91.185

limitlessness

limitlessness

Well-Known Member
Your in a 172 IMC during the day. You are 20 miles from your uncontrolled destination airport at which you have planned to shoot the VOR approach. Your cruising at 4000 in a mountainous area. The valley your in has walls up to 10000 ft. Center comes on the comm and says:

"Cessna456 fly heading xxx vectors for traffic"

Two minutes go by and you try to raise center. No response.

How long do you fly the vector after you realize comms isn't coming back today.
 
Hmm, well, if I understand correctly. You've been vectored and you know there's big honkin mountains out there and then go NORDO. The altitudes you give seem a little unrealistic in regards to minimum IFR altitudes, but whatevs.

Fly to your IAF and comply with minimum IFR altitudes. This should keep you from "bending metal." Land, if possible, then call FSS and tell them about lost comms/NORDO. Viola, you're still alive.

*cold beer* *stories* *chicks-dig-beta* etc,etc...
 
@limitlessness is this an experience you had recently or just a 'hypothetical' that you set up? If this is actual, can you share more info about the situation? I am with @flyingbum about the altitudes not being realistic. If you really did go NORDO did you squawk 7600? I believe this alerts ATC and they should move other traffic out of your way.
 
It's a hypothetical, I was pondering the situation and couldn't find a solid way of deciding how long to fly the vector to avoid traffic. I was hoping someone might bring up something I hadn't thought of.
 
I was placed in a similar situation by a captain (what would happen if scenario). According to him, the correct thing to do is squawk 7600, proceed to the IAF enter a hold and descend to the published altitude to shoot the approach and voila, you are good!
 
jim511 said:
I was placed in a similar situation by a captain (what would happen if scenario). According to him, the correct thing to do is squawk 7600, proceed to the IAF enter a hold and descend to the published altitude to shoot the approach and voila, you are good!
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Yep.

Air traffic control in a communications failure is based on the anticipated pilot action; if your radio quits, they're going to vector everyone the hell out of your way.
 
I don't see this as ever being an issue. If you are flying IFR in an area where there is terrain up to 10,000 feet, you should be at least at MVA which is above the grid MORA.
 
Cptnchia said:
I don't see this as ever being an issue. If you are flying IFR in an area where there is terrain up to 10,000 feet, you should be at least at MVA which is above the grid MORA.
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I thought of that particular reality check. Also, where the terrain is like that, it's unlikely that there will be vectoring that low. Unless they added an installation near KSAF itself, based on the last time I was there, the approach into Santa Fe is below MVA and the airport is one-in-one out.

But OTOH, the hypothetical didn't say how far the terrain was, just that it was a consideration. The vectoring altitude for the approach into Denver Centennial (KAPA) is 8,000, with 12,000 terrain just 31 NM away.

So, to answer how long to fly the vector before I considered that I was dealing with lost comm, in addition to however long I might wait on the theory that ATC was just busy, I'd add a limiting factor of, so long I was satisfied terrain wasn't an issue. That will depend on where I was an what equipment I had to assist me in my situational awareness.
 
Squawk 7600, direct IAF, nav mode, look down at 12" moving map, don't fly through anything red on said map, fly another day.

<----- Only somewhat joking
 
MidlifeFlyer said:
What if the problem isn't your radio?
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Not in mountainous terrain, but I experienced Charlotte approach going off line for about 10 minutes on a hard imc day once. Fortunately most people just kept on the RNAV arrivals and departures but I think there were three or four RAs that occurred.
 
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