Malaysian 777 Plane Crashes in Ukraine

[RDoug]

Here is ATC radar video at the time of the accident provided by the Russian department of defense.

They claim there is another aircraft, no secondary response circling over the accident spot and then descending below the coverage altitudes. Does it look like an aircraft or its just a reflection from the falling debris?

As a former radar controller, I see absolutely no evidence of a primary radar return in the vicinity of MAS17 until just before the tracker indicates that the secondary radar has lost the transponder. Shortly after that, I see lots of evidence of primary targets in the vicinity. If the Russians are using this as evidence, it isn't doing them any good from what I'm seeing.

 

[A Life Aloft]

Don't ever get curious. I've obviously never conducted any crash investigation on scene, but saw plenty of nastiness on tape in my crash investigation class.

The people that are able to conduct an investigation, unlike these looting thugs, my hat is off to them because I would probably quit my first day.

I don't know how first responders in any field of endeavor manage to do what they do. I'd see/come across the first child and I'd have to be hauled off.

 

[derg]

As a former radar controller, I see absolutely no evidence of a primary radar return in the vicinity of MAS17 until just before the tracker indicates that the secondary radar has lost the transponder. Shortlya fter that, I see lots of evidence of primary targets in the vicinity. If the Russians are using this as evidence, it isn't doing them any good from what I'm seeing.

It's a reach on behalf of the Russian conspiracy nuts.

Remember. A lot of us thought the news anchors that left RT during the invasion were grandstanding. Their coverage is criminally ridiculous.

 

[texas_pilot]

I haven't read all 31 pages, but has it been discussed that between the explosion and high altitude that everyone would have already been dead or unconcious?

 

[mshunter]

So civilians are walking through all this debris, and airline officials wouldn't be allowed into the crash site is what your saying @Derg?

 

[mikecweb]

So civilians are walking through all this debris, and airline officials wouldn't be allowed into the crash site is what your saying @Derg?

Pretty sure they didn't fly in.

And when international investigators arrived the separatist thugs started shooting their guns into the air.

 

[MikeD]

Don't ever get curious. I've obviously never conducted any crash investigation on scene, but saw plenty of nastiness on tape in my crash investigation class.

The people that are able to conduct an investigation, unlike these looting thugs, my hat is off to them because I would probably quit my first day.

When you start to get even remotely used to it, is when you know you've been changed forever. And not in a positive way.

 

[derg]

So civilians are walking through all this debris, and airline officials wouldn't be allowed into the crash site is what your saying @Derg?

The "civilians" are a mixture of random eastern Ukrainians, separatists and Russians.

Yes, they're traipsing the scene because they're already there.

I'm unclear of your point. Please clarify.

 

[derg]

When you start to get even remotely used to it, is when you know you've been changed forever. And not in a positive way.

So I can poop on your front lawn and you'll say: Human fecal material present. Unremarkable consistency. Temperature indicative of overnight placement. High fiber diet suspected.

 

[mshunter]

The "civilians" are a mixture of random eastern Ukrainians, separatists and Russians.

Yes, they're traipsing the scene because they're already there.

I'm unclear of your point. Please clarify.

My point is why do you think they would have an issue accessing the site? There are literally thousands of pictures all over the internet now. So how would it have been an issue to get in there and at least look for the FDR/CVR and take pictures themselves?

 

[mikecweb]

 

[derg]

My point is why do you think they would have an issue accessing the site?

Absolutely.

If a US-registered plane crashed in Mordor during the battle, does one simply walk onto the site?

No, one does not simply walk into Mordor.

What is this, slo-pitch?

 

[DPApilot]

So civilians are walking through all this debris, and airline officials wouldn't be allowed into the crash site is what your saying @Derg?

 

[derg]

My point is why do you think they would have an issue accessing the site? There are literally thousands of pictures all over the internet now. So how would it have been an issue to get in there and at least look for the FDR/CVR and take pictures themselves?

Bro, you've got to realize that you're talking about eastern Ukraine. They're not sitting around tweeting and sauntering about the Internet.

There are pockets of warfare and, for the most part, there are the equivalent of Ukrainian country bumpkins in militias, armed by the Russians, fighting the government in protest of the Ukrainian people overturning oligarchical rule by the financial power structure of the Russian elite.

You couldn't put Kenyan tourists in Arkansas without some people thinking it was some presidential conspiracy whereas a war torn region is going to be suspicious as hell over foreigners landing to look at, what they're probably being told, is a international conspiracy.

They're probably only getting RT. Check out RT's coverage, tell me where you're going to land and how you're going to get to the crash site. They shot down your last airplane, are you going to rush into there and send another?

You're the Malay premier. What do you do?

 

[derg]

A US registered civilian aircraft crashes in Poland in 1939, I'm sure we would have assumed unfettered access...

 

[derg]

About your deleted post, No suicide by mod, bro. State your case.

 

[mshunter]

Bro, you've got to realize that you're talking about eastern Ukraine. They're not sitting around tweeting and sauntering about the Internet.

There are pockets of warfare and, for the most part, there are the equivalent of Ukrainian country bumpkins in militias, armed by the Russians, fighting the government in protest of the Ukrainian people overturning oligarchical rule by the financial power structure of the Russian elite.

You couldn't put Kenyan tourists in Arkansas without some people thinking it was some presidential conspiracy whereas a war torn region is going to be suspicious as hell over foreigners landing to look at, what they're probably being told, is a international conspiracy.

They're probably only getting RT. Check out RT's coverage, tell me where you're going to land and how you're going to get to the crash site. They shot down your last airplane, are you going to rush into there and send another?

You're the Malay premier. What do you do?

You land where it's safe, make an effort, try and contact the separatists, and make an effort. What I've seen so far has been far from am effort. And I'm getting my information from multiple sources. The article I read today(one of many) was from Blomberg.

 

[DPApilot]

Why would anyone hate on @slushie??

 

[derg]

You land where it's safe, make an effort, try and contact the separatists, and make an effort. What I've seen so far has been far from am effort. And I'm getting my information from multiple sources. The article I read today(one of many) was from Blomberg.

Where do you land?

How do you get from where you landed to the crash site?

How do we know, from the comfort and safety of our high speed Internet access here in the states that it wasn't attempted?

Do the people you heard it from have "boots on the ground" in the region or are they just opining for ratings?

 

[mikecweb]

Why would anyone hate on @slushie??

That dude is legit. I once bought an ax sheath from him. True story.