Malaysian 777 Plane Crashes in Ukraine

Jafari RastaMan said:
What are the chances they will eventually outtfit passenger jets flying over Russia and the mid east with protection against missiles?

I saw a movie where somebody shot a missile at a plane, and the plane then shot off a bunch of flares in the back that diverted the missile. I think Nicholas Cage was in this movie.
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Israel(no, keep reading I swear it's related) has them installed on "select" commercial aircraft. I don't know if it was ever confirmed, but an Arkia 757-300 was fired upon in 2002 by surface to air missiles and many think the plane may have dispensed chaff or diverted the missiles some other way. Here's an article about it:
http://www.rense.com/general32/stp.htm

FedEx also has them installed on planes in it's fleet, a system called the "Guardian Pod".
guardian-b.jpg

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northrop_Grumman_Guardian

Oh, oh, and I don't have cable either! I mean, I have wifi and an HDMI cable, what's the point?
 
ChasenSFO said:
Israel(no, keep reading I swear it's related) has them installed on "select" commercial aircraft. I don't know if it was ever confirmed, but an Arkia 757-300 was fired upon in 2002 by surface to air missiles and many think the plane may have dispensed chaff or diverted the missiles some other way. Here's an article about it:
http://www.rense.com/general32/stp.htm

FedEx also has them installed on planes in it's fleet, a system called the "Guardian Pod".
guardian-b.jpg

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northrop_Grumman_Guardian

Oh, oh, and I don't have cable either! I mean, I have wifi and an HDMI cable, what's the point?
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Yes, but that's still DIRCM stuff. Not going to work with Radar guided telephone poles......


C17 has a LAIRCM system as well as some other High Value aircraft.
 
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mrivc211 said:
Don't quote me on this but I read somewhere in 2002ish when we went into Afghanistan that there were no stingers left. Not that it even matters because they can't reach those FL's.
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You're probably right. I don't know if there are any left, and even if there were, after 30 years, they probably don't work anyway. And like you said, even if they did work, they wouldn't be able to shoot down a plane at cruise altitude.
 
jskibo said:
Yes, but that's still DIRCM stuff. Not going to work with Radar guided telephone poles......
C17 has a LAIRCM system as well as some other High Value aircraft.
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ChasenSFO said:
I'm going to be honest and say I have no idea what any of that means.
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DIRCM - Directed Infrared Counter Measure. Works on heat seeking missiles only. Detects the inbound missile and then blasts it with a beam of infrared light (laser) that scrambles the tracking sensor on the inbound.

LAIRCM - Large Aircraft IR Counter Measure. Same deal, but also has flare launcher capability.

Neither system works against a radar guided missile. In order to defeat one of those you need to confuse the radar (chaff or jamming) or force the station off the air (launch a missile back down the search or tracking beam and force them to shut down to avoid getting hit).

EDIT: And my mother said reading Tom Clancy books would never be useful for anything...
 
http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...995067518?nk=eb83c38d4826880c13369d99b2d6609b

Maarten De Jonge, a 29-year-old cyclist from Oldenzaal in Holland rides with Malaysia’s Terengganu Cycling Team.

He was scheduled to take missing flight MH370 from Kuala Lumpur in March to compete in Taiwan for a race, but switched to another flight to avoid having a stopover.

In another strange twist of fate, he was also booked to fly on flight MH17 that was believed to have been shot from the sky by Russian rebels killing all 298 on-board, but changed his ticket for a later flight on the weekend to save some money.
 
mikecweb said:
http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...995067518?nk=eb83c38d4826880c13369d99b2d6609b

Maarten De Jonge, a 29-year-old cyclist from Oldenzaal in Holland rides with Malaysia’s Terengganu Cycling Team.

He was scheduled to take missing flight MH370 from Kuala Lumpur in March to compete in Taiwan for a race, but switched to another flight to avoid having a stopover.

In another strange twist of fate, he was also booked to fly on flight MH17 that was believed to have been shot from the sky by Russian rebels killing all 298 on-board, but changed his ticket for a later flight on the weekend to save some money.
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Seeing as one of those flights was KUL-PEK, and one AMS-KUL, I find it very shocking that this is the 4th account I've read about where a pax either missed MH370 and was on this flight or missed both. Very, very strange. Honestly even as someone who thinks MAS may very well not be at fault for either accident, I wouldn't ever fly on them again if I could avoid it after missing MH370...
 
I saw one of our C17s get hit a few weeks ago in Afghanistan by 12.7mm AA on take-off. Two rounds struck home.
 
BobDDuck said:
Neither system works against a radar guided missile. In order to defeat one of those you need to confuse the radar (chaff or jamming) or force the station off the air (launch a missile back down the search or tracking beam and force them to shut down to avoid getting hit).
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There are definitely some capable self-protect pods out there (i.e. Israel's EL-8222) utilizing some pretty advanced electronic warfare techniques including further developing DRFM (Digital Radio Frequency Memory). For those that don't know, DRFM put simply, takes a signal from an enemy radar, digitally processes it and duplicates the signal and then manipulates the parameters and sends it back to the enemy radar deceiving or confusing it. It's a big cat and mouse game though, as soon as a new EA pod comes out, someone develops a countermeasure, counter-countermeasure, etc.
 
ryan1234 said:
There are definitely some capable self-protect pods out there (i.e. Israel's EL-8222) utilizing some pretty advanced electronic warfare techniques including further developing DRFM (Digital Radio Frequency Memory). For those that don't know, DRFM put simply, takes a signal from an enemy radar, digitally processes it and duplicates the signal and then manipulates the parameters and sends it back to the enemy radar deceiving or confusing it. It's a big cat and mouse game though, as soon as a new EA pod comes out, someone develops a countermeasure, counter-countermeasure, etc.
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EWO school for you. Give you some months in the box listening to beeps and squeaks and being able to name the threat system.
 
Putin is hiding like a mobster. Funny the love affair the far right had with him a few months ago, they seem......quiet......now.
 
Itchy said:
Putin is hiding like a mobster. Funny the love affair the far right had with him a few months ago, they seem......quiet......now.
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This ↑.

"I looked in his eyes and saw his soul."
—— George W. Bush on what a great guy Vladimir Putin is.

And there are still people out there trying to rationalize this guy's foreign policy, including the invasion of Iraq. Amazing. Even worse, these people vote.
 
BobDDuck said:
DIRCM - Directed Infrared Counter Measure. Works on heat seeking missiles only. Detects the inbound missile and then blasts it with a beam of infrared light (laser) that scrambles the tracking sensor on the inbound.

LAIRCM - Large Aircraft IR Counter Measure. Same deal, but also has flare launcher capability.

Neither system works against a radar guided missile. In order to defeat one of those you need to confuse the radar (chaff or jamming) or force the station off the air (launch a missile back down the search or tracking beam and force them to shut down to avoid getting hit).

EDIT: And my mother said reading Tom Clancy books would never be useful for anything...
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Maybe we can convince Embraer to retrofit the Brasilia and we can get into this business...
 
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