Another pilot shortage prediction.

cmhumphr said:
What about said pilots who fly 50 seat turboprops?
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They have the same responsibilities as their jet brethern and require the same basic qualifications, training, and currencies. They shouldn't be making crap wages either.

Remember, America West Airlines used to fly Dash-8-100s, under 50 seats, and flown by mainline pilots. Just because of how it's powered, that doesn't lessen or otherwise minimize the duties and responsibilities of the flightcrew up front, IMO.
 
MikeD said:
I personally think that all depends. There's no "one path" to anywhere, be it airlines, military, law enforcement, firefighting, corporate, agriculture, contracting, etc. Guys have in their minds that there is only one way to get anywhere, and the truth is, there are many ways. Just as there many ways to help one in whichever way they choose.

I understand where your frustration comes from, because that's the mindset people are normally told or have hammered into them: that you HAVE to follow this particular way, or you aren't going to be successful. And that wouldn't be accurate at all.
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Indeed, not that I'm in a position to move onto that "career stop" job yet. I'm coming off as a bish, I know, but it's still frustrating sometimes.
 
MikeD said:
They have the same responsibilities as their jet brethern and require the same basic qualifications, training, and currencies. They shouldn't be making crap wages either.

Remember, America West Airlines used to fly Dash-8-100s, under 50 seats, and flown by mainline pilots. Just because of how it's powered, that doesn't lessen or otherwise minimize the duties and responsibilities of the flightcrew up front, IMO.
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Really? Wow that's amazing. I couldn't imagine a United mainline pilot flying a Dash 8, but I guess that's the state of the industry today.
 
cmhumphr said:
Really? Wow that's amazing. I couldn't imagine a United mainline pilot flying a Dash 8, but I guess that's the state of the industry today.
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Yes, mainline pilots flew the Dash-8-100s on a mainline scale to the destinations within AZ as well as nearby. I rode on their planes a few times, and remember the mainline guys flying the birds. The codeshare contract to Mesa using Beech 1900s didn't happen until the first AWA bankruptcy in 1991, when the mainline-owned Dash-8s were sold. That's when things like the below started popping up:

mesa.jpg
 
I am not sure if Officers get BAH or not, but I know when I first got married as an E-3 I was making 38K including BAH with a dependent and BAS. Followed by a decent pay raise once I made E-4, making over 40K. That was also before all of the deployment money and per diem that was accumulated during my enlistment. Probably will not make that much again for a long time by the sounds of it. My wife loves to hear me talk about our financial future, shows great promise..:bounce:
 
JDean3204 said:
I am not sure if Officers get BAH or not, but I know when I first got married as an E-3 I was making 38K including BAH with a dependent and BAS. Followed by a decent pay raise once I made E-4, making over 40K. That was also before all of the deployment money and per diem that was accumulated during my enlistment. Probably will not make that much again for a long time by the sounds of it. My wife loves to hear me talk about our financial future, shows great promise..:bounce:
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Yes, officers get BAH and BAS is living off base. IIRC, they were also non-taxable. When you add up things like flight pay, tuition assistance, 100% medical coverage, GI Bill, TDY per diem, special pay while TDY suh as family separation and combat zone pay, not to mention tax free benefits when deployed to a combat zone, not to mention 30 paid vacation days each year, Military compensation is not too bad.
 
Ian J said:
A brand new 2nd LT with less than two years of service living in CT with no dependents makes $56,900 a year.
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And gets shot at after four years of college and ocs, and whatever other training needed.

I think guys in the military are beyond underpaid for what they do.

I'll take my regional job :)
 
dasleben said:
$60k isn't terribly hard to make down here either, but you're in a position where you're building multi turbine and won't have a problem finding a decent job down here. It's the guys who say they'll stick around at C206 aerial survey jobs because it pays $30k/year (bragging as if that's good money), who won't progress because their resumes will be full of single-engine piston time.

The regionals suck, the pay sucks, but the experience is good for those who want to continue on and fly jets for better pay later on.
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My post wasn't intended to "brag" about the pay at a 30K p/year survey company. I was trying to highlight that it is at the very least strange that this is one of the few professions that requires this much training and incurs this much responsibility where you start out with a smaller skill-set (survey, diver-driving, traffic watch, instructing, etc...) making more money and go to a job that arguably requires a higher degree of skill and a bigger tool-set (flying around passengers be it in an RJ or a turboprop) to be paid less. And at a time when the minimums to be hired have gone up. Even if it is only the first year or two. It still seems backwards to me. If regionals offer fair wages (or what I think would be fair wages: starting pay in the $35K or so range and second year FO pay around $45K) then they would not have a problem finding pilots to fly for them. But then again I know thats not how the regional business model works. So I don't know if the system is just broke or created itself into the monster that it is today or what...
 
jtrain609 said:
And gets shot at after four years of college and ocs, and whatever other training needed.

I think guys in the military are beyond underpaid for what they do.

I'll take my regional job :)
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That's appreciated. But, and this is an unpopular opinion, after 20 years in I'm of the opinion that military compensation and benefits are fair.
 
I was Enlisted ranks 5 yrs ago. I can say I made more while enlisted (no 4yr college degree either), than I did a with a 4yr college degree and all that experience. I'm in a better pay situation now. But military pay/including tax free benefits ROCKS! :cool:



As for RA pilot jobs and pay... I am hesitant to jump in the pool. I'm hesitant on becoming a CFI also, because it will be a SEVER pay cut! :bang:
 
I don't know. The only "shortage" there is in the airline business are B-school grads in management that have realized that the shortage could be solved overnight with significant financial and lifestyle incentives to pursue aviation.




Sent from my free Obama Phone
 
Scorpio11982 said:
As for RA pilot jobs and pay... I am hesitant to jump in the pool. I'm hesitant on becoming a CFI also, because it will be a SEVER pay cut! :bang:
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I hear ya man. I've had two jobs where the pay was just insane(insanely good) for what it was. Coming to Ameriflight felt stupid financially, but if I can grab a metro/1900 soon, it'll be less of a sting. Going to first year pay at most regionals would feel REALLY dumb. I mean jobs are about the money when it comes down to it, willingly going backwards financially just doesn't jive with a normal thinking mind, but we're pilots, so we're not normal. :)
 
Derg said:
I don't know. The only "shortage" there is in the airline business are B-school grads in management that have realized that the shortage could be solved overnight with significant financial and lifestyle incentives to pursue aviation.




Sent from my free Obama Phone
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But that would mean less bonus money for their B-school buddies. Can't have that...there are Porches to lease and collars to pop.

Richman
 
UAL747400 said:
I hear ya man. I've had two jobs where the pay was just insane(insanely good) for what it was. Coming to Ameriflight felt stupid financially, but if I can grab a metro/1900 soon, it'll be less of a sting. Going to first year pay at most regionals would feel REALLY dumb. I mean jobs are about the money when it comes down to it, willingly going backwards financially just doesn't jive with a normal thinking mind, but we're pilots, so we're not normal. :)
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At my current regional we have a good amount of Amflighters, so I guess they are pretty "dumb" to leave such a great job.
 
DStu said:
At my current regional we have a good amount of Amflighters, so I guess they are pretty "dumb" to leave such a great job.
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Hey, it's a bump in QOL at most places, but financially, I can't do it. My post is in regards to how I personally feel about doing it. YMMV
 
UAL747400 said:
Hey, it's a bump in QOL at most places, but financially, I can't do it. My post is in regards to how I personally feel about doing it. YMMV
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You make the money back pretty quickly.

Unless you're me and you get furloughed as soon as you hit second year pay, which was a pretty awesome experience.

For a lot of people, though, the jump has worked out.
 
jtrain609 said:
You make the money back pretty quickly.

Unless you're me and you get furloughed as soon as you hit second year pay, which was a pretty awesome experience.

For a lot of people, though, the jump has worked out.
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Yeah, that's my main worry. Trust me when I say that I envy the schedule. On the plus side things are pretty stable here, as you probably know. Don't want to be THAT guy, well, you. Haha, just joshing you. :D At the same time, I'm not planning on staying here for more than 2 years. That wouldn't be financially wise either, espeically when there's Air Ambulance operators out there that seem to like AMF guys.

:mad: Given what's in my logbook so far, it still seems like a waste. I know an HR department/hiring panel at a major/national would probably disagree however. Since 121 isn't out of the question for me, that kinda blows.

My attitude is coming off more negative/being a bish than it really is. I'm actually having fun bombing around in POSs, but someday, when all my hair has fallen out from it, I'll be looking elsewhere. Just looking way ahead is all.
 
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