Envoy (Eagle) Passes TA

Ajax said:
I'll be honest, I'd love to make a livable wage at a major carrier. I'm doing everything I can to walk toward the light, but financially speaking I don't think I have what it takes to continue to lug myself toward a possibility of better wages, especially with the environment we are in.

I love aviation, airplanes, and flying...too much for my own good. I wish that I didn't enjoy it, my life would be so much easier. I'd be in some normal job, grad school, med school, law school, whatever...but it'd be normal. Instead I'm flying planes for pennies because I like airplanes.

Obviously I haven't made my mind up yet, but I might start looking outside the industry. At least I could always look at the planes and say "I used to do that" and never wonder what if...I wanted to be an airline pilot as a kid, and I am now. It just may not be my life's destination, this might just be the hint that sends me towards whatever I might be meant for.
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I fully understand. That light might be a carrier higher-up on the food chain or it might just be at your present employer, it's really more of an attitude and a direction you wish to proceed.

True story. During my last few months at Skyway, things were getting sketchy and negative as we approached an impasse in contract negotiations. I wanted out and made a comment in the pilot lounge about if I was around there for another year, I'm going to figuratively jump off the Mackinac Bridge and a lot of people rolled their eyes at me.

Which was fine.

But when people were complaining about the slowness of negotiations, how much worse our schedules were getting and such, instead of shaking my fist at "the man", I took that angst, freshened up my resume and re-hit my networking contacts because i knew that once I went to the dark side of bitching about work at work and bitching about work I was just another commuter pilot bitching about work.

The Envoy TA blows. I wouldn't wish that on my worst airline enemies. But it's ratified. The real question is how do YOU proceed?
 
PropDriver said:
This TA guarantees you guys a 40 airplane fleet, down from roughly 220 airplanes now? Am I reading it right?
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No, you are not reading that right at all.

Under current contract we were slated to shrink to 68 E-145s in 2 years. 68 older, unprofitable aircraft AA no longer wants.

Under the new contract it is 40 E-175s plus the 68 E-145s plus the options on additional E-175s.
 
Ajax said:
ALPA negotiated these contracts...
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Who do you think the "ALPA" that is negotiating these contracts is exactly?

It's YOUR people that YOU nominated/elected/supported. It's not some amorphous group of guys in suites at a table in Herndon. Sure, National has a bargaining policy, and yes, they do supply a contract administrator. But at the end of the day it was Envoy pilots sitting across the table from the company and it was Envoy pilots who agreed the deal was good and it was Envoy pilots who voted yes and passed the thing. Just like at every other place.

Man the hell up, take responsibility for your pilot group's actions and get ready for the next challenge you are going to face.
 
Pachong said:
Jumpseat War!!!!!!!
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My A model jumpseat policy:
(1) Are you employed as a pilot (or, possibly, as a dispatcher) by an air carrier that we have an agreement with?
(2) Do you solicit the Captain's permission?
(3) Do you smell bad?

If you answered (1, 2) as "yes" and (3) as "no", you are welcome up front.

Jumpseat wars fall under petulant poo-flinging. Yes, screw the guy commuting, so that you can feel better about yourself(?!).
 
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Autothrust Blue said:
My jumpseat policy:
(1) Are you employed as a pilot (or, possibly, as a dispatcher) by an air carrier that we have an agreement with?
(2) Do you solicit the Captain's permission?
(3) Do you smell bad?

If you answered (1, 2) as "yes" and (3) as "no", you are welcome up front.

Jumpseat wars fall under petulant poo-flinging. Yes, screw the guy commuting, so that you can feel better about yourself(?!).
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Since when do FOs dictate jumpseaters?


Jk man uaite
 
What if I got junior manned and ran out of clean shirts, and thus, smell as a result of my misfortune or juniority? Are there exceptions for this?
 
So to recap, Envoy pilots originally vote no and hold the line. In turn, PSA pilots stab Eagle in the back and secure Eagle flying. This was the flying Envoy stood to lose by voting no to TA#1. Now PSA gets the entire CR7 fleet from Envoy. Add to that TSA pilots salivating to get Eagle flying.

At some point, you gotta realize that when other pilots are directly stabbing you in the back, it is time for drastic action. That's what Envoy did. I don't blame them one bit. The landscape was already set thanks first to Endeavor, followed by PSA.

The only real winner here is management.

Envoy guys, I don't hold anything against you for voting yes. Your hands were tied and the vultures (other regional pilots) were salivating circling over your corpse-to-be.
 
Cherokee_Cruiser said:
So to recap, Envoy pilots originally vote no and hold the line. In turn, PSA pilots stab Eagle in the back and secure Eagle flying. This was the flying Envoy stood to lose by voting no to TA#1. Now PSA gets the entire CR7 fleet from Envoy. Add to that TSA pilots salivating to get Eagle flying.

At some point, you gotta realize that when other pilots are directly stabbing you in the back, it is time for drastic action. That's what Envoy did. I don't blame them one bit. The landscape was already set thanks first to Endeavor, followed by PSA.

The only real winner here is management.

Envoy guys, I don't hold anything against you for voting yes. Your hands were tied and the vultures (other regional pilots) were salivating circling over your corpse-to-be.
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All I got from this was "I have no idea what I'm talking about rabble rabble"
 
Cherokee_Cruiser said:
So to recap, Envoy pilots originally vote no and hold the line. In turn, PSA pilots stab Eagle in the back and secure Eagle flying. This was the flying Envoy stood to lose by voting no to TA#1. Now PSA gets the entire CR7 fleet from Envoy. Add to that TSA pilots salivating to get Eagle flying.
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Except that't not actually what happened at all. But thanks for playing.
 
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