Forbes Article on Regional Pilot Pay vs McDonalds Pay

mojo6911 said:
Pretty easy to rant about how useless a college degree is when you haven't stepped foot on a campus, right? Are your plans to stay in 121? If so, you better start working on that useless degree. Good luck paying for it without going into debt, given what regional salaries are.

I never took out a loan for my degree or flight training. I have never been unemployed for over a month since I was 14 years old. You seem to imply that everyone who has a college degree is some weed smoking slacker who lived on microwave burritos and played hacky sack down at the quad daily.
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Note to self: Get working on that college degree. Hate to see those 24 years of flying for a major airline go to waste.
 
Derg said:
I couldn't get the job I have without a degree.

Personally, I needed one. I don't have a pedigree and largely, I figured the more I made my self the "obviously qualified" candidate, the harder it would be for people to overlook me.

Now if you're a Kennedy, sure. If you're some kid from a dusty old California hick town, you'd better be shiny.
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Redneck's a hard stench to wash off. Did I ever tell you that when I first met Emily she thought I was from Kentucky?
 
Oh gawd! The degree discussion again.

"Hey bud, you want to fly for us?"

"Yes sir, I do. I have all my certificates, 5000 hours of flying and 7 years of real world experince before I even set foot into aviation. Some of it management ecperince, sales, customer service, etc. I even ran a (insert whatever here) for a while."

"Cool, do you have a degree?"

"No sir, I don't see how a degree in plant science will help me with aviation."

"Awe, that's to bad, because the kid behind you, and I say kid because he is 10 years younger than you, does. Even though he only has 1500 hours, and just barely meets the minimums, we are going to hire him instead. He's less mature, hasn't seen as much in the professional world as you have because he has been in school the last 4.5 years. Sorry about your luck. Why don't you head out, and spend another $65k to get that piece of paper that says "Congrats, you spent a lot of money with us at the school of 'Put You in More Debt,' wasted 4 years of time on a degree you will never likely use, so now all of the sudden you are employable!"

Now how does that make any freakin sense!?!!!

The cost of a degree has steadily gone up because society tells us "You have to have a degree to succedd!" In my opnion, it's a quasi Ponzi Scheme. Yeah, I eventually plan on finishing up mine. But I only will do it because it's a necessary evil.
 
Derg said:
I couldn't get the job I have without a degree.

Personally, I needed one. I don't have a pedigree and largely, I figured the more I made my self the "obviously qualified" candidate, the harder it would be for people to overlook me.
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I would say that at least half of the benefit of attending a halfway decent university is the networking opportunity. You have an instant head start knowing a few dozen people with jobs in the same field down the road. That's not the reason to do it, but does not hurt.

I would not be where I am now, had I not attended the school that I did. That's not to say that an undergraduate education makes you and expert and instantly raking in big bucks, quite the contrary. It gives you the basic skills to go out and learn on your own. Without a rigorous academic foundation, life is really a lot harder.
 
mshunter said:
Oh gawd! The degree discussion again.

"Hey bud, you want to fly for us?"

"Yes sir, I do. I have all my certificates, 5000 hours of flying and 7 years of real world experince before I even set foot into aviation. Some of it management ecperince, sales, customer service, etc. I even ran a (insert whatever here) for a while."

"Cool, do you have a degree?"

"No sir, I don't see how a degree in plant science will help me with aviation."

"Awe, that's to bad, because the kid behind you, and I say kid because he is 10 years younger than you, does. Even though he only has 1500 hours, and just barely meets the minimums, we are going to hire him instead. He's less mature, hasn't seen as much in the professional world as you have because he has been in school the last 4.5 years. Sorry about your luck. Why don't you head out, and spend another $65k to get that piece of paper that says "Congrats, you spent a lot of money with us at the school of 'Put You in More Debt,' wasted 4 years of time on a degree you will never likely use, so now all of the sudden you are employable!"

Now how does that make any freakin sense!?!!!

The cost of a degree has steadily gone up because society tells us "You have to have a degree to succedd!" In my opnion, it's a quasi Ponzi Scheme. Yeah, I eventually plan on finishing up mine. But I only will do it because it's a necessary evil.
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Once you have said degree, the value of it will likely become a little more clear to you.
 
Actually we're talking about backwoods jtrain609! :)

If you don't want to get one, don't get one.

If you want to work for any of the airlines that require one, make sure you have one.

I think requiring a pilot to have a FCC Restricted Radiotelephone License is far, far crazier than airlines preferring academically educated employees, especially when most of the people serving cokes in the back of my aircraft have four year degrees.

True story, bro.
 
Derg said:
Actually we're talking about backwoods jtrain609! :)

If you don't want to get one, don't get one.

If you want to work for any of the airlines that require one, make sure you have one.

I think requiring a pilot to have a FCC Restricted Radiotelephone License is far, far crazier than airlines preferring academically educated employees, especially when most of the people serving cokes in the back of my aircraft have four year degrees.

True story, bro.
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Over the years, I've learned a few very fundamental truths, and one of them is that if you're not qualified to be the guy that's in charge of something (in this case hiring), you're probably qualified to call shenanigans on the policies that they lay out (in this case, hiring requirements), or the reasoning for those policies.

Or said another way, "Do what the bossman tells you to do, cash the check, and get yourself a tall boy of PBR."
 
Exactly.

Plus, it's a discriminator. My company wants to hire 300 pilots. They'll probably have 12,000-plus applications that fully match their minimum requirements. Why in the world would they want to expand that pool?
 
Derg said:
Exactly.

Plus, it's a discriminator. My company wants to hire 300 pilots. They'll probably have 12,000-plus applications that fully match their minimum requirements. Why in the world would they want to expand that pool?
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BECAUSE THIS IS BS!!! And ima Rage Against The Machine on the tubes and not even put myself in a position to apply to show THEM that I MEAN BUSINESS!!!

 
mshunter said:
Okay then. Explain to me how a degree in, Criminal Justice, makes me a more competent pilot? And keep it within the context of what my initial post was.
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It doesn't.

But airlines don't hire pilots, they hire employees.

An undergraduate degree makes a person a better employee, not a better pilot. They've shown that they can accomplish a (minimally) rigorous academic program and do it while interacting with a whole bunch of people from a whole bunch of backgrounds, do it on time, on budget, and without pissing off the wrong people so as to get kicked out of school.

It's a good predictor for how that person will behave as an employee, and although it's just one metric, it isn't dispositive.

Airlines don't hire the guy that can shoot the best single engine ILS approach, they hire the person that they think will make them the most money. Making the most money requires the best employees.

Also, you have to look at it from HR's perspective. Everybody in HR will have, at the least, an undergraduate degree, and quite possibly a better education than that. How do you convince HR that they should give you the keys to a $300 million aircraft if you can't be bothered to follow directions and get an undergraduate degree? That has nothing to do with being a good pilot, it has to do with being a good employee.
 
mshunter said:
Okay then. Explain to me how a degree in, Criminal Justice, makes me a more competent pilot? And keep it within the context of what my initial post was.
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Train forgot to drop the microphone and walk off stage with the above.

I'm one of the few at my airline that "just" has a bachelors degree. Masters, some doctorates, Ivy League-educated, service academy, etc. Hell, one of my favorite captains is a Harvard grad, former SEAL, ex-NE Patriots, I'm sure when he was hired, it was more than "I wonder can he fly the best ILS".
 
Everyone, calm down and realize these simple facts:
#1. I have been on a pony before.
#2. Having been on a pony before makes me more better than you. Bow down.
 
Derg said:
Train forgot to drop the microphone and walk off stage with the above.

I'm one of the few at my airline that "just" has a bachelors degree. Masters, some doctorates, Ivy League-educated, service academy, etc. Hell, one of my favorite captains is a Harvard grad, former SEAL, ex-NE Patriots, I'm sure when he was hired, it was more than "I wonder can he fly the best ILS".
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Side note...do you know if your airline looks at graduate degrees as a substantial positive in their current hiring?
 
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