Another pilot shortage prediction.

7700 said:
Well you may not "think that", and a really good CA will use CRM effectively and consider all your recommendations, making any FO feel like and be a valuable member of the cockpit, and that's very important. But once you've sat left seat (not to say you haven't), you fully appreciate the fact that all the decisions ultimately go through one person. Even as a CA in the right seat, one person has to have the final say, both people cannot have Final Authority attitudes
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You're not going to do that whole "When you look left you only see your own reflection" thing are ya? :)

About half of my flight time is still PIC, most of that flying as PIC at a 135. CA has final authority, but the FO (who may be flying at the time) arrives at the scene of the crash at the same time!

And no, I haven't been advocating a 4 stripe FO.
 
HVYMETALDRVR said:
The shortage that's already somewhat here and probably going to get worse is because of pay. Plain and simple. Airlines that pay well aren't having a problem finding pilots, ones don't can and won't retain there pilots. There I said it, simple as that.

They should have changed the name of the one day summit too: How can we convince people to blow $200K on an aviation degree and still be willing to work for Walmart wages?! Because big jets are cool!!!!!!
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Well..... they are!
 
I don't know bout y'all, but I'm really tired of Every Fizzle pushing their propaganda...err, I mean agenda onto the media, public and of course these are the tards that congress listens to.
 
You guys realize not all 135 is freight right?

Most people at my company don't even leave the house to go to work most days. Let alone "home at night". Our pilots start at about 60k.
The only nights that you'd spend away from home are if you happen to have a flight at night. But you'll be home within 3-4 hours.
 
A couple of different points:

I've flown 135 charter, and part 91 corporate as a FO and eventually captain. Now I fly at a regional as a FO. There's not even a comparison to how much less stressful my life is as a somewhat senior (bid 50%) lineholder. I actually have control of my life, which is very, very nice. I'm home WAY more than anybody I know in charter.

The flying is safer in 121 because we have SOPs and very good training. Contrary to what some of you here think, the flying is not without its challenges at times. No, it's not like scud running a beaver in AK. But flying turboprops in and out of the mountains and isolated coastal areas down to mins all day is not something to take lightly. Now I'm flying a RJ at that same company, but there are still quite a few challenging places we fly into. And although I'm not Aspen qualified, we do a lot of that here and you would really have to have your head up your ass to think flying in and out of there 5-10 times/wk is routine.

As far as making decision as a SIC, no it's not at all like the burden one has as PIC. But you still are making some serious decisions, and more importantly helping the Captain formulate his/her decision. There have been MANY times where I have seen a situation they haven't, and they relied heavily upon my opinion. That doesn't mean they were weak, it means they were smart.

Should we get paid more? Hell yes we should. But like Jtrain said, once you get past first year pay it's not that bad. I work at a different airline than him, but I agree that a lineholder on 2nd year pay could EASILY clear $50k if they worked a little extra. There are several FOs year that have cleared $70k or more (but they worked harder than I'm willing to!).

In the end, I felt like flying at a regional was going to take me further than I was just languishing in a very easy but low time building part 91 jet gig. Only time will tell if that thinking was correct, but so far I've been happy with the decision.
 
z987k said:
I go with my gut, and my gut says SEAK 135 VFR is the safest.
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Nope
http://www.nbaa.org/ops/safety/stats/
Twice as safe as 121. BOOM! :) For good measure, a cat failing.
l.php
 
chrisreedrules said:
I could make about 26,000 a year flying a little 172 around for Traffic Watch and about 30,000+ flying aerial survey in a 210. And probably smewhere inbwetween as a CFI. Why would I go fly for a regional for so much less?
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I'm making over 30k on first year pay and that's without working any overtime. It's still low but it's better than 20k.

Disclaimer: The above statement does include per diem which some people don't consider pay but I pack my food and enjoy the tax free money.
 
You can definitely clear 30k at C5 on 2nd year pay, but you would have to max out your credit hours every month.
 
GypsyPilot said:
A couple of different points:

I've flown 135 charter, and part 91 corporate as a FO and eventually captain. Now I fly at a regional as a FO. There's not even a comparison to how much less stressful my life is as a somewhat senior (bid 50%) lineholder. I actually have control of my life, which is very, very nice. I'm home WAY more than anybody I know in charter.

The flying is safer in 121 because we have SOPs and very good training. Contrary to what some of you here think, the flying is not without its challenges at times. No, it's not like scud running a beaver in AK. But flying turboprops in and out of the mountains and isolated coastal areas down to mins all day is not something to take lightly. Now I'm flying a RJ at that same company, but there are still quite a few challenging places we fly into. And although I'm not Aspen qualified, we do a lot of that here and you would really have to have your head up your ass to think flying in and out of there 5-10 times/wk is routine.

As far as making decision as a SIC, no it's not at all like the burden one has as PIC. But you still are making some serious decisions, and more importantly helping the Captain formulate his/her decision. There have been MANY times where I have seen a situation they haven't, and they relied heavily upon my opinion. That doesn't mean they were weak, it means they were smart.

Should we get paid more? Hell yes we should. But like Jtrain said, once you get past first year pay it's not that bad. I work at a different airline than him, but I agree that a lineholder on 2nd year pay could EASILY clear $50k if they worked a little extra. There are several FOs year that have cleared $70k or more (but they worked harder than I'm willing to!).

In the end, I felt like flying at a regional was going to take me further than I was just languishing in a very easy but low time building part 91 jet gig. Only time will tell if that thinking was correct, but so far I've been happy with the decision.
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You actually don't make a whole hell of a lot doing that in SE AK, though you make decent money flying for lodges in South West. That said, I'll do better than $60k this year, and I'm home every night, and I fly a "twin," and we're a very, very safe company (i.e. no scud running, IFR procedures almost everywhere with company procedures for the VFR places we go). Yes there is more risk than say, driving an RJ around, but I'll do better than I've ever done before here, and I'm home every night, and there are benes, a 401K, etc. etc.

Irregardless, I have a very interesting job, I get to see my wife and kid every night, I get paid a very good wage with a salary that grows, and I have weekends off. I wouldn't be able to do that anywhere in the lower 48 for at least several years if at all.
 
ppragman said:
You actually don't make a whole hell of a lot doing that in SE AK, though you make decent money flying for lodges in South West. That said, I'll do better than $60k this year, and I'm home every night, and I fly a "twin," and we're a very, very safe company (i.e. no scud running, IFR procedures almost everywhere with company procedures for the VFR places we go). Yes there is more risk than say, driving an RJ around, but I'll do better than I've ever done before here, and I'm home every night, and there are benes, a 401K, etc. etc.

Irregardless, I have a very interesting job, I get to see my wife and kid every night, I get paid a very good wage with a salary that grows, and I have weekends off. I wouldn't be able to do that anywhere in the lower 48 for at least several years if at all.
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:eek:
 
ppragman said:
You actually don't make a whole hell of a lot doing that in SE AK, though you make decent money flying for lodges in South West. That said, I'll do better than $60k this year, and I'm home every night, and I fly a "twin," and we're a very, very safe company (i.e. no scud running, IFR procedures almost everywhere with company procedures for the VFR places we go). Yes there is more risk than say, driving an RJ around, but I'll do better than I've ever done before here, and I'm home every night, and there are benes, a 401K, etc. etc.

Irregardless, I have a very interesting job, I get to see my wife and kid every night, I get paid a very good wage with a salary that grows, and I have weekends off. I wouldn't be able to do that anywhere in the lower 48 for at least several years if at all.
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That's great man, that's what it's all about! :)
 
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