1500TT minimums ?

This 1500-hour rule is simply a failed attempt at fixing a completely broken system. While I agree that you cannot replace experience, if you do not start from the very beginning with good training and required aptitude to be a pilot then you will not see much difference between 500 hours or 2000 hours. If you are trained to be a monkey, you will be a monkey. I also truly believe that there are simply some people who are not made to be pilots, but are hired and employed by airlines simply because a) they paid enough money to skirt by getting their certificates, and b) they are a warm body that will work for the wages offered.

The airline industry doesn't want the best pilots. They want the cheapest pilots. This 1500-hour rule will not do much because the airlines still will not be hiring the best... They'll be hiring the guys who stuck it out long enough as a CFI making even worse money to build that time.

How does the military train excellent, competent pilots to fly high-performance jets with 500-hours or less? How do European airlines put pilots in an Airbus with 300 hours? Training and selection processes.

Some people just shouldn't be pilots. In the system we have now, they can be... Just as long as they have 1500-hours.

I got out because I knew things would never really change. Fatigue rules wouldn't be improved to the level they should be. Selection processes wouldn't be improved. Benefits and wages would continue to erode as pilots fought to stay employed, lowering the bar one rung at a time.
 
IrishSheepdog said:
How does the military train excellent, competent pilots to fly high-performance jets with 500-hours or less? How do European airlines put pilots in an Airbus with 300 hours? Training and selection processes.
Click to expand...

If you could show me a way that the FAA can force the airlines to adopt a Military or European training model, I would support it. But, how exactly do you create an incentive for a private company to spend an exorbitant sum of money for training that will add nothing to the bottom line?

The best we can do is demand that potential airline pilots have a moderate amount of experience by enforcing an arbitrary total time requirement. It's not perfect by a long shot, but it's a start.
 
PeanuckleCRJ said:
Yet were hired with extremely low hours with minimal flying outside of the airline world- particularly the one that held the plane in the stall. Hmmm. ;)
Click to expand...

I can't find any source for that. Help me out?

You keep posting accidents that the 1500 hour rule wouldn't have prevented, but better training would have. Perhaps the concentration should be on better training, rather than the idea that the average 1500 hour CFI has the resume buying power to turn down low-paying jobs.
 
PeanuckleCRJ said:
Nope, your point?
Click to expand...

That being hired with less than 1500 hours had little, if nothing to do with the accident. The captain hired at 4k hours would have been just as likely to do what he did hired with 200 hours. He didn't understand stalls because he wasn't trained well or just wasn't very good.

If you guys want to raise the minimums to fix the industry then feel free to do so.

Don't B.S. us by telling us it's about safety because it's not. Just tell us how it is. You want to raise the minimums so that your paycheck might get bigger due to a "pilot shortage" or whatever the reason may be. It's not safety though.
 
PeanuckleCRJ said:
Yet were hired with extremely low hours with minimal flying outside of the airline world- particularly the one that held the plane in the stall. Hmmm. ;)
Click to expand...

Where are you getting your information? Because it's not factual at all. The FO put the flaps up. She was hired with 1600 hours. How did that happen? OMGZ if she was hired with 1500 hours she would have had more experience and known not to do that!

Oh wait....
 
juxtapilot said:
That being hired with less than 1500 hours had little, if nothing to do with the accident. The captain hired at 4k hours would have been just as likely to do what he did hired with 200 hours. He didn't understand stalls because he wasn't trained well or just wasn't very good.

If you guys want to raise the minimums to fix the industry then feel free to do so.

Don't B.S. us by telling us it's about safety because it's not. Just tell us how it is. You want to raise the minimums so that your paycheck might get bigger due to a "pilot shortage" or whatever the reason may be. It's not safety though.
Click to expand...

Had he actually gotten more real world hours and not have been allowed to pay money to get a shortcut into the industry, perhaps he would have understood stalls more.

The 1500 thing for me is two fold- safety via more experience acquired at point of entry, as well as improving the industry as a whole via a higher minimum point of entry.
 
juxtapilot said:
Where are you getting your information? Because it's not factual at all. The FO put the flaps up. She was hired with 1600 hours. How did that happen? OMGZ if she was hired with 1500 hours she would have had more experience and known not to do that!

Oh wait....
Click to expand...

The flaps really didn't matter at that point. He was hauling back on the stick with 30-40 lbs of force still.
 
PeanuckleCRJ said:
The flaps really didn't matter at that point. He was hauling back on the stick with 30-40 lbs of force still.
Click to expand...

Then why did the FO (hired with more than 1500 hours BTW) think that would help? Why did she not say WTF ARE YOU DOING CAPTAIN PUSH THE DAMN THING FORWARD! It was like she was tired or something. Hmmm...

The fact is there is no information contained in the NTSB report that supports your opinion.

There was an obvious issue with the captain. Hired with 5000 hours or 500 hours do you really think it would have made a difference? Even in his class at GIA he was having issue with BASIC airmanship. My IFR students wouldn't have had these issues.

The captain completed initial training and, in December 2004, began flying the BE-1900
for GIA as a fully qualified first officer. GIA maintained comprehensive training records for the
captain. His training records showed that, even though he completed all entry, training, and
operating phases without a failure, the captain had experienced continuing difficulties with
aircraft control. For example, during simulator periods 3 and 4, the captain was graded
unsatisfactory in “approach to stall – landing configuration,” although he received a satisfactory
grade in later sessions. During simulator period 7, the captain’s altitude and airspeed control was
unacceptable, and comments included, “airspeed more than 10 knots below Vref + 10. Fly
correct airspeed!” “airspeed 10 knots below Vref crossing threshold,” “gear remains up during
entire approach,” and “repeated deviation from altitude 200-300 feet.”
During simulator period 8, the instructor noted, “basic attitude flying cause of repeated
deviations,” “constant deviations up to full scale on glide slope,” and “additional training
required.” All maneuvers were graded satisfactory the next day (by the same instructor as the
day before) during an extra ninth simulator period, and the simulator checkride was completed
that same day.
Click to expand...
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top