charge and the add-on is $500.
Do you know much about the wait for DPE's? He told me plan for it to be a 45 day course...30 days with AF and then two weeks for two checkrides....think I'm safe with that?
