PPL to Legacy in under 9 Years...

Jet said:
You're still young! In my opinion it's worth a shot. What is the worst that could happen, you never make it to a legacy or a major and get stuck on a RJ making 90-100k with 18 days off. That right there is "making it" compared to non flying jobs. :)
Click to expand...

For real though...if he can't make it to a legacy or a major in 36 years, well, it just wasn't meant to happen. :)
 
Jet said:
You're still young! In my opinion it's worth a shot. What is the worst that could happen, you never make it to a legacy or a major and get stuck on a RJ making 90-100k with 18 days off. That right there is "making it" compared to non flying jobs. :)
Click to expand...

Except this regional could go under at your 20 year mark so you're 45 and back to square 1. Your 18 days off a month still equals 150 nights away from home, or 1/3 of each year. That's a lot of time . I'll take 80k, a desk, great 401k matching and stock benefits. Don't get me wrong, I'd trade that 80k for a airplane any day but not in the current state of the industry; and awesome part-91 jobs are still somewhat hard to find.
 
PGT said:
Except this regional could go under at your 20 year mark so you're 45 and back to square 1. Your 18 days off a month still equals 150 nights away from home, or 1/3 of each year. That's a lot of time . I'll take 80k, a desk, great 401k matching and stock benefits. Don't get me wrong, I'd trade that 80k for a airplane any day but not in the current state of the industry; and awesome part-91 jobs are still somewhat hard to find.
Click to expand...

My fear with Part 91 jobs is they tend to be even less stable than a regional job unless you're lucky enough to get on with say a Wal-Mart or a Disney where a corporate flight department makes a lot of sense. My aunt and uncle are exec VPs with Proctor and Gamble and used to fly on the corporate jets all the time. They've been flying commercial for the last 5-9 years or so due to cut backs.
 
PGT said:
Except this regional could go under at your 20 year mark so you're 45 and back to square 1. Your 18 days off a month still equals 150 nights away from home, or 1/3 of each year. That's a lot of time . I'll take 80k, a desk, great 401k matching and stock benefits. Don't get me wrong, I'd trade that 80k for a airplane any day but not in the current state of the industry; and awesome part-91 jobs are still somewhat hard to find.
Click to expand...
80k and 365 nights at home is very feasible under 135. And I don't mean the 5 hours a night at home like freight.
 
PGT said:
Except this regional could go under at your 20 year mark so you're 45 and back to square 1. Your 18 days off a month still equals 150 nights away from home, or 1/3 of each year. That's a lot of time . I'll take 80k, a desk, great 401k matching and stock benefits. Don't get me wrong, I'd trade that 80k for a airplane any day but not in the current state of the industry; and awesome part-91 jobs are still somewhat hard to find.
Click to expand...

Haha, have you ever worked a desk job for 80k? It's not fun, 50-60 hours a week with your work phone and laptop always following you on weekends. No overtime pay and you have to see your boss everyday. Do you want to take a vacation? No problem but when you come back your TPS reports will be stacked up and you will work double for a week to catch up on the week you were gone. The stock benefits are great until the stock crashes to nothing. If you're the type of person that doesn't want to be gone 150 nights a year then flying is not for you. However, you could always bid day trips and be home every night. The day trips go senior in my base but they are junior in another base. I'm actually fairly junior and I bid a whole month of 2 day trips and was only away 7 nights out of the whole month. There are junior line holders getting 16-18 days off and home every night (assuming they live in base) in another base. Having to start over from scratch is hands down the worst part about this job and I can't argue with you there, I've had to do it once already after a furlough.
 
kellwolf said:
My fear with Part 91 jobs is they tend to be even less stable than a regional job unless you're lucky enough to get on with say a Wal-Mart or a Disney where a corporate flight department makes a lot of sense. My aunt and uncle are exec VPs with Proctor and Gamble and used to fly on the corporate jets all the time. They've been flying commercial for the last 5-9 years or so due to cut backs.
Click to expand...
Even Wal-Mart and Disney aren't a sure thing anymore.

Unless there is a drastic change with the public's(shareholder's) view of corporate aircraft or airline service gets reduced & unreliable, corporate aircraft jobs will always be at the front of the bandsaw when cuts need to be made.

The airlines are pretty much a crapshoot as a career but with even the largest corporate/charter operations you only have a few under you after decades of service. That is to assume they would make reductions by seniority which is very often not the case.

This may very well be a case of the grass is always greener but I've had my fill of part 91/135. I'm ready for a contract and a seniority list. Sad thing is on this side of the house, management isn't really that bad. It's other pilots trying to undercut you and "get their foot in the door" that put you and your family in the bullseye. The free market is rampant in corporate and charter, for good and mostly bad (IMO).
 
kellwolf said:
My fear with Part 91 jobs is they tend to be even less stable than a regional job unless you're lucky enough to get on with say a Wal-Mart or a Disney where a corporate flight department makes a lot of sense. My aunt and uncle are exec VPs with Proctor and Gamble and used to fly on the corporate jets all the time. They've been flying commercial for the last 5-9 years or so due to cut backs.
Click to expand...
It's really not the "Walmart's or Disney's" that are what they once were, its the smaller more tucked way companies that aren't public that end up being sweet. Being privately held is key, no shareholders or govt to answer to. There is thousands of these companies out there that people have never heard of. The company I'm at has been in business for almost a hundred years. They've had an airplane of some type for the last 40 or so. They went through one of the worst economies since the great depression, laid off around 150 employees but kept their 12 million dollar airplane. Right now it's just me and another guy that make up the "flight department". We get benefits, vacation, 401k etc. If we need a day off we get a contract guy, no questions asked. No pagers or on call, I've been here almost three years and never had less then 3-4 days notice of a pop up trip. Sure my schedule changes a little here and there but no different than getting extend on day four when your trying to make your commute.

To me all sectors of aviation are a crap shoot. You used to get a job at a major and you could call it a career. Those days are long gone, they died with the TWA's, Pan Am's and Western's. if you're over 40 and at a major now like Delta or United you might make it to retirement with out too many issues. But some one getting hired at any major that has 30-35 years worth of flying to do, will end their career in a totally different way then what they thought. Ask all the guys at American that have been furloughed several times since 9-11 how they feel about this awesome merger that just got approved. I guess that's the beauty of flying, there's always going to be a niche out there for every one.
 
PositionAndHold said:
It's really not the "Walmart's or Disney's" that are what they once were, its the smaller more tucked way companies that aren't public that end up being sweet. Being privately held is key, no shareholders or govt to answer to. There is thousands of these companies out there that people have never heard of. The company I'm at has been in business for almost a hundred years. They've had an airplane of some type for the last 40 or so. They went through one of the worst economies since the great depression, laid off around 150 employees but kept their 12 million dollar airplane. Right now it's just me and another guy that make up the "flight department". We get benefits, vacation, 401k etc. If we need a day off we get a contract guy, no questions asked. No pagers or on call, I've been here almost three years and never had less then 3-4 days notice of a pop up trip. Sure my schedule changes a little here and there but no different than getting extend on day four when your trying to make your commute.

To me all sectors of aviation are a crap shoot. You used to get a job at a major and you could call it a career. Those days are long gone, they died with the TWA's, Pan Am's and Western's. if you're over 40 and at a major now like Delta or United you might make it to retirement with out too many issues. But some one getting hired at any major that has 30-35 years worth of flying to do, will end their career in a totally different way then what they thought. Ask all the guys at American that have been furloughed several times since 9-11 how they feel about this awesome merger that just got approved. I guess that's the beauty of flying, there's always going to be a niche out there for every one.
Click to expand...
I feel as if you got lucky. That is the kind of Corporate job that every one dreams about, but very few ever find.
 
PositionAndHold said:
Being privately held is key, no shareholders or govt to answer to.
Click to expand...

Man, I've gotta say, after working for a couple privately held companies, it sure is nice being back at a publicly traded company. You can actually see that your company is making money. I was never sure with the last two; we were told that they were profitable, but without actual profit/loss filings, they could just close up shop overnight and nobody would care.
 
My sense is that nothing at all is "secure" anymore. The only "security" I can see is having a fat logbook full of 135, 91, 121, piston, turboprop, jet, single pilot, crew, glass, steam, and 14 type ratings. And probably eventually working overseas.
 
Pilotforhire587 said:
I feel as if you got lucky. That is the kind of Corporate job that every one dreams about, but very few ever find.
Click to expand...
That's the thing, these jobs are out there. The people that own ten Chevy, Ford, Dodge dealerships, the large sawmill owner, the ones that own 25 fast food franchises, the alcohol distributors and many others like them. Just those alone exist in just about every state. These people are out there and they are the ones that drive the corporate aircraft world. Sure, some can be no fun to work for, but I see plenty of happy guys in and out of fbo's all day. Find your niche and be happy.

When I said privately held earlier, I'm speaking of the types business that I mentioned above, not large 121 supplemental air carriers. I also think whether public or private, there's really no insurance that your company will be around for ever. Heck when we got hired at XJT it was the regional to be at. Two years later, not so much.
 
I don't disagree, but Capitalism is a harsh mistress. I know that guys around here thought they'd hit the lottery when they were hired by Budweiser. Then came Imbev...
 
Boris Badenov said:
I don't disagree, but Capitalism is a harsh mistress. I know that guys around here thought they'd hit the lottery when they were hired by Budweiser. Then came Imbev...
Click to expand...
I guess that's what I'm saying. Aviation is a harsh mistress, heck almost any job is as long as working for some one else. I'm also speaking a little more small scale. Not the Budweiser headquarters flight dept, but the guy who owns the local bud distributorship. Not McDonald's corporate, but the guy that owns 15 in Nebraska. That's the side of corporate flying that people rarely try to focus on. They get blinded by the ExxonMobile's and the Disney's out there. It's all a crap shoot, my job could be gone tomorrow, all of ours could in just about any industry, I'm definitely not blind to that. As I said in another thread, I'm a child of Frank Lorenzo and the role that turd played in my old mans career. I learned then that flying isn't all its cracked up to be, and for some reason I still chose to pursue it. Harsh mistress indeed. :)
 
Life is what it is; some people worry so much about whats coming around the corner they either don't see the bus that hits them or they die of a heart attack. Life too short!
 
jmreii said:
Life is what it is; some people worry so much about whats coming around the corner they either don't see the bus that hits them or they die of a heart attack. Life too short!
Click to expand...

And the solution is to, what, take what comes to you, smile, and live la vida loca? No, thanks. I graduated from high school. Hell, I even graduated from College, shockingly. If you don't plan, you'll eventually be screwed, one way or the other. Harsh but true.
 
Find something you find moderately entertaining to do for work, and interesting enough, then find out how to make a living at it. That's what aviation has taught me thus far. Everything else is ephemeral.
 
DPApilot said:
It's my current goal. If I keep on the right track, with a little luck I'm hoping it'll be attainable. I got my Private on my 17th birthday and hired at a regional when I was 19. If I can get to a major by the time I'm 30 I'd be enthralled, but I'm hoping for around 25.
Click to expand...

That was my goal! I thought it'd be a sure bet for me as a 23 year old new hire, but I've only got 2 months left. Whatev though, just gotta keep on trucking. You've got a better shot I'd imagine.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top