'Any Non-Rev Pilots on board?'

Autothrust Blue said:
I mean, I can taxi my airplane (6 degrees of nosewheel steering, and I can paddle it off and use brakes and differential power as God intended), but it's not always smooth, and re-engagement of nosewheel steering can require reaching over and mashing the tiller depending on where the wheel is.

If the Captain gets incapacitated we're going to clear the runway, stop straight ahead, get the medics on board and then figure out what else to do once he or she is under competent medical care. I'm plenty comfortable taxiing the Brasilia, from the left if need be, if they tell me to—it's just not within the normal scope of my duties.
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I'll give you a pass on this one only because the bro is large enough that you can't really see if you're clear of obstacles on the other side from the opposite seat.

I used to let my FO'S taxi some from the right seat while I monitored just so they could maintain a feel for it. Who knows? One day I might have had developed a severe case of the runs where any sudden movements may have brought me close to pooing my pants. It happened to my IOE captain which resulted on me taking the controls on a five mile final. Lucky for me that I was in the left seat. :)
 
KLB said:
I'll give you a pass on this one only because the bro is large enough that you can't really see if you're clear of obstacles on the other side from the opposite seat.

I used to let my FO'S taxi some from the right seat while I monitored just so they could maintain a feel for it. Who knows? One day I might have had developed a severe case of the runs where any sudden movements may have brought me close to pooing my pants. It happened to my IOE captain which resulted on me taking the controls on a five mile final. Lucky for me that I was in the left seat. :)
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Oh yeah, I've done it too, to get a feel for things. It's responsible to let folks do it, I think, under competent Check Airmanly supervision.
 
Interestingly written...

I was once on a Northwest flight from DTW-SFO and woke up to all the cabin lights turning on and the F/A announcing "If there are any pilots on board ring your call button", followed by maybe 8 or 9 seconds of silence and everyone looking around at each other a little stunned before the F/A came back on and said, "I'm sorry a DOCTOR, I meant to say we need a doctor. Any doctors or first responders on board please ring your call button". There were a few laughs around me but luckily several call buttons went off. Turned out to be a girl collapsed in the lav and hit her head pretty hard. The lav was almost abeam my seat so I got to watch and listen to the whole ordeal. The F/As and the several pax assisting handled the whole thing very well. Paramedics met the plane but we went on to SFO(2 hours away at that point) and didn't divert, so must have been not too serious. Still...odd Freudian slip by the F/A.
 
"He looked to his wife; as she gave him a nod" (Que the theatrical Hollywood TopGun music).

Listen, first off....the f/o really didn't need the help of the AF B1 pilot and truth be told...he was probably more of a distraction than an asset on such a busy short flight. CRM aside, she could've handled the situation all by herself as she is trained to do and experience has taught her to do. What she and the rest of the crew were really hoping for was a non-rev'ing crewmember from her company or a pilot current and qualified on the B737. What she got was someone to throw the gear down when told to and talk on the radio when told what to say.

99.9% of the f/o's I've flown with at my company could have handled the same situation just fine. I'm sure the same applies in this particular story or any other airline for that matter. The media wants to make it much more sensationalized and drama filled than it actually was (no surprise there) about the AF pilot coming to the rescue of this poor civilian girl all alone up there and possibly panic stricken. Those words weren't written but sort of came across as implied when I read the article. The hardest part for the f/o would've been taxiing the aircraft after landing. But she could've had stairs and a tug meet the aircraft on the runway, had the health stricken Capt removed and then be towed to the gate.

Second, Des Monies to Omaha is such a short distance/flight the AF Capt probably didn't have enough time to figure out how to adjust his seat and get his seatbelt on before they were on the ground.

And third, when did Des Monies become an "International" airport or does that just add to the story's drama?

The only story that should have been told is one written by or about the f/o who was forced to spool up from 0-100 in a nano second.
 
A300Capt said:
"He looked to his wife; as she gave him a nod" (Que the theatrical Hollywood TopGun music).

Listen, first off....the f/o really didn't need the help of the AF B1 pilot and truth be told...he was probably more of a distraction than an asset on such a busy short flight. CRM aside, she could've handled the situation all by herself as she is trained to do and experience has taught her to do. What she and the rest of the crew were really hoping for was a non-rev'ing crewmember from her company or a pilot current and qualified on the B737. What she got was someone to throw the gear down when told to and talk on the radio when told what to say.

99.9% of the f/o's I've flown with at my company could have handled the same situation just fine. I'm sure the same applies in this particular story or any other airline for that matter. The media wants to make it much more sensationalized and drama filled than it actually was (no surprise there) about the AF pilot coming to the rescue of this poor civilian girl all alone up there and possibly panic stricken. Those words weren't written but sort of came across as implied when I read the article. The hardest part for the f/o would've been taxiing the aircraft after landing. But she could've had stairs and a tug meet the aircraft on the runway, had the health stricken Capt removed and then be towed to the gate.

Second, Des Monies to Omaha is such a short distance/flight the AF Capt probably didn't have enough time to figure out how to adjust his seat and get his seatbelt on before they were on the ground.

And third, when did Des Monies become an "International" airport or does that just add to the story's drama?

The only story that should have been told is one written by or about the f/o who was forced to spool up from 0-100 in a nano second.
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And the chain of command is the chain that she beat him with, we hope, until he understood who was in command. (with some :sarcasm: )
 
While I agree that it is a needlessly sensationalized story, it admittedly is an AF news article. I have yet to read a service news source that can even loosely called fair and unbiased.....much less non-sensational.
 
On the 737s I fly, only the Captain has a tiller. I could get the aircraft off the runway at a rapid exit, but that's it. We are actually trained to just stop on the runway and request a tug, but if there's a rapid I could take I would. Our SIPs also say we can only let other company crew into the flight deck to assist with an incapacitation.
 
Let's take this a step further, I would put any pilot up with me. What if what struck the captain hits you, now we are all dead. I was a 121 guy and did 135 for years. I was on a full flight , some dude has something go wrong , pax. They had to move the people in his isle. I told the FA, showed her my badge and said I can sit any where. I ended up in the JS, I was flying for a fractional at the time. to tell the truth, flying 135 is way way more difficult and dangerous then any 121. And many of the 121 guys, mostly retired, could never really cross over to 135. My opinion.
 
If there was a commercial pilot in the back and you left them "standby" in the cabin, and then you do something like maybe run off the end of the runway or some other incident that might be explained by you being distracted or overworked how are you going to explain that? Even a private pilot can talk on the radios, and then thats one thing you don't have to do.
 
SFLAX said:
Let's take this a step further, I would put any pilot up with me. What if what struck the captain hits you, now we are all dead. I was a 121 guy and did 135 for years. I was on a full flight , some dude has something go wrong , pax. They had to move the people in his isle. I told the FA, showed her my badge and said I can sit any where. I ended up in the JS, I was flying for a fractional at the time. to tell the truth, flying 135 is way way more difficult and dangerous then any 121. And many of the 121 guys, mostly retired, could never really cross over to 135. My opinion.
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This should be interesting....
 
SFLAX said:
To tell the truth, flying 135 is way way more difficult and dangerous then any 121. And many of the 121 guys, mostly retired, could never really cross over to 135. My opinion.
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Oh please. I've flown 135 (pax) and 91 (corporate). I've heard the same circle jerk BS about how 121 guys can't hack the job a few times, usually from people that crap themselves if there's a broken layer at 500 ft at the destination.

Customer service, using FltPlan.com, and doing the coffee/ice/paper thing isn't up there with space shuttle commander. I've been flying 121 for over three years now, and most of the people I fly with would be JUST fine if they made a transition. The only thing most of them probably wouldn't put up with is the illegal pilot pushing and MX shenanigans that occur all too often in 135 and lower rung corporate.
 
And I flew over 7 years with guys that ranged from age 23 to 73. And the retired 121 guys over average were the bigger pain to deal with. And I get it. Many of there comments or expectations of a 135 were based on 121 legacy type careers. Which was never going to happen. I worked in the office for 2 years and the majority of fired I had to put out were from guys above the age of 65. Just my experience.
 
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"Surprisingly, taxiing was the most stressful part of the day for the first officer," said Gongol. "She had never taxied a 737 before and the ATC had no idea that the pilot was the reason for the emergency. We had to make a quick decision that her switching to the pilot's seat and taxiing the aircraft without the training was necessary to save the captain's life."
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When I grow up, I want to be The Pilot.
 
SFLAX said:
And I flew over 7 years with guys that ranged from age 23 to 73. And the retired 121 guys over average were the bigger pain to deal with. And I get it. Many of there comments or expectations of a 135 were based on 121 legacy type careers. Which was never going to happen. I worked in the office for 2 years and the majority of fired I had to put out were from guys above the age of 65. Just my experience.
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I would imagine it had a lot more to do with a 65+ year old that is set in their ways than anything else.

Take a 63 year old guy that has been flying a Hawker around for 20+ years and put them in a 121 environment, you're likely going to see some issues. That doesn't mean all Hawker pilots are bound to have issues at an air carrier.
 
Never said all. The greatest pilot I ever flew with, ex eastern and AirTran , 71 years old. Always bought the first round and had the best jokes .
 
Pilot skills, yes he had them. Also, he did not complain, he did his job and he went home to his wife of 40 years. No drama, no how he bought his third home, when he bought his second plane to fly to his second house, and that he has to share his first vacation home with his ex and she is a pain in the . But I would say, the first thing that does go with older guys is tack and patients .
 
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When I non-rev they always give me over-wing seats, am sure they must know i'm a pilot somehow.
 
Nark said:
@fholbert you do know that most 121 FO's don't taxi the aircraft right? I've taxied the 170 only once (obviously from the right seat), and it wasn't pretty. 100,000 lbs airplane doesn't taxi like a 2,000lbs Viking.
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I did not know that, thanks. I did try to taxi a C-5 stimulator once, the wheel was only on the left. Anyways, it was a lost cause.

3,250lbs baby!
 
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