Southern California airspace is a challenge, but its manageable with the users making decisions with regard to use of airports and times of operation.
Congressional Sequestration and Tower Closures...
- Thread starter chrisreedrules
- Start date
Southern California airspace is a challenge, but its manageable with the users making decisions with regard to use of airports and times of operation.
Dynasty22
Well-Known Member
LCQ tower required for maint. ops for United?
CFI A&P
Exploring the world one toilet at a time.
Isn't it just for CFI's to quiz people about during a flight review?
Me: "Tell me about Lake City LCQ."
Pilot: "Control tower is 119.2' length, elevation, hard surface...."
Me: "How far out do we call them?"
Pilot: "It's Class D, so more than four miles."
Me: "Are you sure?"
Pilot: Looks at sectional again, "Hey wait a...."
GolfChuck
Trustworthy Source
The number of tracks and traffic in ZNY oceanic depends on the wind. Some nights we are dead and some nights we have 200 aircraft at a time. The same goes for days, although usually if we are busy during the day it is dead at night, or vice versa. We are about to start our busy season. Generally, we staff the area with the assumption the ocean will be divided into 2 sectors for most of the day, however, as traffic increases, we have the ability to split our oceanic airspace into many more sectors. The busiest I have seen it was a 5 way split for oceanic. Additionally, our 2 offshore radar sectors can be staffed by as few as 1 controller and as many as 4 controllers. When we have a lot of tracks in ocean, chances are there will be 3-4 controllers working the radar as well. We have set staffing levels, and if traffic is predicted to be high that night, controllers are called in for overtime to account for more positions being open.
They have already jockeyed schedules around to take away overtime, so I would guess that they would try to avoid publishing tracks that would result in the need for overtime. I don't see us denying entry to the ocean based on traffic load, however it might be alleviated some due to ground delays (At least eastbound). Of course just because there are no tracks, doesn't mean aircraft don't fly through our airspace. In fact some nights there are no tracks when there should have been some, and that only increases the workload because everyone is on a different random route.
I wouldn't say taking ATC classes are bad you just need to have a plan B and C to go with it such as pilot or anything else for that matter. I believe the bad part about all of these cuts are the possibilities of some ATC towers being closed for good. Before moving from California the FAA were shutting down NDB navaids rapidly.
Pilotforhire587
Lycra Man
I could be wrong here so if someone has better information please speak up, but I believe most of the towers that were closed were Class D airports with contract towers, not actual FAA run towers.So.. Bad time to start taking classes for the ATC world huh?
Seems like a lot of hype. Did airplanes fall out of the sky when Regan fired all of the controllers who went on strike? I think we will all be just fine. Everyone has their panties in a wad. Imagine being the guys and gals from the towers that are getting closed. Those guys and gals are the ones who are going to feel it in mass.
Pilotforhire587
Lycra Man
Personally I think that that is what is concerning most people, there are a lot of good guys who are out of work now.
I disagree mostly. Just read this thread. Lot's of "OH NOEZ! I ACTUALLY HAVE TO LOOK FOR TRAFFICS NOWZ!"
Your comparing apples and oranges. Traffic then was drastically different than today. There were also restrictions put out to reduce workload such as military flying vfr only and so forth. Controllers in my area that were around then have talked about being certified quickly on a sector then working that one sector for an extended period, year or longer.
Have you seen NATCA's talking points for the effects of proposed staffing furloughs on the major airports. One that stood out was atl going from a 126 arrival rate on triple runways to around 80 with just two. If these cuts hit like the faa is talking every air carrier will be feeling delays.
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So because smaller airports are going to be closing, all of the sudden airplanes will be falling from the sky? Speaking with Guy's and gal's who flew during that time frame, it was a "free for all." And I don't think there were any accidents from it. So why no will there all of the sudden be airplanes falling from the sky? Keeps your eyes open, listen to traffic calls from other aircraft, and use your head.
Just curious. Have you ever seen SAP on a first Sunday of the month? It gets crazy busy there. Sometimes 10 deep waiting for departure. Keep you head up, and on a swivel. Not to much more I can say. I'm not going to quit flying into CMA, or any of the other little airports because the tower has closed.
I am not too familiar with vfr tower operations but I can see some places being complete goat ropes.
As for my center, we are already running minimum manning with gobs of overtime. When/if the furloughs hit not only do they want to cut out all overtime they want to reduce staffing by about 2.5 per day. That's all fine and dandy when its severe clear and smooth rides. Throw in some spring and summer weather...and then we will be in a situation where there are not enough bodies to staff the required positions much less have anyone on break.
Its easy to stand on the outside and say its all smoke and mirrors but from the inside when this goes down....every NAS user will feel the pain.
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As for my center, we are already running minimum manning with gobs of overtime. When/if the furloughs hit not only do they want to cut out all overtime they want to reduce staffing by about 2.5 per day. That's all fine and dandy when its severe clear and smooth rides. Throw in some spring and summer weather...and then we will be in a situation where there are not enough bodies to staff the required positions much less have anyone on break.
Its easy to stand on the outside and say its all smoke and mirrors but from the inside when this goes down....every NAS user will feel the pain.
Sent from my SGH-I747 using Tapatalk 2
A150K
Well-Known Member
Mine (KSAF) is on the list. Honestly, 80% of the time from a VFR perspective it'll be fine, but the other 20% of the time will be a complete Mongolian cluster-especially when there are multible small planes in the pattern and the winds favor one of the smaller runways and the jets need the big runway. IFR wise, we see quite a few biz jet and airline movements per day, so it'll definately make an already not so great system (ZAB provides app/dep services) even worse- especially if someone cancels at the gate 
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Deleted member 21509
Guest
On the Northern CA end, losing the towers at Napa (APC), Santa Rosa (STS), Salinas (SNS) and Stockton (SCK) would be pretty sketchy, but even considering Sacramento Executive (SAC), Buchanan (CCR), San Carlos (SQL) and Livermore (LVK) is completely asinine and unsafe. CCR has an extremely complex airport layout prone to runway incursions. SAC and LVK are very flight training intensive, and SQL - with its proximity to the arrival runways and final approach course at SFO - well all you airline pilots get ready for a lot of TCAS RAs.
My guess is we will see a lot of people break Bravo at SFO out of SQL. Lots of flight training going on there.
z987k
Well-Known Member
TIS is worthless.
z987k
Well-Known Member
I don't see what having a tower has to do with being able to maintain an altitude.
Stomp16
You mean Shennanigans?!?!
I'm not arguing for or against, but it's better than nothing. Before we upgraded the avionics, a few of our older birds had TIS.
z987k
Well-Known Member
We've got it on all of our t-props and the only time it works is for about the first 30 seconds near a congested area (SEA, SFO). After about 30 seconds it generally fails, and of course doesn't work at all out in the east side of the NW/CA.