If you could change a manuver in the PTS?

TwoTwoLeft said:
So, someone who suffers motion sickness shouldn't be able to become a commercial or private pilot?
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Good thought. I have always assumed motion sickness is something you get over. I honestly don't know how you could be a pilot and get motion sick unless you're only going to fly nice vfr days.
 
z987k said:
Good thought. I have always assumed motion sickness is something you get over. I honestly don't know how you could be a pilot and get motion sick unless you're only going to fly nice vfr days.
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I get motion sick from time to time still. I can for the most part tell you what type of days it will be on ahead of time, after checking the weather forecast and planned route of flight. Have I gotten to the point that it isn't as bad as it once was, sure.

99% of the days I feel/get motion sick, are VFR CAVU.
 
If you have motion sickness that you can't get over, that's a medical issue that needs to be addressed. That being said, I wouldn't really change much in the PTS except for in the instrument PTS I would write a note in the Instrument Approach with the Loss of Primary Flight Indicators TASK that addresses glass cockpits, and what constitutes a failure of the primary flight indicators, to specify that the damned G1000 "card" does NOT constitute an instrument failure, as the applicant can still use the "failed" HSI to determine heading for course intercept.
 
PTS should be more on scenario based training, I have seen too many people that are great doing maneuvers but once they are doing something different they can't think out of the box...................
 
z987k said:
Good thought. I have always assumed motion sickness is something you get over.
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You know I've always thought that too. Perhaps the motion sickness question would be a good question for the flight surgeon fourm.

jafra98 said:
PTS should be more on scenario based training, I have seen too many people that are great doing maneuvers but once they are doing something different they can't think out of the box...................
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I can see some maneuvers you can do that with. I believe there is a post somewhere that talked about DPE trying to simulate a take off with high DA with a different power setting. And I know you can devise some scenarios for landings as well. Although what scenarios would you use for a maneuver like say lazy eights?
 
Whatusername said:
You know I've always thought that too. Perhaps the motion sickness question would be a good question for the flight surgeon fourm.



I can see some maneuvers you can do that with. I believe there is a post somewhere that talked about DPE trying to simulate a take off with high DA with a different power setting. And I know you can devise some scenarios for landings as well. Although what scenarios would you use for a maneuver like say lazy eights?
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lazy eights is a great maneuver to demostrate complete mastery of the aircraft, in real life is useless............
 
Whatusername said:
You know I've always thought that too. Perhaps the motion sickness question would be a good question for the flight surgeon fourm.
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Perhaps, and I've never gotten motion sickness, so I don't understand how it feels or exactly what brings it on.. which might be different for individuals. I just think about some of the real crap weather we fly in, down the ils to mins all the while getting thoroughly tossed around like a rag doll. In my mind that would cause motion sickness... IMC + rolling and yawing all over the place, but it's exactly the time you can't afford to have it.
 
jafra98 said:
PTS should be more on scenario based training, I have seen too many people that are great doing maneuvers but once they are doing something different they can't think out of the box...................
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Pretty sure the PTS already encourages the use of scenarios. It's just that many people don't follow that guidance.
 
Whatusername said:
You know I've always thought that too. Perhaps the motion sickness question would be a good question for the flight surgeon fourm.
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Spinning, Rolling or pulling (or pushing) Gs one of the three (or all the above) is usually what gets people. If its one of the three, then they'll usually power through it. If it's all the above, it's more likely they wont.

Some can get over it enough for normal flying. Others just cant keep it together long enough to get any value out of aerobatic instruction. Any experienced aerobatic instructor can work through this to the point so they gain some hands on experience. But to gain proficiency in order to demonstrate a maneuver for a practical test? Highly unlikely.

It would be interesting to see on-heading spin recovery, an immelmann & reverse half cuban in the PTS! Those will give a good indication of the pilots skill and situational awareness and are the three maneuvers I use when doing an aerobatic check out in the Super-D. Depending on how that goes, we do an inverted spin and simulated control failures.
 
TwoTwoLeft said:
Spinning, Rolling or pulling (or pushing) Gs one of the three (or all the above) is usually what gets people. If its one of the three, then they'll usually power through it. If it's all the above, it's more likely they wont.

Some can get over it enough for normal flying. Others just cant keep it together long enough to get any value out of aerobatic instruction. Any experienced aerobatic instructor can work through this to the point so they gain some hands on experience. But to gain proficiency in order to demonstrate a maneuver for a practical test? Highly unlikely.

It would be interesting to see on-heading spin recovery, an immelmann & reverse half cuban in the PTS! Those will give a good indication of the pilots skill and situational awareness and are the three maneuvers I use when doing an aerobatic check out in the Super-D. Depending on how that goes, we do an inverted spin and simulated control failures.
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I'll agree with this post. When I first started flying I threw up on my second flight. Since then I have learned how to control it to the point I can fly an aerobatic routine. For me if i am the one flying I'm ok because I'm the one manipulating the controls so my body knows what to expect. I can't ride along with someone else flying aerobatics though that is like torture. I fly gliders as well and sometimes on really turbulent days my stomach will get upset from the strong updrafts but I can manage for a few hours.
 
I'd incorporate instrument training into the CPL PTS. No reason somebody who's being paid to fly shouldn't be able to fly IFR.
 
Chief Captain said:
I'd incorporate instrument training into the CPL PTS. No reason somebody who's being paid to fly shouldn't be able to fly IFR.
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There is no reason a Commercial pilot should need to have an instrument rating to get paid to do entry level, VFR only flying jobs. As long as passengers arent involved. By passenger, I mean ANY one else aboard the aircraft.... Like a company employed spotter, for example.
 
TwoTwoLeft said:
There no reason a Commercial pilot should need to have an instrument rating to get paid to do entry level, VFR only flying jobs. As long as passengers arent involved. By passenger, I mean ANY one else aboard the aircraft.... Like a company employed spotter, for example.
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I know of a 10,000 HR AG pilot who never got his IR.
 
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