G7 lines
- Thread starter FlySooner9
- Start date
SIUAv8r
RJ Commander
I don't want this to come off as an entitlement post, but it might. What pisses me off about G7 is that I know of a handful of guys that I went to college with that were complete slackers are now at GoJet and are captains. Meanwhile, I went to the "reputable" (we can debate the reputable description of RAH in another thread) carrier and have been slogging away for 5 years with no upgrade and no pay raise in sight. Obviously not all G7 pilots fit my slacker description, it just irks the crap out of me. Also, I have many friends that went to TSA and are downgraded captains and one is even being furloughed for the second time.
jynxyjoe
Queso King
I had that clown in TUP who used to jumpseat on our airline and never tell us. The gate agent and him had some agreement to list him via CASS and then give him a seat in the back. What a jerk. Anyway, one of our brighter captains figured out what he was doing and told him to get his crap and get off his plane. I hauled him around on my airplane once or twice too, kept telling me he was ID90'ing it. Hope him nothing but the worst.
Anyway, that was one quarter of my experience GoJetters so far, haven't found a use for a single one of them yet.
kellwolf
Piece of Trash
Correct me if I'm wrong, but at the time, wasn't there no recip agreement between XJ and GoJets? Therefore, even if he's in CASS, sorry about your luck. That's how it was at 9E up until earlier this year/late last year.
USN88
Well-Known Member
Like Skywest coming into ATL, establishing a pilot base and "taking away" flying from ASA. JetBlue establishing them on the routes that American has once served. Is this what you're trying to get at?
You really think GoJet is the only airline "taking away" flying from other airlines? Really now.
GoJet pilots will upgrade, move on to Delta, Southwest, JetBlue etc.
kellwolf
Piece of Trash
jetBlue starting service on routes that AA used to fly is hardly comparable. Now, if GoJets was flying under the UNITED banner on routes that ASA used to fly for Delta, that might be a bit closer. It's not like AA outsourced their routes to jetBlue, which is what's happening in this case. Yes, they are Delta's routes to distribute as they please. However, it's awfully difficult for some airlines to raise the bar (or even keep it raised) when there are places like GoJets around. I honestly was willing to let it die.....then TSA started furloughing again while GoJets is hiring. To me, that's just plain wrong. They're owned by the same company, yet they're kicking pilots out of one on the street while growing the other. To me, that's just blatant disrespect for the employees. What's wrong with one list where if TSA loses flying those that would be unemployed can bid over to the GoJets (or even Compass) side of the flying? Simply put, management loses the tools they have to play one pilot group off of the other.
Yes, GoJets pilots will upgrade and move on. People in high school will also cheat on tests and graduate, too.
jynxyjoe
Queso King
There was/is no recip agreement. The CASS system (unfortunately) does not take that into account. You are perfectly able to list a clown-wad for the jumpseat through CASS and throw him in the back and the pilots will never know (unless they have the SPIL, which I do not believe we get anymore).
I always ask the gate agent if we have any jumpseaters. I'm not a captain anymore but if it's some CBX guy who we don't have an agreement with I would like to let the CA know early so he can call the CP and get him authorized. If it's a GoJetter it's simply me hiding that fact and opening 9.4.7 at the last minute and saying, "Holy crap, GoJet's isn't on the recip agreeement, ooooehhhhs, nooooessss."
See your missing my point. Competing for flying is one thing, starting an alter ego is another one, esp to screw the pilots. Go talk to someone at TSA 5 years ago and get the full story, they didnt compete to take any flying, they were a backdoor way of getting bigger planes for less pay. But hey, some like things via the backdoor!
USN88
Well-Known Member
TSA pilots, can and have gone over to GoJet. As FO's and as Captains (CQFO). Many just won't do it because they can't let go of the past. I do agree that it is less than ideal watching TSA pilots hit the street and new-hires begin class at GoJet but that has gone on many times before. SkyWest was hiring while ASA was furloughing is a perfect example. ExpressJet furloughed, ASA hired. So on, and so son.
Comparing a GoJet pilot to a cheater is ridiculous. In most cases, the average GoJet pilot didn't even have their pilot's license when the company was created. They didn't aid in the successful of GoJet, they are simply taking a job in an otherwise dire industry. A job, is a job, is a job, is a job. They'll upgrade and move on to Southwest or JetBlue or wherever just like they have. They've cheated what exactly? Novel career move if you ask me.
USN88
Well-Known Member
The issue is with a scope clause Trans States had with American limiting them to 50 seaters. Based on that contract Trans States couldn't fly anything over 50 seats even if it was for another airlines. When United approached them about flying 70 seaters, they created a holding company (TSH) and GoJet. Threw TSA and GoJet under the TSH umbrella and used GoJet to fly the 70 seaters for UAL. The contract that TSA had with management did not prohibit them from making a separate pilot list for Gojet. From what I understand the pilots of TSA were giving the opportunity to join but did not accept because of little to no additional benefits for these bigger planes.
USN88
Well-Known Member
jtrain609
Antisocial Monster
The facts are that GoJet was created as an alter ego carrier to subvert the TSA pilot contract.
While TSA is currently furloughing, GoJet is benefiting from their detriment, even though they are owned by the same company.
They are, in fact, taking over flying that was being covered by ASA. Thankfully, ASA pilots don't work for a less than reputable management group, and those ASA pilots that are "furloughed" will be sent over to the ERJ side of ExpressJet. Hell, as much as it pains me to admit this, Skywest is willing to take some of those ASA pilots (albeit with a loss of seniority and longevity, which is another issue for another day).
I'll give credit that GoJet is, in large part, a lifeboat for a lot of United guys right now. There's something to be said for that, but I still wouldn't recommend anybody go there. ExpressJet is hiring right now, and anybody that's been to a M&G in the last few years knows SOMEBODY from this website that can help to get them an interview. There is almost no reason for somebody to have to go to GoJet when there are better companies hiring right now.
While TSA is currently furloughing, GoJet is benefiting from their detriment, even though they are owned by the same company.
They are, in fact, taking over flying that was being covered by ASA. Thankfully, ASA pilots don't work for a less than reputable management group, and those ASA pilots that are "furloughed" will be sent over to the ERJ side of ExpressJet. Hell, as much as it pains me to admit this, Skywest is willing to take some of those ASA pilots (albeit with a loss of seniority and longevity, which is another issue for another day).
I'll give credit that GoJet is, in large part, a lifeboat for a lot of United guys right now. There's something to be said for that, but I still wouldn't recommend anybody go there. ExpressJet is hiring right now, and anybody that's been to a M&G in the last few years knows SOMEBODY from this website that can help to get them an interview. There is almost no reason for somebody to have to go to GoJet when there are better companies hiring right now.
kellwolf
Piece of Trash
Sure, they were given the opportunity.....at sub par wages and benefits. When they said no, they created an alter-ego carrier, furloughed TSA guys and management had their cake and ate it, too. Why do you think scope clauses for newer regional airlines prevent this from happening now? You seem to have the history right in a nutshell, but your attitude seems to be "Well, that was a while ago." Well, TSA is furloughing again NOW. What is being done to help those pilots? I'm sure the guys on TSA's list would rather have a job, and if GoJets is the place you say it is now, I'm sure they'd have no problem going over there. Are they even given the opportunity, though? Last I heard, Hulas and Co were running the 3 airlines separately. Sure, a TSA guy could go to GoJets, but will he be able to keep his longevity from TSA or is a new hire at GoJets? The way it SHOULD be is the three operate (and minimum) the way Republic does. One contract, one list. If you're displaced, you can hop between certificates. Ideally, it should be the way PinnaColAba is now: you can bid between the certificates and hold what your seniority allows. Unfortunately, that's not the case. So, reality is GoJets is STILL growing at the expense of TSA.
JumpWake
Well-Known Member
Ok. Have you read the accident reports on these accidents? Were you involved in the investigation? Do you know what happened? To presume that in both cases it was pilot error/experience is assinine and short-sighted. So shut your mouth and stop spewing about which you know nothing about.
Maurus
The Great Gazoo
Insurance doesn't always use pilot logic to determine price and experience requirements. What they see are two planes with some bent metal that they had to pay for.
Part of his post may be incorrect but I wouldn't go too crazy.
BobDDuck
Island Bus Driver
I think the point that JumpWake was making is that in BOTH those cases the fault was found in the aircraft (crappy brakes) and not the flight crew.
Gonzo
Well-Known Member
Just keep in mind a little over two months ago Eagle was talking about hiring 750 pilots in 2012 at job fairs. Now it looks like we might furlough more then the 20 guys already on the street.
Yup
No they can interview, they should be given a job without a interview and maybe DOH. As far as not getting a ride to work, just ask porn star Tony how many times my planes jumpseat has been MELed when he needed a ride.
Gonzo
Well-Known Member
All our 145s have the new brakes but in the 135s with the same brakes as TSAs 145s it can cut down on the landing roll by 1000-1500 feet. You can also stop the planes with just TRs if need be.